New Lottery - volume II

[Taotropics310]

I just had to chime in here.

First of all, I have to admit my breath was somewhat taken away by dh's statistics. I sort of knew it was that competitive, but the numbers put it into stark relief.

One of the most difficult things about being a professional screenwriter and being fortunate enough to participate in this somewhat rarefied world, is having to judge the scripts of people that you are rooting for who see you as a kind of "gatekeeper" to the Emerald City. I wish it was easier. I wish I knew what the pixie dust was made of so I could pass it out to all my friends, the talented and untalented, and to everyone on this board. The truth is, I have no idea. I'm not sure any professional does. It's extremely problematic that this sub-industry exists preying on the hopes of writers with no talent. I have no sympathy for writers with absolutely no talent that run around marketing themselves like lunatics, because they tend to be the ones that are participating in a delusionary get-rich-quick scheme, and it is their karma to pursue something that will not give them vocation. I feel worse for the ones who have SOME talent, whose scripts are "good", who are flirting with real ability, and have put in real time. What hurts is that those people's chances are only a fraction higher than the ones with no talent at all. I don't know why it's their karma to not achieve vocation in their chosen field. That's just the way it is. The vast, vast majority of those who achieve success (which is already an infinitesimal number) know pretty quickly that they're on the track to vocation because they get instant positive feedback, even on messy first attempts. If you aren't getting that feedback, you may be engaged in a futile endeavour as far as finding vocation.

HOWEVER

Writing is one of the greatest personal things a person can undertake. Why tell anyone to not write? Writing is like meditating or exercising - it's an unqualified positive for the spirit. Why do we have to be consumed with hierarchies and money? If you enjoy writing - your life will be happier. It isn't ever wasted time, no matter who does it. So I think everyone should keep writing. And rules WERE made to be broken. But know this: the more you separate yourself from the blandishments, the more you renounce in a final, personal way ANY CHANCE of making big bucks and hanging out with movie stars, the likelier the chance that you will create something original. That will probably still not be enough. But creating something original means you're operating from the heart, not from greed, not from grasping. And writing from the heart is like the best medicine in the world for whatever ails you.

Many people don't consider the possibility that God's intent for writers is mostly NOT to have it as a vocation. I think writers who do it for money get caught up in a different EQUALLY problematic karma system that involves fighting for their creative souls while being tempted by money to turn away from them. Again - many of the best screenwriters want to be novelists or directors. Or want to have the privilege of doing signature work, to be the only writer on a movie. Isn't that the same thing in the end? Always grasping. I don't know anyone that is immune from problems as a result of "making it" as a screenwriter. I worry far more about money now than I did when i had none. I sometimes envy writers without deals because they are writing original material untouched by the concerns of commerce. While I'm fortunate that my niche is "artier" material, it's still influenced by the marketplace. I look forward to the day when I'm making the same living I am now writing completely insanely original material right from my heart. You don't ever stop grasping or dreaming or hoping. There is no there there.

So write for love and bliss. Love and bliss are instant rewards unto themselves. Vocation? The ego has a field day with it for a few months, and then the new reality settles in and you're in the same place as before. Only working on the grasping itself makes a person happy. And it's HAPPINESS and FULFILLMENT not "SUCCESS" that we are all after.

Peace

Tao

[CRASH]

Well said.

[JoanEasley]

Thoughtful, generous post, Tao

[BlueParrot2]

I couldn't resist with my new footer... Sorry, Tao. ;)

[PipeWriter]

Tao: You had me at "chime".

[callingit]

Very well said, indeed.

[AnconRanger]

I don't know if this will help with the discussion or not, but the reason I want to achieve a level of writing "success" is so I can continue doing full-time what I love doing more than anything else, and can still pay the phone bill, buy shoes for kids, live in a decent house, etc.

I tried to write for years working 12-hour days, traveling five or six months of the year...making great money, but I had been writing stories since I was old enough to hold a pencil and that strange addiction at last demanded to be satisfied. My almost crazy compulsion to become a writer, giving the compulsion the time and study it needed, led me to leave that career and embark on this one...at the edge of mid-life.

I loved the post, especially about writing what comes from the heart and the power that comes from that. But artists don't store their paintings in attics and stories aren't meant to be kept hidden in file cabinets. Art is to be shared, and in trying to do so, writers have to enter the business world of Hollywood...they have to eventually think about business and "success."

I keep hearing on this board how getting noticed and so forth is so immediate and easy if you "have it." Funny, I haven't heard or read of this anywhere else...in fact, I've heard just the exact opposite. Writers should believe in their work and then travel the road to publication/production. And that road is often described as a long, bumpy one for many. There are so many variables involved besides pixie dust. I do believe in feedback, very much so. At the very least, the market tells what sells, and writers hoping to make a living at writing had better listen closely to what is said. I do.

Again, I loved the post. And I hope you do take the time to write those stories insanely from the heart...just as we will should do. I have one hidden on my screen now. I would think you're in a great position to embark on such stories.

Man, am I putting off what I need to do. Got to get to work. Good luck with those "real" stories.

[warmgoodness]

Gosh, it got all warm and fuzzy in here all of a sudden. About the long, bumpy road vs. the immediate and easy recognition/success for those who "have it":

I'd say it's both.

I wrote several screenplays and struggled, like most aspiring writers do, before I ever sold one. Lots of rejection letters, the usual routine. Couldn't get the doors open. Then I wrote something else -- the thing that took me to that 'next level' and I was amazed at how stupidly easy it was, and how little effort was required, for me to literally fall in with a producer who got me an agent and, a month or so later, a spec sale.

[creativexec]

Superb - like everything you write, Tao.

[Lancer55]

<!--EZCODE BOLD START--> Welcome to the real world.<!--EZCODE BOLD END--> In the real world people expect to get 10 times back on what they put in. The producer wants more money. The director wants a name. The actor wants fame. The movie viewer wants to enjoy their 8.00 dollars.

This is why its hard to break into the "Hollywood" as a script writer... They are looking for fresh and new ideas that could attract people to see the film...

Think of it, why would anybody pay you money for a perfectly written script that is going to sit on the shelf. I think not. And most producers are looking for fast and quick films, that does not cost too much to make and has a quick return. But what is going on is that most writers are "rehashing" the same stuff over and over again. Example: Die Hard, good movie, but how many "Die Hard" like scripts are out there... (Millions). or... Vampires (its in the billions).

