Most disturbing movie

[Tape]

Old Boy

It is only movie that i have actually hoped that protagonist won't suffer anymore. I think it is a masterpiece but it really make feel pain for poor guy...

Tape

[refriedwhiskey]

I've locked up all my claw hammers.

[Pen Dragon]

Ilsa: She Wolf of the SS

[Tape]

I actually enjoyed watching Ilsa. I have great perversion to WW2 movies so it just were great... Hot bath looked interesting...

[NiteScribe]

Any movie that features Frank Stallone.

[whitenavel]

Irreversible (but i loved it).

[TDWoj]

The Wannsee Conference.

[iembalm]

The Ilsa chatter reminds me of Ilsa: Harem Girl of the Oil Sheiks, which I saw about fifteen years ago in Santa Cruz. There's a scene where a woman who has been auctioned off has her teeth removed with a pair of pliers (so as to be better at fellatio, I guess). All of the men in the room start to laugh at her as she stands there with blood dripping from her mouth. Then she starts to laugh too, so as to prolong her life a little longer. I was disturbed.

[Pencey]

Audition

[AaronB]

Marathon Man.

[refriedwhiskey]

Is it safe?

[TDWoj]

Made the mistake of having a dentist appointment the day after I saw Marathon Man... and found out the dentist had just seen it, too.

Ow.

Another disturbing movie: The Boys from Brazil.

[SethMace]

Oldboys and Audition are certainly super disturbing in my book.

[wcmartell]

Anything with The Olson Twins.

[sasqits]

High Tension - made me feel like a kid again, a time whem many things were disturbing.

Irreversible - disturbing, pornographic, but still very satisfying.

Both are French films. Curious?

Crash - the other one, released about ten years ago.

[Frankclone]

Sweet Movie ( director: Dusan Makajev)

[Biohazard]

High Tension - made me feel like a kid again, a time whem many things were disturbing.

I saw it in the theater and there were some parts where I didn't feel too comfortable, but I think that was the whole idea. It's not a masterpiece by any means (the Identity/Secret Window/5 other random movies ending really sucked and was unnecessary), but it's still perhaps the best horror film of the past 5 years.

[Signal30]

Cannibal Holocaust: Once you get past the amateurish acting, easily the most grueling film that I’ve seen. An expedition heads to the Amazon in search of a documentary crew that disappeared earlier. They come across a cannibal village and find only the unexposed reel of films to explain their colleagues’ fate. What follows is some seriously queasy-making stuff as they review the film stock, a mode of narrative that obviously inspired The Blair Witch Project. WARNING: the film contains images of animals being slaughtered. Not faked.

[RBoss]

Peter Jackson's Bad Taste

Though that may be more head-scratchingly ridiculous.

[roscoegino]

Requiem of a Dream. Well done, but I only need to see it once, thank you.

[BottomlessCup]

Requiem of a Dream. Well done, but I only need to see it once, thank you.

In my top five, but I agree. Terribly disturbing. One of the most beautiful actresses in the world in possibly the most explicit sex scene in history - and it makes you want to vomit.

Because of this film, I will never write a movie about drugs. You can't top this one.

(Which reminds me, when is lazy-ass Aronofsky going to put something out?)

[dgrunert]

Bottomless - Arronofsky has The Fountain coming out somtime next year.

As for disturbing flicks, I'd second Cronenberg's Crash . What a weird, messed up movie!

And as for the most disturbing film to gross $100 mil, I'd like to mention Seven . I popped in the DVD again last week, and man, this sucker's twisted. People may forget, because it's got Brad Pitt, Morgan Freeman and Gwyneth Paltrow in it, but there are some truly eff-ed up moments in this flick. It still holds up today.

[roscoegino]

Arronofsky. Yeah, the guy has the goods. Scorscese disciple, I'm sure.

Honorable mention: Pink Flamingos. Waters said he was high when he wrote it, and who's to doubt him?

[willwriteforfood]

Sybil always has and always will completely make me uncomfortable. Sally Field is amazing in it.

[captain bligh]

straw dogs.

[Kwvillen]

Deliverance

Edited to add: Glitter was even more disturbing.

KWV

[Hicks]

The Wiggles - Wiggly Safari.

[Deus Ex Machine]

Misery.

