Who do you trust - in telling your story

[BrownLisa]

With a script in progress, how much of the storyline do you trust with others? For instance, a person (whom I don't know who they know) asked me what my screenplay was about.

I know everybody is not out to steal an idea. I'm sure there are more than a million ideas out there but somehow I'm just paranoid about my one :eek

Always putting it out there for everyone to see!!!

[Salazkin]

Though I prefer to think most people are basically good people, I also think you needn't disclose anything about your story or idea to anyone. You might just say something general like "Oh, it's a contemporary fish-out-of-water dysfunctional family drama" or something similar that is both telling yet harmlessly generic. Or say "It's a work in progress and I make it a practice not to discuss until it's finished."

Although it probably turns out that 98 percent of the time you can "trust" them, the problem is not knowing who the other 2 percent are. Therefore, to be safe, my advice is to take the trust no one approach. When you've completed it, register it, then discuss away, if you wish. My two cents.

[Cyfress]

Lisa,

I have an Urban comedy about two total losers, who by accident, hit a slot machine in AC for 100,000. They then use the money to mislead people into thinking they're big shots, which of course catches up to them later on.

Even if you took that idea and wrote a script about it, it wouldn't be MY SCRIPT.

Understand what I mean?

[AuthoressUnknown]

I wouldn't share too much with others if the script hasn't been completed and copyrighted. Ask a trusted friend for advice if you need a soundboard.

[OkeyDokey]

How will you ever pitch - must less sell - your script if you won't tell people what it's about?

IMHO, fear of idea theft is overblown. Do you want to write someone else's idea? No, of course not. (Unless you're being paid...) Every writer thinks their own ideas are brilliant. It's natural. So why would anyone want to steal someone elses's idea? And even if someone ever did, as Cyfress pointed out above, the final script would be completely different than the one you would write. So what's to worry about?

Get out there and practice talking to other people about your work. Start with a trusted writing group first, if you need to. But you'll never get anywhere keeping it a secret.

[Writing Again]

Fear of theft of an idea is not only overblown, it is not needed to explain some things.

A friend of mine in Australia discussed an idea for a book she is thinking about doing.

Plot, in some fantasy realm a magician casts a spell that brings in four heroes from Earth. One from Japan, one from the U. S. two from other places, I forget where now.

Three days later I log in here and read about someone who is asking for advice on a logline for a script with basically the same scenario.

I can pretty much guarantee you they never spoke to each other, met each other, or swapped ideas with each other.

Yet they both came up with it.

How?

Because ideas are out there and you can't stop people from thinking.

Would the stories have been alike?

No. My Australian friend said they had discarded the idea of a Samurai and of a Cowboy and instead were going to make them "more modern."

How many other people out there are considering basically the same idea?

You can bet someone is going to make a good story out of that, and you can bet someone else is going to scream they were robbed.

[AuthoressUnknown]

Granted that writers come up with similiar concepts all the time but there are those few stellar "ideas" that someone might find worth stealing. Sure it's only one in a million but I don't think it's paranoia to finish up one's draft and register it before getting advice from an unknown entity. It's just safe thinking. Obviously, at some point a writer's going to have to trust someone when his baby goes out or it will just end up being more fodder for the drawer.

If the writer has only "an idea" or the first act, what's the point of having it critiqued? At that stage, all other writers would impose their direction on the spec. INMO, some parts of the screenwriting process should be a writer's personal journey and not a committee effort. That is, unless it's part of a class requirement/workshop or has been sold.

[BrownLisa]

I'm not saying that everybody in Hollywood got there the honest way, and of course the opposite swings true. I guess my main stance on the subject is that whatever idea I come up with, I would like to be the FIRST one to finish the screenplay on it. Sure fifty other people have the same idea, but I want my finished product placed in somebody's hand before somebody else does it.
And maybe even that is impossible, but I peck away at it everyday.

Always putting it out there for everyone to see!!!

[OkeyDokey]

Here's another way to look at it:

You're working on your screenplay, and someone asks you what it's about - give them your logline! A logline is never going to give your whole story away, it's great practice, and it will be very educational. How does the person react? Do they want to know more? Great! (Doesn't mean you have to tell them.) If they don't sound interested, ask them why.