Also, most writers are writing and not film making, and that is also very important. Producers are looking for "Movies" not artistic stories, or unless your a well named player in the game then you could do an artistic story.

So then many writers think "well if I'm going to keep on writing then something will hit!" And that is very possible, but I think that is the long and wrong way in doing it. <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--> Its kind of funny but I think I got this down pack and I havent even sold sh!t!<!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->

What writers should think of is "Hook, Line and Sinker"

Hook... You got to get people from point A (at home) to point B (your movie) Meaning that your idea must be new and fresh.

Line... Now that you got them to your movie, you got to keep them there (a story) and it has to be intresting, eye glued to the silver screen and not into the gum on the floor.

Sinker... Now that you got the people there, and making them watch your story... here is the best part... (you make them want more!!!) You know, when they come home and tell there friends "Yea, I saw this and this and its a great movie."

This is no lottery. Talent is what Hollywood is looking for...

:)

[FNT]

It's interesting to me how this discussion has twisted around to the central question of screenwriting: Why?

Why write screenplays? What's the motivation? Is it to make money? Because, if it is, then the chances are quite small and it's much easier to make money doing three million other things.

Tao's question has this at its heart (in my opinion, obviously). What is your definition of sucess? Is it to sell a screenplay? Because, as the pro writers have pointed out, there are extreme odds against it happening.

Is it to have a career in writing? This is one point I haven't seen brought up too strongly. How often do people sell twice?

Is it simply to write? Is it to be read?

I'm not sure. I've written screenplays that I'm not sure why. They certainly weren't commercial, they were simply something I needed to put down on paper. To get out of my system. And I haven't shown them to anyone.

I'd like to sell a script. Of course I would. But I don't know if I can agree with assertion that Art must be out in the market place to be Art.

I mean, what's Art? Is a diary Art? That's something written that's not (normally) mean to go out into the market place. But would you consider Anne Frank's diary a lesser piece of Art than, say, a Stephn King book?

Whoops, that's a whole other can of worms. But that's what message boards are for, right? Twisting discussions 300 miles away from the original point into new and interesting territory.

[Gotha 21]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote>Quote:<hr> Gotha -- unless you're Tori Spelling and born into the biz, without talent -- connections mean dick. I don't think it's fair to call any writer a hack. Who the f-ck are you to say you're better than another writer, especially one that is working. You haven't read the script to SORORITY BOYS. You don't know if the filmmakers made a good script bad. Some may call D.h. Steinberg a hack because SLACKERS got bad reviews, a judgement that's limited only to the final product which was shapped by an incompetent director and producers. I've read the original script to SLACKERS and it's a great script. There is a reason why it sold for $700,000. It's because the man has talent. But other people with more power and less vision f-cked up his script. All you get to see is the directors and producers version, but yet you blame the writers and whine about why it's not your name up there.

Go ahead and rationalize your bitterness by putting down other writers (pro or non). The real writers don't bitch about where they are. They write to get where they want to be.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END-->

Where the hell did this come from?! I guess you took that first sentence of mine the wrong way. I was more or less being facetious about that but I do believe sophomoric scripts for sophomoric comedies do get sold. I used to be a reader so don't think I'm clueless to what's going on in Hollywood. I can have an opinion too.

Now, where exactly did I mention Slackers in my post that made you go off like that? I'm sure there are teenage comedies out there that are well written. I don't know why you felt the need to lecture me on that.

I agree that it's not a good idea to blame the writer for bad writing in a movie. I would say that it's better to blame the writing in general when talking about how crappy it is. After all, one day it might be me who's script is wrecked. It's just that it's easier to blame the writer since we assume they're the ones who are responsible for the bad writing. But...point taken.

As for you wanting to know who the hell I am...well, just keep checking the trades and you'll soon find out.

[dhsteinberg]

(This message was left blank)

[BlueParrot2]

dhs,

i felt the thread lacked conflict. :)

[AnconRanger]

Warmgoodness,

Thanks for the post. Nice to hear that someone on this board actually went around the block a few times before selling their work.

Talented but starry-eyed novice writers get screwed up with all kinds of things---agents who have no clout and take their money, consultants who give less than good criticism, etc, etc, etc. It takes a year or so just to know your way around "Hollywood" so you don't look like a complete amateur...not to mention the time, study and hard work it takes to learn how to effectively tell a story for the screen.

Can anyone really tell if a beginning writer putting forth some serious, decent work and effort has "it" after a few years? I think it can take time for even a great writer just to find the right doors to knock on and be dressed well when someone finally answers. And this is not even considering the subjectivity of picking out what is "great" from what is "good."

If a monster stack of DD scripts were handed to the pros on this board, it's almost guaranteed their pick of the top five scripts would all be different...maybe with two picking the same script...one person's great story is the next person's trash. The very best in the industry routinely pass on projects that eventually go on to screenwriting legend. That's the nature of the business...it is very much subjective. Pixie dust, is not as readily visible as some may think.

Let the struggling writer play his or her hand without the presumptions that if they haven't done this by that date, their pen must not be dipped in "talent." After a reasonable time, the market will speak in a booming voice all that the deaf would not hear. Unless a pro is trying to educate the ones who are not serious about being a screenwriter and what that entails, I don't think most of us here need warnings and early judgements of our talent...the market is telling us what it thinks every day and we already know how hard it is to "break in." We know.

[dwickstrom]

The real motivation comes from within the creative process itself. The excitement of the idea, the brainstorming of the outline, sitting up in the middle of the night scrambling for a notepad and knocking over a glass of water instead... It's those little things that take us on our journey of discovery within story where the largest of the rewards are paid in full. Think a second about that gut feeling of excitement you have when you come up with something that describes the inner motivation of why you're writing in the first place. Anticipation at not knowing what will happen next... then coming up with something so good it knocks your socks off and leaves you staring at the screen either laughing like a teen, or on the verge of tears. The feelings have lived in us for years just waiting to be released, to have their say... and when they finally get what's theirs, the resulting satisfaction more than justifies a million pages of script.

Great post, Tao...

[BoweryBhoy]

The Lottery is won
New leaves grow
Spring comes



<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--> PS – I’m not making light of this thread :-)<!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->

[Lancer55]

I think most of you should stop! Get your head out of your ass and realize whom you are really writing for. I did last week, and now I know what I'm doing.

It doesn’t matter if the script is well written or not, look at Porkys... Cannonball Run... Friday the 13ths... Hackers... Dude Where's My Car... and the millions that are similar. <!--EZCODE BOLD START--> I cannot believe that somebody went to collage to write this.<!--EZCODE BOLD END--> But no matter how you call it, they are movies... and that is the most important thing, I think.