Closet Land.

Death and the Maiden.

[Willoughby]

I'm still a little uncomfortable with Un Chien Andalou.

[billythrilly7]

Aren't we all?

[Hicks]

Un Chien Andalou is a piece of sh(i)t. It's not enjoyable, informative or eductaional. It's a couple of jerks jerking off with a camera.

[billythrilly7]

I have no doubt that you are correct in your assessment.

[j over]

but it's still perhaps the best horror film of the past 5 years.
I respectfully but 100% completely disagree.

[j over]

WARNING: the film contains images of animals being slaughtered. Not faked.
That's beyond disgustingly wrong and makes me hardly consider that a movie.

[kintnerboy]

I would second the previously mentioned Requim For A Dream, and add Henry:Portrait Of A Serial Killer and Paradise Lost (documentary).

[Zarakow]

Many already mentioned, but here are two more...

Salò o le 120 giornate di Sodoma

Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance

/H

[Tape]

Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance and OldBoy. I can't wait to see Chan-Wook Parks third movie in his vengeance trilogy, Sympathy for Lady Vengeance. It must belong to this list also...

I noticed that they are making remake of OldBoy... Directed by guy i haven't ever heard and he has directed movies like:
# The Fast and the Furious: Tokyo Drift (2006) (filming)
# Annapolis (2006) (completed)
# Spotlighting (2005)
# Better Luck Tomorrow (2002)
# Crossover (2000)
# Shopping for Fangs

WHY??

It just really cant be anything near than original...

[Kel]

For me it was the documentary BROTHER'S KEEPER.

I didn't sleep that night.

k

[Biohazard]

I would second the previously mentioned Requim For A Dream.

That wasn't disturbing, that just sucked.

[AaronB]

That's beyond disgustingly wrong and makes me hardly consider that a movie.

Well, you know, animals are slaughtered by the thousands every day while the cameras aren't rolling.

Which is it that makes it wrong to you? The slaughter, or the fact that it's filmed?

Please note that I'm not arguing or disagreeing with you...I'm just trying to better understand your perspective.

[kintnerboy]

That wasn't disturbing, that just sucked.

Sorry, but I'll have to rebutt this.

The drug scenes are far more realistic and disturbing than anything I've ever seen (including The Bad Lieutenant, another film that belongs on this list).

The sex scenes, especially the famous 'Ass to ass' moment, are sickening (and I've seen Salo).

Six-time Academy Award nominee Ellen Bursten has never been better than in this (except maybe Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore).

This movie is like a punch in the gut.

[whitenavel]

Requiem was brilliant. And original.
Not a copy of a previous film.

[FURIOUS BOWLER]

TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE 2.

Where Leatherface cuts off the guy's face, then leaves the room and the man is still alive.

(shudder)

[Erehwon]

Requiem for a Dream was probably one of the most disturbing films I've seen in quite some time, and no way did it suck. It's also one of the greatest scripts I've ever read.

Anyone who says it sucked is just missing the point.

Definitely Bad Lt., too.

There's a kinda obscure Irish serial killer film called "Scream Bloody Murder" that is also very disturbing, though the film itself is pretty bad. Oh, and Cannibal Feroux is WAY disturbing.

I didn't read the thread, but someone mentioned Pink Flamingos, right?

[BottomlessCup]

I'll bet "Thirteen" is pretty disturbing, if you've got a daughter.

"No panties. No bra. No panties. No bra. No panties. No bra."

Sheesh. Some nightmares on that one, I'll wager.

[Erehwon]

What was that other one? "Kids"? I don't remember the title, but it was way disturbing.

[billythrilly7]

I'll have to rent that Thirteen one.

[BottomlessCup]

What was that other one? "Kids"? I don't remember the title, but it was way disturbing.

Can't believe I forgot that one. That kid Telly was the scariest character in decades.

[wcmartell]

Though it's not as disturbing as the Olson Twins films, it has some gross stuff in it.

The first film in the trilogy I saw as a feature overseas - DUMPLINGS. It's about eating aborted babies - and they show it.

Oddly, the last short in the trilogy, THE BOX, was the most haunting. It had little girls who could contort themselves so that they for into really little boxes, which were then *locked shut*. Then there's a fire and only one of the little girls survives... maybe.