If you condition yourself mentally to be secretive about your work, you'll only have more trouble later on when you'll need to promote it.

My 2 cents...

[pantalone]

go to www.wordplayer.com

click on columns

read #4, Steal this Column

A funny story about someone over-concerned with being ripped off.

[StRogue]

As screenwriters we all have that "perfect" story up our sleeve
that no one else has even considered...or have they?

I saw previews to the movie, "Frequency" and I shouted, "They
stole my movie!" Think of mankind as the Borg and that one
or 'nother has the same thoughts, ideas, storylines as you do.

Learn to express your storylines with passions. Learn to express
your ideas with zest. Convince us that "your" idea is the most
original.

Have no fear of theft, because truth is, someone probably has
thought of the storyline way before you.

Charli

'ain't life a kick'

[pasfreak]

My philosophy:

TRUST NO ONE

It's a pretty brutal one, but necessary if you want to make it in the business. If you have a really unique idea, why go blabbing it to everyone? I have been working on my own soap for 6 and half years, which I will propose in the future. It's my life's work, and to think that someone knows about it and could steal the idea, scares the hell out of me.

Precautions:
1) Don't tell your parents/family. Two bad things with that. They will be so proud of you, you never know if they will let it slip out to everyone they know, what it's about. Plus, they will tell you it's good reguardless of how stupid it is.
2) Do NOT tell friends. Friends are the worst people to trust. One little argument with them, and they go and tell everyone all of your secrets.
3) Watch what you throw away. This is a little obsessive, but I have taken serious precautions when throwing away old drafts of scripts I have written. Buy a shredder, because there's probably a garbage man out there, just waiting to hit it big. (you can tell I'm paranoid)
4) Do not trust the internet and the people on it. There are thousands of people out there, waiting for a sucker to screw over.
5) Don't leave things lying around. You got a little brother or sister? They could go through your stuff and take it to school to show all their friends. You may never get it back.
6) Watch out for computers. There are many reasons. Keep all of your writing files either hand written, printed, or on multiple discs (I do all three). Your computer could crash and you'd never get any of it back. Also if you get a new computer, don't sell your old one. The backup system holds more than you think.
7) Invest in a safe or a locked file cabinet. And come up with a universial password for all documents. And don't pick your birthday, SS#, pet's name, parent's name. Think of something totally unique. Make up a word and put some numbers behind it. Like for instance juttey7335, no one would ever guess it.

You can tell I am completely paranoid, but I take precautions for a reason. Just consider my tips.

[OkeyDokey]

Was that satire?

[pantalone]

Don't write in the open. Someone might have a telescope trained on your work. If you can, write in code.

Do background checks on readers and producers. They might not be who you think they are.

See if you can get a pair of those glasses Rowdy Roddy Piper wore in They Live! Because you never know...

[bottomlesscup]

This is why my first draft is always in street Sanskrit, written in a fun house mirror.

Wait.

Forget I told you that.

[nickj]

I've read lots of pre-production scripts I wish I'd written, but never once heard an idea I wish I'd thought of. It's not the idea, it's the execution. You don't need a great idea to write a great script, and a great idea won't get you very far if you don't have a terrific script to back it up.

[incrediculous]

Pasfreak, writing in pig latin is a little anti-plagerism tactic I picked up a while back. You may want to add that to your standard precautions.

[CT in ATL]

I don't think BrownLisa's being paranoid and here's why:

Twice, I have been sitting on an idea that was picked up for network television...coincidentally, both times by Norman Lear!

It has nothing to do with people "stealing your ideas" - but with being first one to the punch, like Lisa said. And even if my idea doesn't somehow get on Mr. Lear's production slate, I don't want to submit ideas, either through query or pitches and be told, "Sorry, we've already got something like that in development." Even if I've written something *way different* from the other version, no one will look at it. A lot of it will be sheer coincidence to fairly common ideas, but if I'm sitting on a really unusual thing that only I (and, possibly, Norman Lear) could come up with, I'm not going to blab to every Tom, Dick, and Harry about it.