Hollywood is in the "Money Making Business" they are intrested in fresh and new ideas, not crap!

[dwickstrom]

Lancer...

Let me take a peek outta my ass here to say something. If a person loves the write... loves doing it for reasons that can be as simple as the self gratification of spinning a good tale... it doesn't matter if the movie is Caddy Shack, or Gladiator... the writer got payment in full and just increased the odds of making a sale. However, if you don't love the process and excitement of creating the script... it doesn't matter how original or how over the top you think it an idea is... it won't sell because the sloppiness of the rush to finish will be evident in the script. If you're not doing it for you... you're not doing it right.

Gotta get back... <big breath>

[gsvscreenplays]

Well said and very true.

Thanks for the post.

[Lancer55]

I do agree...

But most of you think your writer, and we are not... All writers do is tell a complete story in full detail. They dont have to follow any format, rule of thumb (please tell Stephen King to only write 90 to 120 pages), or have to baby Producers, Directors, and Actors.

We are script writers, we're making a 90 to 120 page story that could be market and crafted by a director. We must look at the big picture. Not be artistic (Ive seen some of your Log Lines... very artistic ideas but will not market) and Hollywood is looking for good ideas that they can market and sell. We are making "movies" not books, we have to understand that part of the game. You have to be thinking "I'm writting a movie, I'm making it intresting, I'm making it colorful, and attractive to whoever wants to buy it."

Sure you could love to write, I love to write... But as I was told "You have to know the format."

I'm saying there is a little more to the format then "FADE IN, INT. EXT."

[ferds]

I died six months ago.
Except my heart lived.
It told me go on writing, something I've done all my life.
And, it grew even fonder with my affair with screenwriting.
But last night, I thought
it's a love affair that's never meant to be.
And, I wanted to say goodbye to both you,
fellow screenwriters and screenwriting.
But, I was afraid you'd say good riddance.
Or, "How could you say goodbye to something
you never had, anyway?"
Now I'm crying and laughing at myself
realizing that to give up writing is impossible, anyway.
Do you know how much courage it takes
to even consider giving it up?
So, I write and, for once, it's not even for sale.

Thank you, Tao.

:) ferds

[Gaijin Samurai]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote>Quote:<hr> I do agree...

But most of you think your writer, and we are not... All writers do is tell a complete story in full detail. They dont have to follow any format, rule of thumb (please tell Stephen King to only write 90 to 120 pages), or have to baby Producers, Directors, and Actors.

We are script writers, we're making a 90 to 120 page story that could be market and crafted by a director. We must look at the big picture. Not be artistic (Ive seen some of your Log Lines... very artistic ideas but will not market) and Hollywood is looking for good ideas that they can market and sell. We are making "movies" not books, we have to understand that part of the game. You have to be thinking "I'm writting a movie, I'm making it intresting, I'm making it colorful, and attractive to whoever wants to buy it."

Sure you could love to write, I love to write... But as I was told "You have to know the format."

I'm saying there is a little more to the format then "FADE IN, INT. EXT." <hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END-->

after trying hard to decipher what exactly it is you're trying to articulate, lancer, i gave up and decided it was far too profound.

[Cornell]

Damit, Tao, you are always right on the nose.

Nice post.

[AnconRanger]

After the recent posts made by some of the pros, if anyone is concerned that their "talent" has not been immediately recognized, or that your talent may be lacking strictly based on the fact that you have been at this for a while and have not been "discovered," it may help to scan through some of the DD interviews, starting with the recent interview of Jeff Schechter. There are many paths. Writing is a growing process and there are no time limits. Keep smiling and keep writing.

[akaRichie]

nice tao - considering to quote all of that in my signature

[Arizona Cowboy]

Statistics and sinking curve balls! See what can come out of avoiding work by having lunch with two other procrastinators, a laptop, and an infrared web connection to your cellphone?

As far as the stats go, the DD statistical 'population sample' is not a representative random sample (anything but!), and may produce either a higher/lower success rate per capita unit than the statistical average. And DD site users who joined the site after a sale (success) do not count in the success rate for the population sample, so subtract them out. I love to see people freak on stats, so won't tell you that such statistical profiling is meaningless when applied to almost any small population, and are only mathematical indications. Ooops.
As far as the major league batting goes, nobody here would ever want to stand that close to a pitch from Pedro...
And now,
I return to the ranks of the self-deluded minions of Ming. The brave minions whose fervent belief that they can sell their very first screenplay effort, produces so much firey crackling energy that it forms an inpenetrable invisibility layer encircling our tiny planet such that no agent, producer, or studio ever finds us, and we remain in our fools paradise forever...

Adeiu and Ciao. And as we used to hear around the yard in the throes of springtime; "If you can't get a girl, get a Yalie."

[dwickstrom]

I didn't quite grasp the depth of Lancer's post either... what I do know is that somewhere he's found some of my loglines... where at? Out of what I've written to date I got... in short...

The Principle meets Carlito's Way
Drop Zone meets "Real TV"
Lethal Weapon meets Memento
Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure meets Young Guns
House on Haunted Hill meets The Running Man

I'm trying to figure out why he might think these are unsalable concepts...

Just coming back to edit here... I haven't posted a logline on here since... hell, long before Lancer got here... care to elaborate? You joined March 8... and have 178 posts... You're getting a lot of writing done... right here.

[CRASH]

One must admire Lancer55 for single-handedly building the Tower of Babel, brick by brick. I think to unlock the secrets of his posts, we must look back to one of his earlier classics. Once we decipher this rosetta stone, I believe the rest will follow:

<!--EZCODE BOLD START--> I'm very new in the game here but I do see the logic in what you speak. I'll repeat the last line for all those thick heads could see the truth of the real world.

and often for good reason.

Because its crap!

So why not pay somebody to read your work?

Do you think somebody will steal your stuff?

Or maybe what your writing is "Crap" and the person that reads it will say so. My GOD thats a bad thing. Just like some of these "Log Lines" are crappy ideas. But who am I. What should I know about crap. But most writers have an "ego trip" that thinks that their stuff is the sh!t.

Is a writer capable of crafting a "perfect" script
without any outside influence?

Please somebody tell me what is a "perfect" script.

Is it "perfect" because there is not grammar errors.

Is it "perfect" because its written very well.

Or is it "Perfect" because it makes money!