Now, if the Olson Twins had played those little girls...

- Bill

[wcmartell]

Requiem was brilliant. And original.
Not a copy of a previous film.

Same source material writer, same gang-bang scene:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097714/
sort of.

- Bill

[PNChheda]

8 mm

[Erehwon]

there's a movie that I thought was very disturbing, AT THE TIME, but I wonder if i would think so now. Hardcore, with THE GREAT George C. Scott, script by Paul Schrader.

I need to netflix this again.

[refriedwhiskey]

I saw Hardcore for the first time a few years ago, and it was pretty pretty disturbing. Yeah.

The foot chase through the porno sets was cool, though.

[rumely]

I found the Care Bear's Movie greatly disturbing. I don't know why. Same with Pee Wee's Big Adventure...maybe I have issues.

There was a time when I thought Silence of the Lambs was disturbing, but then I embraced the evil side.

R.

[Salazkin]

Same source material writer, same gang-bang scene:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097714/
sort of.

- BillGood call, Bill. Last Exit to Brooklyn had this gangbang scene where the guys were lined up virtually around the block waiting their turn. Pretty unsettling stuff.

Requiem for a Dream was awesome. And it was disturbing, though I personally find much of the material from the horror genre far more disturbing.

[Biohazard]

It's also one of the greatest scripts I've ever read.

What was the other script you read?

Seriously, I thought it was an awful film. Two seperate stories that are not connected at all excet that the characters know each other. Realistioc drug scenes don't make a good movie, expecially with all the quick-cutting of the drug scenes that we saw about a billion times throughout the film. The one characters goal is to get high and the other's is to be on tv. Explain why I should give a sh-t about either one.

Punch to the gut? More like a weak sneeze that didn't even hit me. This film is the personification of the word 'overrated'.

[Pencey]

What was the other script you read?

Seriously, I thought it was an awful film. Two seperate stories that are not connected at all excet that the characters know each other.


The stories in Requiem are held together by the common theme of "addiction" just as the stories in Magnolia were held together by the theme of "redemption." I'm guessing you probably hated the latter too...

[Biohazard]

The stories in Requiem are held together by the common theme of "addiction" just as the stories in Magnolia were held together by the theme of "redemption." I'm guessing you probably hated the latter too...

I didn't "hate" Magnolia, but it sure as hell doesn't have a real plot.

[refriedwhiskey]

:rolling:

[BottomlessCup]

expecially with all the quick-cutting of the drug scenes that we saw about a billion times throughout the film.

People doing a self-destructive behavior over and over again? Jeez, I wonder how that might be a visual motif on addiction...

[Biohazard]

People doing a self-destructive behavior over and over again? Jeez, I wonder how that might be a visual motif on addiction...

Saw it a few too many times and it just became monotonous and kept the film from maintaining a steady pace.

I really found nothing about this movie disturbing. I saw it as a movie rather than something that can actually happen. I know deep down inside that those things happen every day, but the over-stylization of the film made it seem more like a ficticious event than something that is happening to real people. It was more like a music video than a movie, and I do not respect that. It's presentation is simply awful.

[Mickster]

The stories in Requiem are held together by the common theme of "addiction" just as the stories in Magnolia were held together by the theme of "redemption." I'm guessing you probably hated the latter too...

Magnolia, yeuch. Emperor's new clothes syndrome. Trivia masquerading as high art. "Respect the **** blah blah blah". As for the treatment of frogs at the end that was pretty disturbing.

[Mickster]

The Visitor is a low budget Japanese flick which is pretty sordid. * WARNING PLOT SPOILERS * features a guy researching for a documentary into the sex industry who discovers that his daughter is a sex worker in a brothel. He takes his research to another level.
He gets attacked by a stranger who hits him over the head so he invites the guy to his house where his teenage son regularly attacks his mother. The guy continues with his research and the visitor sexes up the drug addict mother who squirts breast milk everywhere. The main guy ends up watching his son get beaten up by bullies, kills a woman whose body he then has sex with. His wife discovers him in flagrante delicto and this leads to a reconciliation between them.
The only thing it had going for it was that it was different.

[j over]

Which is it that makes it wrong to you? The slaughter, or the fact that it's filmed?