Then, I tell only my friends who do not write/have many connections (I'm the *only* writer they know, etc) and whom I trust. Then I give only my logline, without elaborating to get a quick reaction (is it funny? provocative? would they be curious? etc.), and generally people remember only that you're writing one...but not what it's about. So they won't likely share. I feel pretty safe doing it that way.

[bottomlesscup]

It has nothing to do with people "stealing your ideas" - but with being first one to the punch,

Then what's the point of hiding it? Copyright doesn't work like patents or trademarks. They don't give you exclusive rights to an idea, or even to a particular version of an idea. You have to prove access.

If you and Norman Lear - by sheer coincidence - write scripts that are almost exactly the same, there's no copyright infringment. Even if you registered first.

Now, if you sent your script to Lear, or pitched it to his people or something, then you might have a case. But you'll have to prove access. It's one third of a copyright case : timeline, access, similarity.

Being the first one to write something doesn't give you any legal protections, at least with regards to people innocently writing similar works.

[PeteRodgersuk]

Pasfreak

Your posts really do cheer me up.

Please post one every day so i can start my day with a smile.

My screensaver password is now juttey7335. No-one will ever guess it.

[BrownLisa]

OkeyDokey you give some great tips. I’ll break out of the shell and try out a logline.

Pasfreak, you have totally lost it. Dude, give up the soaps and do some comedy. You could win an award. Now of course I wouldn’t be able to vote because I can’t express myself JUST yet.


Always putting it out there for everyone to see!!!

[pasfreak]

PeteRodgersuk, BrownLisa,

The fact that you thought my post was amusing, is amusing, because I was being totally serious! Pretty pathetic, huh? I actually do all of those things! I'm a person with no life, AKA a writer.

I try to bring a little humor to my posts, and then I get carried away until the words are just seeping from my fingers and pressing the keys for me. I have no control. So, don't be surprised to one day open a topic with only one post (from me) and have it be so long, at the end it says, "continued on page 2." And I'll definitely be posting here a lot. I've got a big mouth and a lot to say.

Oh, and BTW, I am working on a comedy series along with my other projects, but not as much as I probably should.


Garrett

[whistlelock]

Life is risk. plain and simple. Fortune favors the bold and locks only keep honest people honest.

If someone is going to steal your work, no amount of regestering or copywriting or whatever will stop that.

Deal or stop writing with the intention of production/publication.

[PipeWriter]

There are about 3 or 4 people (two I especially seek out) that frequent DD that I always, and I mean ALWAYS talk with about new ideas. How do I know I can trust them? Because when we're done talking, my stories are far better as a result.

[cognomen]

"With a script in progress, how much of the storyline do you trust with others? For instance, a person (whom I don't know who they know) asked me what my screenplay was about.

I know everybody is not out to steal an idea. I'm sure there are more than a million ideas out there but somehow I'm just paranoid about my one."




Scripts get stolen all the time. Understand, most people are honest...but this business revolves around ideas...and ideas are money...and yes you can sue someone for just stealing an idea...but you must have a thorough paper trail. Anyone who tells you that script stealing doesn't happen...or not often...is blowing smoke up your a**...and is trying to marginalize the problem. But remember, this business is also about taking risks...and you have to take them in order to succeed. What do you do? Register your script with the WGA and the LOC...and keep a *thorough* paper trail. If you send a script via snail mail...get a receipt (ask for a certificate of mailing). If you send an e-mail...save a copy...also, save all responses (make sure to get time stamps and IP addresses). Keep a journal...if you talk with someone on the phone...record his/her name in an entry...the time...and a note of what was briefly discussed. I personally know of a very well known producer...that when he goes to meetings at coffee shops, etc...he will write down ideas, etc. on napkins and send them to the WGA. There is always a young attorney out there that will be willing to take you pro bono (if you can't afford the legal fees)...if you have a solid case, etc. Most studios, etc. will want to handle the situation behind closed doors...and you will have to sign an agreement to never discuss the case with anyone. Remember, "doveryay, no proveryay"..."trust, but verify." Einstein also said, "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."