As one person asked me "Who am I writing for?" and to tell you the truth I'm writing for who ever wants to buy my stuff.

So I ask you "Who are you writing for?"

I also think by no means somebody will to pay top dollar for a script that does not make money. I dont care how you cut your ideas, and write your stories its about the MONEY.

So please when your working on your Log Lines, think about that. I've read some real crap. "Why would I pay 8.00 dollars to see this crap? Who would pay 8.00 dollars to see this crap?" This is what I'm thinking when I read a Log Line, I dont care about the grammar (My god we all know how bad is my grammar is) I'm just thinking about the bottom line, and sometimes I try to give advise (building a more sellable story). But then again who am I, will I'm the working guy that likes to pay my 8.00 dollars for a good movie, and I think Hollywood is looking for script that would attract people like me to see.

So yes I would pay somebody to read my stuff, I love my friends and family, but they are no "Proof Reader." And I dont care how good you could proof read your stuff, you will always miss something and that's a fact, and if I'm wrong here then maybe the world does not need any "checkers, managers, lawyers, etc..."

<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->

Notice how he speaks of "God" and the "truth of the real world." It's almost as if he has a direct line to the Lord himself when he cries out, "Who am I? Who are you writing for? Why would I pay 8.00 dollars to see this crap?" Lancer55 is our modern day prophet.

[KD The Wubat]

I would really, honestly like to know what your native language is, Lancer. I've tried to figure it out from your speech patterns, and I can't.

Help a girl out?

[randesq]

Now we know one of the previous posters is, in fact, an Alien. I had suspected, but a response to Tao's words have confirmed it for me. Any guesses?

[kklstef]

Tao, sincere thanks for that post. More appreciation then you can know. You've given me validation for my own current feelings about screenwriting. I don't want my writing to CAUSE me pressure and stress. I want it to be my escape from pressure and stress. And it is. Until I start worrying about whether I have "it", about whether my idea is original, commercial, high-concept, about whether I should be starting with an outline or index cards instead of just writing.

Maybe someday, my writing will improve to the point that someone will want to buy one of my stories. And I can walk into a theater and see people laughing or crying at words I wrote, bonding with characters I created. That would be a wonderful dream.

Until then, I'd like to do what so many people have said with sarcasm...write for myself. It seems, sometimes, there's a look-down-my-nose attitude on people that write because they enjoy it, without focusing on the Big Prize. Well, I accept that I may not have what it takes, but I still want to write for everything it does for me, as a person. I still want to feel the satisfaction of seeing my work improve, of someday having written the best story I'm capable of writing.

Okay, I'll stop now.

The basic point: Thanks, Tao. You've made a difference for me.

[Gaijin Samurai]

lancer,

if you won't say what your native language is, at least share with us which level of ESL class you're taking at community college.

[randesq]

are you here on a secret mission?

[Gaijin Samurai]

at least tell us the enigmatic and cryptic origins of the name "lancer"!

[Lancer55]

Sorry for your lack of understanding me. So, I will try to explain myself.

I think of my self as a simple man, that doesn’t make so much money. I seldom go to the show. I also think there are many just like me. These men and women that Hollywood wants to attract. And this is why movies are made...

Take the Rock's movie "Scorpion King" I haven’t seen it either, but I could guess it’s a good movie for a person like me to enjoy. But if I look at the "Writing" of the movie I could only guess that is very bad (to a writers point of view.)

Why is that?

Just like so many posts of people complaining why such and such did this and this and not that and that. Its not the point as why they (the script writer) didn't follow the rules, it beyond that. The real secret is "Hook, Line, and Sinker"

As I've explained earlier, the person that is looking at the script is looking for a movie that can be made. Not a well-written script. But a possible movie. They are not going to buy a script unless they think they could get a big return. Most of you that are in the game should know this. And those of us that are new should respect that.

Then we all forget. And start pointing fingers. Calling names. Saying I'm a modern day prophet. And we over look the real fact.

IT HAS TO MAKE MONEY.

This is why most of you think a perfectly written script should sell and it doesn’t. Because somewhere downs the line, it didn't have the HOOK, LINE, or SINKER. If you couldn't sell your product to them, how could you expect them to sell it?

Then you start ripping on movies like "Slackers" or "Time Cop." And over looking the fact that these are Movies, they were once scripts that sold.


When I write, I'm not writing a script, but I'm writing a movie to be made. (I hope this explains what I'm saying)

:)

[kklstef]

Wait, I think I can translate.

You're saying that there is a difference between commerce and art and that the studios, producers, etc are more interested in commerce? While the writers/artists involved may prefer art?

That's pretty profound.

[Arizona Cowboy]

Not to denigrate or give short-shrift to Mr. Tao's post...

But since when is this subject new?
And really... since when should a God come into the matter.

Anyone possessing any maturity whatsoever, who has ever visited this message board, must immediately realize that they are visiting the virtual headquarters of Self-Delusion central.
And the film industry has always attracted the desperate and deluded, in addition to the hopeful, and the talented.

I suppose the upward bump in script prices over the last decade HAS fueled an increase in fameNfortune seekers, but I suspect the movie trade sees no more of this silliness than the publishing world, in terms of unprepared and clueless folks.
Perhaps even less. Though, it's pretty clear that dreams of writing for screen is a popular subject, and the web enables a lot of utterly lazy people to dabble in the fantasy. Its a waste of electricity and technology, truly. And is one reason (I believe) that more serious and capable users on this board finally reach critical mass and lose their patience, and 'finally say it' , to 'Let the cat out of the bag.' Poor Steinberg! I cannot imagine attempting to respond to the number of idiotic emails he must get weekly, from both the chronically and freshly deluded alike. At least as a simple board user, one can opt out of the most nonsensical threads in order to preserve some sanity. Which is key, because as can be seen from the pig-pile onto the Lottery discussion, there is not going to be any relief from the persistent and enduring siege by all who claim the right (to the writer's life), on all those who have earned the right. And as was said, discussion is pointless since each person should write for their own purposes and pleasure. And one's future development is their own goal.

Lets hope that the pro's blew out the cobwebs, and peeves, and will soon be back to dispensing valuable words of experience for the benefit of those that can appreciate them.

[Lancer55]

<!--EZCODE BOLD START--> You're saying that there is a difference between commerce and art and that the studios, producers, etc are more interested in commerce? While the writers/artists involved may prefer art?<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->

Eminem and Kid Rock makes fun of "Commerce vs Art" with many of their songs. But when you really look into their music it is Commerce and Artistic.

