Managers with a great rep

[Winter in New York]

Hey folks

Looking for some suggestions of Managers / Management Companies you've either heard great things about (maybe they rep friends of yours), or else Managers / Management Companies who've done great things for you personally.

I'm not so much interested in the horror stories about the bad ones. Just want some word of mouth about the good ones.

Winter in New York

[PipeWriter]

That's an easy one. Go through the sales and you'll see which managers and agents have been doing great things for their clients.

[Winter in New York]

Oddly enough, I've done that for managers - well for sales in 2004 anyhow - but that's not really going to be a fair indication of what they're like to deal with for the 90% of their clients whose names do NOT appear in the 'sales' section.

Everyone's great when they sell your stuff. But what are they like when you're in the trenches developing material? Do they get you meetings? Do they talk about you to execs? Do they have intelligent and constructive thoughts on your scripts during the re-writing process? Do they do ANYTHING other than take 10-15% when your work sells...

This may be a futile exercise; but Jesus, you'd figure some of the guys on here'd (a) have a manager, and (b) have a manager who they would have had a great experience dealing with?

I mean, what am I asking for here, a map to the Holy Grail?

Sheeesh.

...

Edited to add:

OK, secondary question on this: I'm thinking about getting a manager, obviously. I've already got a groovy agent, but I'm thinking: hell, another person in your corner can't be a bad thing, right? - I'm sure I'm not the only person in this position, so bare with me here - One school of thought is: get a manager who has no connection to your agent. This way he will keep your agent 'honest' and will not have an issue ringing him and hustling. The other school of thought is: we're all on the same team. So get a manager with a pre-existing relationship of some sort with your agent (be it that they're friends, or just have some mutual clients or whatever). If you do it this way, then everybody's on the same page, and everybody's pushing in the same direction. After all, there is no I in T.E.A.M blaa blaa.

Both have their merits I'm sure...but which is the smart choice for a writer????

Thoughts on a postcard... :)


Winter in New York

[Hamboogul]

Writer in NY

I might be mistaken but I think you mentioned in some other thread that you are repped at one of the Big Five. I'd imagine that your agent is the first person who can help you in this matter.

[elephant1978]

A map to the holy grail would be much easier to find on this board, Winter. I love coming to this board but I am frustrated to no end when it comes to advice on managers and agents. You'll find the same non-answers time after time: "Check the sales, managers will find you when you write a killer script, etc." Advice on this subject is very hard to come by.

Ele...

Edited to add: Holy crap, Winter. You're already repped by a "Groovy Agent" and you're asking how to get a manager? You have the best resource for these answers. I mean, this is the kind of stuff I was just complaining about--people have answers and never want to share.

One more edit: Look, all I'm saying is there seems to be a habit of writers on this board who may have an agent or have made some progress...maybe it was small progress, but progress still. When advice about reps comes up they all hold back, possibly assuming that their little experiences aren't all that useful. I just want to say that they are. Making that first step is very hard for a lot of us. So any info, no matter how small, is helpful. I don't mean to direct my frustration at anybody, but it is well known that the agent/manager topic doesn't get very far on this board. I wish we could change that trend. Sorry for the interruption. Back to your regularly scheduled program.

Ele...

[Maxwell Sand]

People can't really recommend their own managers for a number of reasons. 1) They haven't read your work. 2) They don't know if you're a nut. 3) Their managers might not be happy to get a flood of unsolicited submissions.

I guess people could recommend other managers they've heard of, but it wouldn't be first hand experience.

Most managers want a recommendation. You usually get those from agents and producers.

[Winter in New York]

Hmmm, it sure is a tricky one, huh.

Ele, yeah, I'm lucky enough to be repped by a big 3 agent. But I was of the opinion (based on suggestions from far wiser heads than mine) that if I get a manager it should be someone with no connection / pre-existing relationship with the agent.

I, however, was in the naive little cherub camp of: 'But isn't it better if we're all on the same team?'

By going to my agent and saying, recommend a manager, I am going to have to go with the latter option. Which may prove a great choice. But, like I said, some friends whose opinion I trust, have told me that your manager should be a guy / gal who isn't in bed with your agent.

Hence the post.

Hence my confusion!

Winter in New York

[elephant1978]

I have no business basis for saying this, but I agree, Winter. I think it's smarter to have a manager that's not connected to the agent. It could double your resources and connections. My only suggestion is that it would have to be a manager at a large firm--somebody on the same level as your big 3 agent. No shark agent will want to deal with a boutique manager. They may not have to have an existing relationship, but it's important that they are in the same playing field and can come together for your benefit.

Ele...

[Winter in New York]

They may not have to have an existing relationship, but it's important that they are in the same playing field and can come together for your benefit.

Again, you raise a very good point Ele! Good thinking 99.

Heck, maybe you should be my manager!!! :smokin

Winter in New York

[creativexec]

It is important that the agent and manager
get along. So signing with a manager who
has no working relationship with the agent
may not be a good move.

There are many agents that have had bad
experiences with certain managers (even
big managers) and personalities sometimes
clash. Or the agent and manager have
different business styles.