Some interesting articles for you...

www.cnn.com/2003/SHOWBIZ/...l.lawsuit/

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/enter...141720.stm

www.findarticles.com/cf_0...icle.jhtml

news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=...ibe_suit_1

www.gamingreport.com/arti...?sid=10015

www.eonline.com/News/Item...28,00.html

www.courttv.com/trials/amistad/





Finally, you want to be able reveal the basic premise of your story without giving away the unique hook or twist. So...you want to be able to interest them in the story...without letting them know the story...ie, you want them to think they know the story. I hope this makes sense. Good luck.

[Writing Again]

I think of it this way.

I have 27 ideas of which I think 5 are superiour.

If someone has to steal an idea it is becuase they can't think of one themselves. Producers, editors, professionals in the various fields, don't want to steal the ideas, they want to contract the person who can think up the ideas and make them marketable.

People who have lots of good ideas of their own don't have a lot of interest in investing their time in other people's. They want to spend it on their own.

And someone can steal one of my ideas.

That is all they will have.

I will have hundreds more in the coming years. My job is to pick the ones that will succeed.

[Dr Hemmingstone]

Don't trust anyone PERIOD!

Write your script and let that do all of your talking, anything else leaves you in the position of getting FU$%ED, and that is just stupid, unless you would rather talk than write, then open wide!

[BrownLisa]

Ohhh yeah, that would work great in my dialog…


JOHN
Karl, what’s up my brotha?

&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp KARL
What can I say dog, it ain’t
nothing.

Karl does the soul handshake with John.

&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp JOHN&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp
I need help on this
screenplay I just whipped up.
(hands screenplay to Karl)
I ain't tryin' to have nobody
steal my ideas, so read it
and tell me how much I can say
without really saying too much.

&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp KARL
Me? Hell I ain’t trying to give up
no secrets of yours. This ain’t
the job for me.

&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp JOHN
Dog, if it ain't you, whom do you trust?


GRuss, there is a time and place for everything.
Expand beyond the title!

Always putting it out there for everyone to see!!

[Billy Reubin]

I've finished it. I've rewritten it four times. I've reread it three. I think I'm finished....but I want someone to proofread it.

Copyright and register first?

If so, is every change you make presumed covered by the copyright and registration?

[JoeNYC]

This topic has come up in the past and I see by some members' comments, such as Cyfress and Okey Dokey's, they didn't believe my past points were valid, so I'll repost some of them and maybe the new members will see if I make sense or not.

Cyfress says, "Even if you took that idea and wrote a script about it, it wouldn't be MY SCRIPT. Understand what I mean?"

-- Yes, the execution wouldn't be the same, but the concept will be.

UNDERSTAND WHAT I MEAN?

Cyfress and others are taking a big leap of faith that nobody out there can execute their concept well enough to get it sold and produced before their version.

Do you think a studio would spend millions on a similar concept if they know another studio is a head of them in development and are on track to getting it to the public before them?

Releasing two movies with the same concept ("Armageddon" and "Deep Impact") has happened in the past, but it's rare.

Legitimate entertainment companies aren't in the business to rip off writer's ideas, but nobody can deny that there are unscrupulous produces, writers, etc. out there who will take advantaged of a situation.

It's a fact that theft has happened in the past.

When submitting REQUESTED scripts and pitches to agents and producers, there's a paper trail to prove who had access to your material.

What a writer needs to be weary about is exposing his or her concept in a public forum to a nameless and faceless crowd.

Members always say don't worry about it. It comes down to the execution. The execution will be different than yours.

Well yeah, the execution will be different, but not the concept. The concept will be the same.

For example, say a non-pro posts a hypothetical logline on a message board for the concept of "Liar Liar."

Another writer sees that and right away characters, structure, plot explodes from his brain and decides to write the story. He submits it to a producer. The producer loves it and gets Jim Carrey attached.

The original writer submits his version, but it's learned another studio with Jim Carrey attached is well a head of them in getting it released to the public.

Do you believe another studio will spend millions in developing and marketing a similar concept that's already been released?

Members say there are similar ideas floating around out there being thought of and written by other writers. It comes down to who has the better execution.

I'm not talking about the generic concept that's been done over and over, but in different ways.