Hollywood is looking for Commerce as well as Artistic, and when they find somebody that displays both skills they call that person "Talent."

And if you dont believe me then here is something from InZide...

<!--EZCODE BOLD START--> Question: What exactly is InZide looking for in a script submission and in what genre?<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->

<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--> Answer:
InZide <!--EZCODE BOLD START--> is looking for commercially proven stories that appeal to a wide range of audience members.<!--EZCODE BOLD END--> These stories need to be legitimate studio pictures and ideally be producible for a modest budget. They have to have a great story that can hold its own, without depending on a star to give it recognition.
But to answer your question, in most cases Zide/Perry doesn't actually look for specific genres when evaluating material. Instead, we approach things fairly scientifically and analyze material based on simple factors. When considering a script, we ask ourselves the following:

1) Is this really a movie?

Many rookie writers think their idea is just dying to be a film, but the truth is it only has enough content and emotional punch for a short film, nothing more. We’ve seen tons of set ups and topics that are interesting, but there needs to be enough to fill 90 minutes, with identifiable characters that experience lots of twists and turns en route to learning something, which is a challenge for some writers.

2) What movies of a similar subject, tone, budget and genre have been made, and how did they perform at the box office? Once we answer those questions, we ask ourselves: When were those movies made and what was the social political landscape at the time? And what other similar films have come out since then?

For example, if we read a script about pilots in the military, we think, "TOPGUN" -- which can be both a good and bad thing. The good things are TOPGUN made tons of money at the box office, solidified Tom Cruise as a major star, and was made 14 years ago which means there is a whole new audience for another airplane movie. The bad things are that another airplane movie would have to be incredibly unique to create its own buzz and rise above the TOPGUN legend. Plus, it would be amazingly expensive to make, which would also demand it be very unique -- otherwise studios wouldn't want to finance it. Additionally, if you recall the politics of the era the USA and foreign market were ready for a modern military movie in 1986. Today's landscape is radically different and possibly not so open to the idea.

3) Who is the audience for this movie?

We look at who actually goes to this kind of movie vs. what the leads in the script are doing and compare whether the target audience would identify with the characters in the film, and whether we can expand on the target audience to make the movie a hit rather than a movie-that-performed-well-for-it's-demographic.

We were drawn to AMERICAN PIE not only because of the teenage market, but because we believed people from other age groups would be drawn to the story for its nostalgic value --and it seemed to have worked. Additionally, we were drawn to AMERICAN PIE because it could be made rather inexpensively --for under $11 Million -- and did not depend on huge stars to attract audiences.

Another example is FIRST WIVE'S CLUB, which brought all age groups and sexes into the theatre, despite the fact its leads were 3 women over 40 –which is a phenomenon. The reason it worked? It brought wish fulfillment to a whole new level. See, woman ages 35 – 50 traditionally do not go to the movies, but they were dying to see women seek justice from their ex-husbands. If we read a feature script about women in this age group, we ask ourselves, "Is this script fun or interesting enough to get women to come to the movies?" We also ask ourselves, "What actresses out there would be willing to play someone 45 - 50, that is also a big enough star to guarantee all kinds of people would show up at the theatres?" Every once in awhile, the movie comes along -- FIRST WIVES CLUB worked, but there are dozens that didn't.

4) What is the Hollywood market value of the overall subject?

For the most part, the answer to this question is something only people working in the industry can know. As a writer you can take a look around at a product’s success in the theatres and use common sense to make a decent guess, but it really is up to us to know the answer to this one.

For example, right now the value of Mafia movies is ice cold. It doesn't matter whether the mafia script is a comedy or drama, set in NYC or elsewhere...studios just aren't buying them because they have plenty of them sitting on their shelves that they can't do anything with so they won't add more, and THE SOPRANOS has moved the viewer market to television.

5) What is the foreign market for this kind of script?

As you may or may not realize, the foreign market interest is a big factor in deciding whether or not to get behind a project. Foreign Buyers need a few simple things: the story must be universal and translate to an overseas market –- thus action and physical comedy work the best. Next guns, sex and great stars close the deal. Of course the Foreign Market loves thematically charged, beautifully made films…but just like in America, the box office for these kind of projects is risky at best, whereas action and comedy seem more bankable.

6) Is this the kind of movie Zide/Perry would make, or can we find someone who is a better match?

As we said, Zide/Perry is interested in making studio-sized, commercial films that a wide-spread audience will go see. (When we say commercial, we mean, "Can you tell me the movie in one-two sentences?) We might read scripts that are well-written and interesting, but if we do not feel they fall into the studio/commercial category it is very difficult for us to get involved. Sometimes we pass them along to people who are looking for film festival-type material, other times we team up with producers who have a track record in the genre and will bring value to the project.

We use all of the above in order to decide whether to pursue a script – all before reading the actual writing, which just goes to show you what a crazy this business this is. <!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->

That one line says it all.

:)

[kklstef]

"...which just goes to show you what a crazy this business this is. "

I love when production/management companies (or anyone else likely to throw away a script with typos) have typos on their site. It makes me giggle.

I wonder if they'd accept my logline that starts out "This funny this script is about..."

[Pencey]

As a screenwriter who needs to take marketability into consideration, one should look at the script they're writing and judge whether it's commercial enough to be made into a movie.

If the story is too personal (something only the writer would understand or want to see) or too esoteric, dark, etc., then consider how you can turn your personal story into a more marketable story. Maybe the personal story that you want to tell of a couple who's marriage slowly deteriorates could be changed from your main plot to your subplot while wrapping a more commercial main plot around that. This way you can still tell your personal story but at the same time have a main plot that's commercial enough for people to take notice.

[AnconRanger]

The best thing about these Lottery threads? Most aspiring writers probably haven't paid any attention to them.

For the past two days, while some (me included) have been going on and on about what writing is REALLY about, what is a real writer, why you should write, why you should take a long look in the mirror and quit trying to sell your work because...isn't it obvious, you'll never make it, who is going to make it, who won't, is luck involved, who is blessed and who is not, etc., aspiring screenwriters have just been out there, working on their stuff, posting something in the logline forum, critiquing someone's first five pages, preparing a package for that agent who just requested their script, getting ready for a seminar, downloading a script to study, etc. etc. etc. They could probably give two shi&$s what anyone (especially me), pro or rookie, has to say about why they should write, what writing should mean to them and when they should face the music and quit dreaming about selling their "mediocre" work. They write and are pursuing this dream because...they want to, and they're trying to get better at it. They may have read what's been spoken in sermons, then agreed, diagreed, laughed, cursed or whatever, and then just kept working. Good for them.