Both, but my point was the fact that they included real animal slaughter in the "movie" is beyond disgusting and really disqualifies it as an actual movie in my opinion. Movies are an art form and medium in which reality is either explored, bent or taken away, but never shown. If footage of animals being murdered is included in some documentary, while still gross that may make some sense depending on the subject matter. But to be included in a movie is twisted, sick and completely wrong (again, in my opinion).

[Tape]

The Visitor is a low budget Japanese flick which is pretty sordid. * WARNING PLOT SPOILERS * features a guy researching for a documentary into the sex industry who discovers that his daughter is a sex worker in a brothel. He takes his research to another level.
He gets attacked by a stranger who hits him over the head so he invites the guy to his house where his teenage son regularly attacks his mother. The guy continues with his research and the visitor sexes up the drug addict mother who squirts breast milk everywhere. The main guy ends up watching his son get beaten up by bullies, kills a woman whose body he then has sex with. His wife discovers him in flagrante delicto and this leads to a reconciliation between them.
The only thing it had going for it was that it was different.

Sounds very much like Takashi Miikes movie... I think all of his films are in some way disturbing, especially Ichi the Killer...

Strange people those japanese...

[AaronB]

Both, but my point was the fact that they included real animal slaughter in the "movie" is beyond disgusting and really disqualifies it as an actual movie in my opinion. Movies are an art form and medium in which reality is either explored, bent or taken away, but never shown. If footage of animals being murdered is included in some documentary, while still gross that may make some sense depending on the subject matter. But to be included in a movie is twisted, sick and completely wrong (again, in my opinion).

Well, I understand that you find it personally distasteful in the extreme. I was just hoping that you could explain in a rather more articulate way exactly why it offended your moral sense. Your statement that "movies are an art form and medium in which reality is either explored, bent or taken away, but never shown" is an argument from theory, not a moral judgment.

I suspect...and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong...that you see the slaughter of the animals as violent and cruel, and that you equate the filming of such slaughter as the equivalent of voyeurism, perhaps rising to the level of a snuff film. Perhaps that you think the film panders to the base human lust for violence and death...that it functions as eye candy for the perverse few (or many, maybe) who get off on seeing animals die.

[refriedwhiskey]

Movies are an art form and medium in which reality is either explored, bent or taken away, but never shown.
That's great for the Star Wars flicks, but have you ever seen a documentary? Or a cinema verité-type film?

How do you feel about Apocalypse Now?

[Pandoraisme]

Happiness was pretty disturbing.

[Salazkin]

Happiness was pretty disturbing.Excellent call, Pan. Funny how two of the most disturbing to my mind bore hugely ironic titles:

Happiness
The Celebration

[dgrunert]

Did anybody mention the French flick Man Bites Dog? It's a slow go punctuated by moments of cruelty and violence that just gets under your skin. The first time I watched it, the film made me sick to my stomach. The second time... well, I think I appreciated it more, but it still got to me.

[vanpet]

Did anybody mention the French flick Man Bites Dog? It's a slow go punctuated by moments of cruelty and violence that just gets under your skin. The first time I watched it, the film made me sick to my stomach. The second time... well, I think I appreciated it more, but it still got to me.

Man Bites Dog is a Belgian movie :p:D yeah Belgium rocks!

In Belgium, where the lead actor ("Ben" aka Benoit Poelvoorde) is a very well known comedy actor (and he's even known in France because he's so good :cool:) the movie Man Bites Dog is considered as a comedy more than a disturbing movie. In filmschool you should hear the students singing "cinemaaaa! cinemaaa!" when doing a movie, it's funny :o

everybody quotes this movie all the time, in everyday life.

[Erehwon]

The one characters goal is to get high and the other's is to be on tv. Explain why I should give a sh-t about either one.



You obviously have not one iota of ability to understand character, at all. If thats all you saw in that film, then you're way behind the curve, pal. I'm not saying you have to like it, but jeez... it went way over your head. Stick to more "easy" fair, okay? Maybe cartoons. The depth of Bugs and The Road Runner is probably more your speed.

[Erehwon]

Sounds very much like Takashi Miikes movie... I think all of his films are in some way disturbing, especially Ichi the Killer...

Strange people those japanese...


Yeah, THe Vistor! Man, that was some crazy s h i t. The milking mommy scene was some disturbing stuff, for sure.