I'm talking about a writer who has such a unique and compelling idea that when one hears it they react with a -- WOW!

In my four years as a member at DD, I've found that out of all the concepts that have been posted and talked about here, only two made me go -- WOW!

I wasn't the only one that raved about one members' concept. In fact, the concept was so unique and compelling others advised him to delete it from the message board, which he did.

I have a lot of great ideas that I want to write the story to, but after seeing this member's concept I wanted so badly to drop everything to write the story to that concept, but I respected the spirit of the site and didn't proceed.

Do you honestly believe that out of 6,000 members that browse through this site all of them will have the proper morality not to proceed if a kick ass idea resonates with them?

And for there being similar ideas floating around, I've never read in the trades, from pros, or seen in workshops from non-pros that someone is developing something similar to these two concepts, or seen it produced and put up on the big or small screen yet.

If you disclose your idea in an open public forum, and another writer sees it and says, "What a great idea" and writes it and gets it produced before you, you can't take any action and scream plagiarism because of the potential of independent creation.

If a writer has a unique and compelling concept, he or she should be very wary about posting it on a public forum.

Some members always love to scream I'm being paranoid. If you want to call it paranoia, then so be it, but it just makes sense to me to keep a unique and compelling concept under wraps until it's completed, copyrighted and ready for the marketplace.

The problem is every writer thinks they have a unique and compelling idea when it's only generic or derivative. Also, a non-pro needs feedback.

This is what I suggest: If the writer doesn't have any experienced writer friends or any private writer groups available to them, then once the script is completed, meaning more than one draft, copyright it and then workshop the logline and story in public workshops such as, DD and Zoetrope.

This way, if anyone fancies your concept, you'll have a head start to get your version into the marketplace first.

[Lulu1000]

Yay, Gruss!

Winter, you beat me to it.

There's another reason to keep your projects close to your vest -- that old theory about letting the steam out of the kettle. Keep your energy and enthusiasm for telling the story for the hours when it's just you and your pages. Don't dissipate your passion by sharing it with others before you've captured it in your writing. Your writing should be how you're telling it, not conversation. If you've just told the story to someone, when you next sit down to write, you might feel like you've already told the story, and you'd be right.

Also, if someone says they think your idea isn't interesting, are you going to defend it? Why? Your writing is all the proof and defense you need. Or are you going to abandon the project, just because someone tells you the idea is boring and stupid?

Billy, register the copyright on your 1st draft. Small changes won't make much difference. When you re-structure, create new characters, change the story, etc., you can re-register it -- not as a new work, but as an update or re-write of your 1st. The copyright form has a category for that.

[xtz]

If someone asks what your screenplay is about you could just...

- give the genre... its a romantic comedy... or whatever.

- lie... its about a stomach-eating vampire who devours nosy people's innards whenever they ask someone a SECOND uncomfortable question.

- Or say you don't want to say - I don't see why anyone should have a problem with that. You're not obliged to tell anyone about your script.

[JoeNYC]

I don't want anyone to take my post in the wrong way.

A non-pro striving to break into the business needs to take calculated risks with his or her material.

The key word is "calculated."

My post is about writers who feel, or others have told them that they have a unique and compelling concept that they should be wary about broadcasting it in a public forum.

This doesn't mean to be so paranoid you're afraid to tell anyone about your concept. A writer needs to let the professionals in the business know what he or she has.

If a writer crosses paths with a professional in the business, say at a party, and the conversation comes around to where he asks about what you're working on, or what's your best concept, tell him. If it resonates with him, he may ask you to send the script to his office.

The risk of this person stealing your idea, especially when you know his name and the details of the chance meeting, is slim.

All it takes is for one professional in the business who loves what you have and gets behind it for a writer to break in.

No, there's no need to broadcast your idea on an open public forum unless you know it's a generic idea and you need feedback to hone your pitch.

Yes, non-pros need to take calculated risks and not be paranoid about their concept. Do go to seminars, pitch festivals, etc. where there are professionals willing to hear one's concept and don't be afraid about someone stealing your idea.

Remember, it only takes one professional in the industry who's willing to put their reputation on the line for you and you're in, but this can't happen unless you get out there and make contacts.