On another note, I think D. Steinberg probably took on that column to not only help serious wanna-bes, but help and enlighten novice writers who are testing the waters and don't know much about screenwriting. I'm sure he does get a lot of dumb questions from the delusional and starry-eyed. I'm still that way myself, sometimes. Most of us are green to some extent on this board. I've learned a ton there.

[randesq]

cut and paste in this thread.

Addicted from space

Loglines: When aliens send one of their own to infiltrate Hollywood with hopes of making alien friendly films.

[dwickstrom]

Ancon...

I think the worst thing about these lottery threads is that most haven't paid attention. In between the boxing of the ears have been some real gems of information that enlighten those who want to pursue this masochism... and then call it gainful employment. Novices SHOULD read most of the long rambling threads that are posted here and in other threads because the collective intelligence of several voices on one topic have wisdom as a group and can relay correct information if one is willing to pull the gold from the goop.

Lancer...

I know you're new to this... and you have passion, man. Don't lose it. Got anything on Zoetrope? I'd like to read your stuff... I have one to review left and then if you want, I'll take a look. You're right when you say what it comes down to is that $8.00. And that has to be kept in mind. But that has nothing to do with the actual writing process. If an idea is original enough and a great writer is behind the wheel of it, then the $8.00 rule is going to take care of itself without having to focus on it for the story...

Crash...

You're right. And I wasn't taking all that much offense with Lancer's post. I was more curious about where he found the information he said he saw... But I forgot I have some loglines over at the Escape site... maybe there.

Have a great day, people...

[JoeCreamnowski]

A couple of years ago I stumbled across a book, "How to Write It, How to Sell It", by Linda Palmer. My questions to life were all answered. I was destined to be a screenwriter. I took classes, even went to Rockport, Maine, read scripts, and many how-to books, and the more I learn the more the industry itself turns me off. Writing is a personal thing, at least I feel it should be. Every story you write is connected to you, at least in the beginning.

Soon people will start correcting you and telling you to lose material and to gain it elsewhere. Develop this character more, lose this character. You need another subplot, I was hoping for a happier ending, blah, blah, blah. People that conform to this or doing it for one reason...the money. I see very little art in screenwriting. I have started to relate screenwriting to the people who make coloring books. They draw the pictures and let others finish the vision.

I have recently start writing my first feature length screenplay and there is no way in hell anyone would want to buy it. It's a special effects laden horror piece. Why did I write it? Because I wanted to see my characters develop on paper. I wanted to hear what they had to say. I have been told I should write in novel form as my writing style is better suited for that. PPTTHHH! :) I want to write screenplays, I want to use flowery descriptions. I WANT EVERY SCENE TO BE EXACTLY HOW I SEE IT IN MY HEAD. I don't want to birth a baby and throw it up for adoption the second it is out of my womb. I want to raise the child. It seems you can't do this and make a living UNLESS you plan on producing and directing your flick on your own - nearly impossible unless you want to shoot dv or 16 mm.

I guess my point, maybe I should have written an outline :) , is that I can't see writer's choosing to be screenwriters for anything but the money - initially. You can get your ENTIRE message across in novel or short story format, not just the framework - so if you are doing it for the love of writing why even bother with writing screenplays? The reason I do is because I am a fool :) I just keep on writing flowery, but in script format. Anyone else have any ideas why an artist would choose a format that limits them?

Sorry for the rambling,
JC

[dwickstrom]

Hey, man...

I read your script and "without the prose" it would be an awesome script for market. Right now it's just an awesome script that's a decent read. You're not selling out by changing the format... you're selling out if you change the heart of the story and with CARRIE'S SECRET that's not something you have to worry too much about because there's a great story right in front of whoever reads it...

Good luck...

[AnconRanger]

With all the discussion going on about "selling" of scripts and writers either have it or they don't, who will make it, who won't and so forth, my guess is most who tuned in to that discussion spent their day still working on improving their writing, and even better, enjoying it...even with all the talk. Didn't mean there was nothing of value said...just that alot of folks probably read the posts and then went back to work to try to make their dreams come true...undaunted by what they read. I didn't say we shouldn't read the posts...I wrote half of them and really enjoyed and learned from some of the things said (even when I disagreed with some points)!

I'm saying if a beginning writer is hearing something like how tough it is and how if they have the "magic" they will be noticed quickly and how great scripts always rocket to the top, they might just say, "yeah, sometimes and sometimes not," and then go back to work because they very much believe in what they are doing and realize they have a lot to learn. I think that's cool and that was my point.

I thought it was great to see people critiquing someone's sample pages at the same time this running discussion was going about "real" writers, "real" talent and success. That proves us writers aren't to be weeded out so easily by grim statistics. Dreams die hard, as they should. Better than sitting in the rocker at 80 wishing...

You said it better than I did. Writers read the posts and pulled what THEY individually felt was gold from the goop, what applied to them...and then went on trying to become better writers and market their work the best they can.

Have a great day, yourself. Beautiful here in SC.

[randesq]

JC - any message or story you want to tell can be contained in 90-110 pages. It's a precise craft where nothing can be wasted. But not limiting.

[ToddinHB]

With all the aspersions being cast, I'll keep my head down, but thought this article in the LA Times might give some insight into the true nature of "show business."

www.calendarlive.com/top/...68,00.html (http://www.calendarlive.com/top/1,1419,L-LATimes-Calendar-X!ArticleDetail-55368,00.html)

[gsvscreenplays]

Screenwriting is a long race with only a few winners.

Got it.

Screenwriting is not a career choice for those who want to get rich quick.

Knew that.

Statistics show that most of us will not make it.

So what?

For those of us with a love of writing, who would do it even if we never got paid a dime, who fall in love with our characters and find total bliss in the journey of creation in and of itself; the statistics mean very little. The dream is to make our living doing something we love, and even if we don't, our passion remains.

There is very little any colleague, professional or otherwise, can say to change that.

The advice has been given.

Duelly noted.

We write on.

[dwickstrom]

War doesn't determine who is right... war determines who is left.

[Lancer55]

I was trying to offend those who think luck has everything to do with it. That is bull. It pisses me off the most when people start b!tching about other peoples hard work...

I dont care if the movie is Friday the 13th part 99, it was a script and somebody sold it and that is what counts.