[Tape]

I watched Miikes Shinjuku Triad Society as my first "Miike" movie. I didn't knew what to expect so this next scene was very strange, i cant see that happen in Hollywood movie...

Two cops were interrogating bad guy who didn't talk. They took him in gym and smaller police threw bad guy to floor with some judomove. Then he ripped his pants and stucked his c*ck in bad guys a*s. Cops asked again but man didn't answer. Then smaller cop started to pull himself off from bad guy when he screamed something like "i tell everything if you dont take it out!!"

I cant see someone like Denzel "Alonzo" Washington raping some thug while iEthan Hawke is interrogating... I just cant.

Like i said, they are very strange people those japanese. Maybe something in that raw fish...

[Biohazard]

You obviously have not one iota of ability to understand character, at all. If thats all you saw in that film, then you're way behind the curve, pal. I'm not saying you have to like it, but jeez... it went way over your head. Stick to more "easy" fair, okay? Maybe cartoons. The depth of Bugs and The Road Runner is probably more your speed.

Ok then...enlighten me.

[velysai]

I was going to say "Kids", but someone beat me to it.

Also, "Battle Royale" is pretty disturbing.

[Erehwon]

Ok then...enlighten me.


Why should I? It's not my job. Read some damn books before you start pontificating about things you know nothing about, or fail to comprehend.

[TDWoj]

Two movies I saw on a double-bill at the Toronto Film Festival back in 1983 were Merry Christmas, Mr. Laurence and Streamers. One, or the other, on its own is pretty disturbing, but both on the same bill left me feeling like I'd been hit by a truck - several times.

[Biohazard]

Why should I? It's not my job. Read some damn books before you start pontificating about things you know nothing about, or fail to comprehend.

Nice cop out. Didn't see that one coming.

[NoTalentAssClown]

Salo: 120 Days of Sodom. I can't see how anyone who's seen this film could disagree.

[Erehwon]

Nice cop out. Didn't see that one coming.


lol, it's not a cop out. You're trying to bait me. Why should I bother? You really gonna honestly say I opened your eyes to something? Yeah, right. I may have been born yesterday, but I've been up all night, as they say.

[Pipe]

Saving Private Ryan. Most of the movie was okay.

But... okay. The scene near the end when the german soldier fought with the American and ended on top, slowly pushing the knife into his chest while staring him in the eyes as the life drained away. Very disturbing.

[yvonnjanae]

I just saw a movie on IFC called something like "Charming Billy." No question, the most disturbing I have ever seen. It was about some weirdo who climbs atop a water tower and starts killing everyone in sight. Very, very graphic. I kept watching, trying to see if they were going to present a point. It never came and I had to bail out because my stomach was getting quesy. It then occurred to me that the movie kind of represents a problem I have with a lot of contemporary film: There is so much ugliness for ugliness' sake. Nothing more. Just becaue filmmakers can use special effects to make death as realistic as possible, they flood their works with the stuff and it ultimately pushes out any moral, theme, plot ...

[Twofingeredtypist]

I'll add another vote for CANNIBAL HOLOCAUST. Once seen, never forgotten. And makes for interesting discussion.

[Tape]

The scene near the end when the german soldier fought with the American and ended on top, slowly pushing the knife into his chest while staring him in the eyes as the life drained away. Very disturbing.

I must say about that scene, it was very powerfull and emotional. I mean, i think most of people felt like you, me being one of them. So it means that makers have done it right.

Has someone read SPR.s script? was it as powerfull emotinally in it as it was in movie?

They were asking one of Germanys most popular actor, Til Shcweiger to do part. He declined because he feared that the role would typecast him in Usa as a bad guy. Then he couldn't build his career further...
It seems like he was right...

[Jazzcat]

Irreversible
Requiem For A Dream
Happiness
Clean, Shaven
Closet Land

[Biohazard]

lol, it's not a cop out. You're trying to bait me. Why should I bother? You really gonna honestly say I opened your eyes to something? Yeah, right. I may have been born yesterday, but I've been up all night, as they say.

Trying to bait a man who says he knows the answer into giving me that answer. Doesn't sound like much of a trap to me. So there must be a reason why you're afraid to tell me. Perhaps you don't really know as much as you claim? Your refusal to continue having an intelligent conversation is leading me to believe this.