[PapaJohn]

TAO: Great post, I think I'll keep writing--it's good for the soul and at least I may have some great coffee table material for house guests to peruse! :)



DHS: 3 Acts, but I'd like to see more character development with better dialogue ;)

[AnconRanger]

Ran into this quote not long ago. Might go along well with the article you cited.

"You sell a screenplay like you sell a car. If someone drives it off a cliff, that's it."
-Rita Mae Brown. (Newsweek 08/19/85)

[verbalgirl]

Tao, you magnificent art*** bastard. Well said.

[KD The Wubat]

I'm guessing you spent your childhood in Italy, and moved to the States in your teens.

Am I close?

[Gaijin Samurai]

i say bosnia.

[BoweryBhoy]

I think it was General Arthur MacArthur’s grandiose son who once said:

<!--EZCODE BOLD START--> “Good threads never die… they just… <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--> never die.<!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->”<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->





<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--> PS – All in good fun.<!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->

[AnconRanger]

I'll bet FNT never realized the dust he would stir up kicking around that first thought.

[Wewantangel]

Excellent post Tao.

It inspired me to post to this thread which I normally would not. The original thread rears the unsettling "I don't need to read what I already think I know about the math of success in this business" face -- think the caveman in Mulholland Drive for those who saw it. But this thread must exist. It's a warning of sorts, a dragon to slay a faceless omniscient beast.

Do I have the write stuff? I recently joined a writers group and had a scene of mine read by the group. It was inspiring. A pretty critical writer/person of influence gave me a damn good compliment. But after the meeting I came down from the high and realized I had so much more to do. So really for me it's the writing. I can't even speak of money other than I pay my bills by working 9to5. I'm proud to say that as I'm not in currently close to a sale, I currently read away from any listing of script sales. I don't need a distraction like that, the inherent frustration which might be there.

I don't want to know about how Dude Where's My Car was sold. No offense, but I do this because I think in film, maybe after I sell that third script and if I'm not directing, I'll write that novel that's lurking in the depths of worst fears.

I can't imagine my existence without writing and without writing I would cease to exist. The same can be said for film. And I am serious about this, as serious as a myocardial infarction. Maybe it's the ego in me that Tao refers to. Maybe I wasn't loved enough as a kid, or made enough friends, but in this world I can make the White Sox win the World Series, I can find right father for my father-less niece, I can create the love I've never found. To add suspense I can have my hero have to explore the underworld of some metropolis where his true love has been taken by her suitors. After perilous adventures, I can have the hero kill the suitors and win his true love back.

All I can do is echo what Tao said about writing for the bliss, the love.

And as I've said before (I'm working on it myself) there are plenty of digital video cameras out there. If you believe so much in the story in the words you write, film it yourself. It may be another lottery of sorts, but there's nothing like hearing or seeing what you write come to life.

Write because it's in your heart and soul first. There are dragons out there and in here. I'm doing my best to slay both and wish the best to you dragon slayers, especially to those of you who slay from the heart and soul and know no other way.

[CarpeDeezNuts]

to anyone who has felt discouraged by my pessimistic ramblings in the first lottery thread... I hate the idea of anyone backing down from their dream, regardless of the odds.. As Arcon put it, you don't want to be 80 years old saying "what if..." When I was an aspiring screenwriter, if someone had quoted the statistics to me I would have (faux) confidently said "well I'm going to be the exception to the rule, biznatch."

So now that I'm a working writer, the apparent rule-exception, why the hell would I discourage others? I think it comes from my own personal experience over the last two years. I have read hundreds of scripts from friends, acquaintances, friends' acquaintances and acquaintances' friends.. I used to offer to read anyone's script. The reason was two-fold. First of all, I could keep the good-karma-wheel going by helping a friend get his foot in the door. But also, pragmatically, if I "discover" a script, I could also benefit from it (by attaching myself in some producer capacity). What a deal. Profiting, while helping someone realize their dream. Win-win. It doesn't get much better than that.

Unfortunately, what I found out is that most scripts are varying degrees of not-great to god-awful. I'm sure many of you have read less-than-stellar work from friends or loved ones. It sucks to have to tell them that you didn't care for their script/baby, when there is nothing you want more than to love it. It is so disheartening. It begins to taint your view. As a result, I now read as few scripts as humanly possible. I hate the feeling I get when I read something poor from an aspiring writer. It's the worst. Yet that is the case the vast majority of the time. I do not envy producers looking for material. They read a dozen or more scripts a week and they hate 99% of them.


On the other hand, one of my friends wrote a great script, which I passed along to an "important" person, and that lead to him getting an agent, which lead to him getting a picture deal. What a feeling! (though I forgot to profit from it. I'll have to work on that)... It was just that simple. He wrote something great and it started his career. And it is because of that friend (as well as my own somewhat-success) that I have arrived at my whole philosophy on breaking into the industry, which I have said a couple times in previous posts: It's all about the script. Write an exceptional script and it will get your foot in the door. I know, I know, "something exceptional" is completely subjective... One person's genius is another person's "Dude Where's My Car?"... That being said, just concentrate on writing the best possible script you can... And then rewrite it... And then probe your friends for criticisms and rewrite it again... Start your conversations with "I've heard what people like about my script. I want to hear about what you HATED," and then rewrite it again. Repeat that process until the script reaches "truly exceptional" status, and then everything else will work itself out...

Or not...

Beyond that, write for the love of writing... As Tao said (more eloquently than I ever could), as long as you are writing because you truly enjoy it, everything else (success, money, writer-groupies) is just gravy...

(damn, I wish there really were writer-groupies)...

CarpeDeezNuts

"Seize the Balls!"

[StRogue]

Tao - nicely said.

I think some writers forget that life is not about collecting a prize at the end, but about the journey. It is true, some will struggle all their lives and never sell a damn thing.

Maybe that's karma for them. Maybe that's their journey, to never give up, to never give in. To learn a life lesson or two.

Others, as you have stated, who have little to no semblance of talent, rocket themselves into a sweet deal leaving the rest of us dumbfounded.

Karma - destiny, well, that's an interesting thing.

One thing I do understand, that's I have a story to tell. Maybe that story will sell, maybe not. Maybe I'll land writing assignments, maybe not. Either way, I enjoy the process.

It's frustrating, difficult, and rewarding all in one. Will I get there? Well, if it's my destiny, you bet. If it's my karmic struggle, nope, not at all. I won't know which is which, if I don't write.