[Erehwon]

Trying to bait a man who says he knows the answer into giving me that answer. Doesn't sound like much of a trap to me. So there must be a reason why you're afraid to tell me. Perhaps you don't really know as much as you claim? Your refusal to continue having an intelligent conversation is leading me to believe this.


Like you EVER wanted to have an intelligent conversation on this. You're just pissed because I called you on your views, such as they are, and now won't continue the game, is all.

Why don't YOU tell ME how much you know, since you're always so sure of yourself? You seem to have such strong views, so go on... explain to me the weakeness in the characters in Requiem For A Dream, a movie you truly seem to hate.

[Biohazard]

explain to me the weakeness in the characters in Requiem For A Dream

I'll do this as long as I get some assurance that you will give me your views as well instead of just backing out with a childish "you're wrong".

Of the many, many things wrong with that movie, you want me to comment on the characters? Ok, no problem. I didn't give two f-cks about a damn one of them. The mother is an old lady who basically has no life and sits on the sidewalk with a bunch of other old ladies (if that's not thrilling, what is?). Then she gets the brilliant idea that she's going to be on tv but needs lose weight to fit into her favorite red dress. So she screws up what insignificant life she has by getting hooked on diet pills in a seemingly unrealistic fashion. She she has delusions of a monster living in the fridge or whatever. I find none of this fascinating on any level at all. I simply don't care and I believe that this is because I was given no reason. Let the hag screw herself up for all I care. What positive qualities does she possess that would appeal to me and cause me to relate to her? Same thing goes for her son. And if I want to see Jennifer Connelly drive her life into the ground, I'd just watch the far superior film House of Sand and Fog. The story, acting, cinematography, directing, writing, etc. is all leagues ahead of Requiem.

There you go. Not one of the characters possess a positive trait that I can relate to and that makes me care for them. That's why I feel the characters are very uninteresting.

[kintnerboy]

I'll do this as long as I get some assurance that you will give me your views as well instead of just backing out with a childish "you're wrong".

Of the many, many things wrong with that movie, you want me to comment on the characters? Ok, no problem. I didn't give two f-cks about a damn one of them. The mother is an old lady who basically has no life and sits on the sidewalk with a bunch of other old ladies (if that's not thrilling, what is?). Then she gets the brilliant idea that she's going to be on tv but needs lose weight to fit into her favorite red dress. So she screws up what insignificant life she has by getting hooked on diet pills in a seemingly unrealistic fashion. She she has delusions of a monster living in the fridge or whatever. I find none of this fascinating on any level at all. I simply don't care and I believe that this is because I was given no reason. Let the hag screw herself up for all I care. What positive qualities does she possess that would appeal to me and cause me to relate to her? Same thing goes for her son. And if I want to see Jennifer Connelly drive her life into the ground, I'd just watch the far superior film House of Sand and Fog. The story, acting, cinematography, directing, writing, etc. is all leagues ahead of Requiem.

There you go. Not one of the characters possess a positive trait that I can relate to and that makes me care for them. That's why I feel the characters are very uninteresting.


I don't think this argument holds any water. You might as well say Taxi Driver is a horrible film. Or One flew Over The Cuckoos Nest. I mean, both of those film's protagonists are just jerks who get what they deserve. I personally didn't care about either of them, so the films must stink.

I feel sorry for any writer who feels they have to spoon-feed more likeable characters to satisfy a mass audience. It's contrived. And pandering.

[Pencey]

Like you EVER wanted to have an intelligent conversation on this. You're just pissed because I called you on your views, such as they are, and now won't continue the game, is all.


I'll do this as long as I get some assurance that you will give me your views as well instead of just backing out with a childish "you're wrong".


Can't you just feel the love... :)

[Biohazard]

I don't think this argument holds any water. You might as well say Taxi Driver is a horrible film. Or One flew Over The Cuckoos Nest. I mean, both of those film's protagonists are just jerks who get what they deserve. I personally didn't care about either of them, so the films must stink.

As for OFOTCN, Jack's character is hilarious, and that makes me like him. Plus, he makes a turn from caring about himself to going to the aid of a retarded boy when he had a clear chance of escape. A very noble move that made me like his character even more.