Once again, nicely said Tao. - Charli

[AnconRanger]

The prize is not only receiving some loot, it's seeing our stories fulfilled on the screen someday. That's the goal, isn't it? But I agree, it's the day to day pleasure of writing that is the true benefit.

While we all know it's very doubtful that study, perseverance, believing in our own work and trying really hard will ever have the cause/effect of a writer seeing their story on a huge screen some great day, if a writer DOES NOT study, persevere, work really hard and believe in their own work, it will surely NEVER HAPPEN. Even for those very special ones.

All who don't give the effort the hard work and effort it deserves, believing in their own work, will never know if they "have it" or not. That's why it's important.

If a writer believes they have the talent, imagination, and dedication to work hard and see the process through, the market will eventually tell them if screenwriting is something that will work out as a "profession" or not. Stay in the game as long as you want to play and you're being dealt a decent hand now and then. Unless you only want to write for the PURE pleasure of it and for no other reason...but if you want to be in the game, doing the work and braving the rejection that follows when entering the "business end" of screenwriting, you've got to stay strong...you have to believe. The market and our own guts will eventually tell all of us how far our "talent" can take us...but that "talent" rides on the back of other things like hard work and believing in a dream. And I think that's all I have to say about the subject.

[Lancer55]

<!--EZCODE BOLD START--> The prize is not only receiving some loot, it's seeing our stories fulfilled on the screen someday. That's the goal, isn't it?<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->

I love this line... it makes me want to write 100 scripts... because it is very true...

Well, I dont know about the rest of you but I like to see my stuff on the screen... and receiving some loot... :D

[AnconRanger]

Lancer,
You bust me up sometimes with your enthusiasm. Hang on to it and good luck!

[Gymbal31]

This is from HollywoodLitSales.com:


LOSING THE "LOTTO MENTALITY"
By Matthew Terry

The words spoken by Donald Sutherland at the Academy Awards sent a chill
down my spine. As Julian Fellowes won the Academy Award for Best Original
Screenplay for "Gosford Park", Mr. Sutherland read this as Mr. Fellowes
walked to the stage: "This is Julian Fellowes' first produced
screenplay."

The reason a chill went down my spine is due to the fact that every class
I teach, I have those students who somehow think that this script they're
writing is going to win the "Hollywood Lotto". That, somehow, their
written words are going to transcend conventional wisdom and Mr. Big
Producer from Really Big Studios is going to write them a check thirty
seconds after reading their brilliant script.

What most first-time writers don't realize, is that this may very well be
his FIRST produced screenplay, but if you look up his name on www.imdb.com
you will find that he's been an actor in number of productions, written a
mini-series for television, and produced "Gosford Park" too. So he's got
a full rolodex, or Palm Pilot, that most first time screenwriters don't
have.

Every class I teach, someone brings up Ben Affleck and Matt Damon winning
for "Good Will Hunting" and, once again, I have to remind people: "Selling
a screenplay doesn't occur in a vacuum." You need talent, you need
connections, you need support, you need to create relationships. Some
writers, indeed, think that the words they place on paper are somehow
going to turn into gold. It's a looooong way to the gold with lots of
miss-steps along the way (the Academy Award winner for "A Beautiful Mind"
- Akiva Goldsman - also wrote: "Lost In Space - the Movie" which was
universally hated by critics and a failure at the Box Office).

The sooner the new screenwriter realizes that writing and selling a
screenplay is something that takes time, energy, persistence and, most
importantly, a realistic and honest look at the way Hollywood works - the
better.

Matthew Terry is a screenwriter of fourteen screenplays. Teacher of
screenwriting at Seattle Central Community College. Two scripts optioned.
Worked with Ron Schusett and Rick Stevenson. E-Mail:
MattTerry.wa@netzero.net
Website: members.fortunecity.com/matthew_terry (http://members.fortunecity.com/matthew_terry)

[FNT]

Is a Billy Wilder quote that got thrown around in a lot of his obituaries.

If you look at Billy Wilder, whom I consider the greatest writer/director ever, and his life.. well, perhaps it might give a few examples...

Starts off as a journalist and, according to anecdotes, lucks into a selling his first script. Was lucky to have the situation, was cagy enough to use it his advantage, and was talented and hard-working enough to have a script ready. Writes several films. Leaves Germany due to the Nazis and very eventually lands in the US.

Starves for two years.

Finally gets a break. Writing bad movies. Starts to write good ones. Works with Lubitsch. Tired of seeing his screenplays mangled by those other than Lubitsch, he directs. His first film, however, isn't a Citizen Kane. It's a Dude, Where's My Car. Or, more appropriately, a Sorority Boys. A light, fluffy romantic comedy about a man falling for what he thinks is an underage girl.

It's his second film that's the heavy one. And he goes on to make some of the best films ever made.

So.. what I take out of it is that.. there are no rules. And it takes a hell of a long time to make it. During some of his lowest points, those starving firs years in America, I'm sure Wilder could have given up. Been a top shoe salesman or such. Perhaps he did, for a while.

But he stuck to it. And there you go. Because he was a great writer. Maybe not at first, maybe he was just decent or good at first. But eventually. He certainly had great determination.
He didn't let not knowing English, having most of his family die in concentration camps, or any silly statistics stop him.

So.. I'm going to try and write. There are tens of thousands of screenplays on the market every years. But agents and executives are always saying that they can't find any good scripts. Are desperate for them.

As Carpe Deez says, and so many others have, good material always rise to the top. I think that's true.

So.. I'm going to try and write. And maybe, eventually, I'll write something decent. Then maybe something good.

See how it goes.

[Augie Kestrel]

Gaijin,

I would have guessed Greece or Yugoslavia, arriving in an English-speaking country around the age of ten.

My favorite quote:

"It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled or where the doer of good deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; who knows the great enthusiams, the great devotions, and spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievements; and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat" - Teddy Roosevelt.

Whatever the statistics may show regarding success, refusing to at least make the attempt will almost certainly result in failure.

[Gilliatt]

There's a nice article in the latest copy of Screenwriting Secrets that provides a list of pros and cons in one's motivations to write and sell a screenplay.

I thought it was interesting when the author said, (this is not verbatim mind you) money should not be the only reason that you write a screenplay, but it should be one of the reason you want to work as a screenwriter.

There's also a very nice editorial that describes a number of the similarities between writing a screenplay and designing a building. :) One of my favorite topics. :) :)

[kimbro1111]

bump