As for Travis Bickle, he was a mentally disturbed man who thought he was doing the right thing. And in the end, he sort of did, by saving Foster's character from the pimps. Another good deed. He wasn't a jerk, he was trying to do the right thing.

[Erehwon]

Thank you for answering. I appreciate that, and I mean that.

I'll do this as long as I get some assurance that you will give me your views as well instead of just backing out with a childish "you're wrong".

Of the many, many things wrong with that movie, you want me to comment on the characters? Ok, no problem. I didn't give two f-cks about a damn one of them. The mother is an old lady who basically has no life and sits on the sidewalk with a bunch of other old ladies (if that's not thrilling, what is?). Then she gets the brilliant idea that she's going to be on tv but needs lose weight to fit into her favorite red dress. So she screws up what insignificant life she has by getting hooked on diet pills in a seemingly unrealistic fashion. She she has delusions of a monster living in the fridge or whatever. I find none of this fascinating on any level at all. I simply don't care and I believe that this is because I was given no reason. Let the hag screw herself up for all I care. What positive qualities does she possess that would appeal to me and cause me to relate to her? Same thing goes for her son. And if I want to see Jennifer Connelly drive her life into the ground, I'd just watch the far superior film House of Sand and Fog. The story, acting, cinematography, directing, writing, etc. is all leagues ahead of Requiem.

There you go. Not one of the characters possess a positive trait that I can relate to and that makes me care for them. That's why I feel the characters are very uninteresting.

And see? You didn't tell me anything about THE CHARACTERS. At all. You only, yet again, told me WHY YOU DIDN'T LIKE THEM. I was wondering about what you could tell me about WHO THESE PEOPLE ARE, not, yet again, why you didn't like them. And your reasons for not liking them?

Are all surface. You only mention what you see on the screen, not what motivates them, what makes them tick, or ANYTHING at all that would give me any clue into how you PERCEIVE them.

You wanna try again? I'm guessing you have trouble with understanding and writing character. That's cool. It's hard. I'm not great at it, either. Have a long way to go. Once you can understand motivation, and the backstory that belongs to the characters in films, you'll start to be able to notice the things that make them live and breathe and come alive, like the characters in Requiem For A Dream. Writing a character is much more than "I like character X, and I don't like character Y."

[kintnerboy]

Bio-

I won't argue much more with you, because you really seem DETERMINED not to like this film (and it's okay. I'm sure you have some favorites).

But this reminds me of my comments in the Sideways thread. There is a certain segment of the filmgoing public that watches films through blinders that can't get past morality.

Requim For A Dream is about addiction. But not to drugs. It's an addiction to the idea that the good life is just around the corner for all of us. All we need is one lucky break, a promotion, a lottery ticket, a spec sale, a cure for baldness.... and we will get to live the dream.

That's why we empathise with the characters. We're all guilty in some way of believing it.

And as far as your comments regarding the lady who 'has no life and sits on the sidewalk' I guess you've never never been close to someone experiencing the loneliness of old age. Good for you.

[AaronB]

But this reminds me of my comments in the Sideways thread. There is a certain segment of the filmgoing public that watches films through blinders that can't get past morality.


Include me in that group. A fundamental disrespect for a protagonist kills my film experience...it keeps me from caring what happens to the main character.

The flip side of that coin is that there is a certain segment of the filmgoing public for whom the morality of a story is an inscrutable non sequitur. They are incapable of interpreting a film in moral terms because they lack the internal equipment. To this group of filmgoers, any discusson of the morality in film is equivalent to discoursing about architecture, in Swahili, to a mackerel.

But there's nothing wrong with that. It's not the mackerel's fault.

[kintnerboy]

Fair point, but it depends what you mean by morality. I myself am only predjudiced against bad storytelling.

Some people are offended by any immorality displayed on film. I once read a negative comment in a review of The Winslow Boy (G-rated Mamet) because the lead actress shared a passionate embrace with a man she was not married to.

What about movies like Double Indemnity? Is that a bad film, because the protagonists are conniving murderers? Or is it good because they are punished in the end?

Where does this leave Anti-heroes?

My problem is, I am currently writing a story about a man who is being blackmailed. When he obstensively shows up to deliver the bag, he instead kills the blackmailer.

Where I come from, that's justifiable homicide, but I am afraid that the character will be labled 'unlikeable', so I am going to rewrite the scene so that the killing is either in self-defense or an accident.

I don't want to. I feel this type of commercial censorship is what leads to contrived writing at it's worst. I feel like I'm condescending to an audience, and that they like it that way.

[Erehwon]

My problem is, I am currently writing a story about a man who is being blackmailed. When he obstensively shows up to deliver the bag, he instead kills the blackmailer.

Where I come from, that's justifiable homicide, but I am afraid that the character will be labled 'unlikeable', so I am going to rewrite the scene so that the killing is either in self-defense or an accident.

I don't want to. I feel this type of commercial censorship is what leads to contrived writing at it's worst. I feel like I'm condescending to an audience, and that they like it that way.

I know you didn't ask for opinions, however, I feel compelled to say to you that you could keep it the way you had it. I don't think he would be labeled "unlikeable", because he's killing someone that the audience will have percieved to be lower on the moral scale, and way more unlikeable than the hero. NO ONE likes blackmailers. They're craven sh*tstains, so I think you could get away with it, and it would be more realistic than having to monkey wrench some sort of self defense thing.

[Biohazard]

Fair point, but it depends what you mean by morality. I myself am only predjudiced against bad storytelling.

Some people are offended by any immorality displayed on film. I once read a negative comment in a review of The Winslow Boy (G-rated Mamet) because the lead actress shared a passionate embrace with a man she was not married to.

What about movies like Double Indemnity? Is that a bad film, because the protagonists are conniving murderers? Or is it good because they are punished in the end?

I can't comment on DI since I haven't seen the movie yet, but I will use Strangers on a Train as an example. The antagonist is the most likable character in the whole movie.

And see? You didn't tell me anything about THE CHARACTERS. At all. You only, yet again, told me WHY YOU DIDN'T LIKE THEM. I was wondering about what you could tell me about WHO THESE PEOPLE ARE, not, yet again, why you didn't like them. And your reasons for not liking them?

I never bothered to look deep into each character's soul because they don't appeal to me on the surface. I watched the movie and made up my mind that I did not enjoy spending time with any of the people in the film. I shouldn't have to do homework to be able to enjoy a movie. I watched North By Northwest again last night and right from the start I love Roger Thornhill. Nevermind that he's a suspected thief and murderer, a drunk driver and a compulsive liar...he's hilarious, and that made me want to see more of him. But nobody in Requiem did anything that made me want to see more of them on the screen. I know who they are, and that does not appeal to me.
Films are, first and foremost, entertainment. RFAD is not entertaining to me. I don't give a hell how artistic it is or is not, I am not going to watch it unless I am having fun doing so. Period.

And besides, I thought you knew about that characters and who they are and you don't need me to tell you. If I am so wrong as you seem to believe I am, then I guess you're going to have to correct me.

[Erehwon]

I can't comment on DI since I haven't seen the movie yet, but I will use Strangers on a Train as an example. The antagonist is the most likable character in the whole movie.



I never bothered to look deep into each character's soul because they don't appeal to me on the surface. I watched the movie and made up my mind that I did not enjoy spending time with any of the people in the film. I shouldn't have to do homework to be able to enjoy a movie. I watched North By Northwest again last night and right from the start I love Roger Thornhill. Nevermind that he's a suspected thief and murderer, a drunk driver and a compulsive liar...he's hilarious, and that made me want to see more of him. But nobody in Requiem did anything that made me want to see more of them on the screen. I know who they are, and that does not appeal to me.
Films are, first and foremost, entertainment. RFAD is not entertaining to me. I don't give a hell how artistic it is or is not, I am not going to watch it unless I am having fun doing so. Period.

And besides, I thought you knew about that characters and who they are and you don't need me to tell you. If I am so wrong as you seem to believe I am, then I guess you're going to have to correct me.


I get all that, Bio. I was just hoping that you could give me your interpretation of their motives and inner conflicts and arcs. You watched the movie, right? so, I thought you'd have an opinion on it deeper than "I don't like them, so I didn't bother." I watch movies where I don't like the characters, but I can still formulate some sort of opinion of the characters as they're written.

But whatever. I'll close this one out now.