I have taken writers (with managers) to
agents, who have passed on repping the
writer saying, "I don't want to have to
deal with his pain in the ass manager."

I have seen agents drop clients (some
big clients too) because managers have
gotten in the way of progression and
deals.

Just because the agent knows the
manager doesn't mean they travel in
the same circles and it seems certain
they will know different people.

Getting a manager is a career move
and it should be discussed with your
agent.

It's smart to find a manager who can
complement the agent. If the agent
is low-keyed, get a manager who's a
shark. Or vice-versa. If the agent is
all business and not brimming with
personality, find a manager who has
more charm and people skills.

Obviously, all this is true in reverse.
If a writer has a manager and is
looking for an agent, it needs to be
a good fit.

:D

[Winter in New York]

CE - thanks, dude. That's put my mind much more at rest about the whole 'I feel I need a manager' conversation.

My only worry about it now is how do I say, 'I feel I need a manager' without him reading: '...because I don't think you're doing enough.' Because the latter isn't true. He's doing fine. But, ya know...egos are easily bruised. So I need to step carefully.

Winter in New York

[Boobsie Malone]

"I'm thinking about getting a manager. Any suggestions?"

I don't think an agent would take offense to that, or think that they would read anything into it. It's pretty standard practice to have a team of three, I believe: Agent, Manager, Lawyer.

[Otis]

Winter-

You're thinking way too much on this one. If you want a manager, use all the resources you have available to you to get one.

Just tell your agent, "I'm thinking of getting a manager. What do you think?"

He'll give you his opinion, suggest managers and set up meetings.

It's an everyday thing for a writer to have an agent and a manager. Your agent will just assume you're trying to build your team.

[Winter in New York]

...conversation had with agent. Meetings with management firms set up (by agent).

Note: call was no problem at all as it turned out. Go figure.

Ask me again this time next week how the meetings went... :)

Winter in New York

[phatgirl]

So who are the great managers you're meeting with?

(I figured it's only fair since you asked us to share with you.. ;) )

[Winter in New York]

I'm meeting with my agent about it all at the end of this week, so I'll post sometime the week after and let you know what names are suggested.

Basically though, my agent has set up only one appointment with a management company at this stage.

Logic is, he doesn't think I'll need to see more than one company, as this company manage quite a few Oscar winning writer / director types. And as I'm a writer director (though last time I checked, one who is saddly sans anything remotely resembling an Oscar! ;) ) - it all seems like a really good fit.

At least on paper! :D

However, if the meeting doesn't go well (for whatever reason) my agent has assured me that there are another half a dozen companies that he really respects, that will be 'champing at the bit to sign me'. (Gotta love 'agent speak' !)

So, we'll see how it all pans out. Talk is, after all, traded very cheaply on the streets of LA...

Winter in New York

[Writorman]

"Logic is, he doesn't think I'll need to see more than one company, as this company manage quite a few Oscar winning writer / director types"

Which management company are you talking about?

[Cole Blackburn]

WINY.
Check you EZ INBOX.
Cole

[JustinoIV]

I want to know one thing.

What does a screenwriter need with both an agent and a manager?

And what fees would you need to pay for it? 10% of the sale to the agent alone, hourly fees to the lawyers, and on top of that, a manager?

If your agent is selling your stuff, and the lawyer is going over the contracts, what additional benefits do you think the manager is going to bring?

[MrPembridge]

I can't speak for others, but my manager helps me:

-practice my pitches.
-reads EVERY single draft from concept / outline, to final script, and gives detailed notes, often on a page by page, line by line basis.
-pitches ME to others when I'm in a room so it doesn't make me look like a cocky bastard.
-focuses on both short term goals and long term career aspirations, helping to formulate & refine a plan to get there.

From what I've seen & heard, my understanding is most agents simply don't have the time to do this in as great detail as a manager does. The meetings / story notes I've had with Agents recently have been great, but the notes have been, at most, a half hour of the meeting. I've spent several hours with my manager several times a week.

Mine charges 10%, plus, if discussed, he has the option of attaching himself as a producer onto the project, in which case the 10% would be refunded/waived, and he would take a producing credit / fee. From what I understand, this is somewhat standard, however...if the manager doesn't have a good rep, it can KILL the script, just like having an actress or director nobody wants to work with attached to the script.

[JustinoIV]

"I can't speak for others, but my manager helps me:

-practice my pitches."

Can't you practice on your own? And if you have a good agent with a history of sales behind your script, couldn't he or she get a deal for you.

"-reads EVERY single draft from concept / outline, to final script, and gives detailed notes, often on a page by page, line by line basis."

There are script consultants who do that. And while your script needs to be a good script, it doesn't and won't be perfect. After it is sold, it will be rewritten. Whether or not someone purchases your script often depends on whether or not you have something that would fit an actor or director that they know.

"-focuses on both short term goals and long term career aspirations, helping to formulate & refine a plan to get there."

If you're a screenwriter and that's what you want to be, don't you already know where your career is heading?


"Mine charges 10%, plus, if discussed, he has the option of attaching himself as a producer onto the project, in which case the 10% would be refunded/waived, and he would take a producing credit / fee. From what I understand, this is somewhat standard, however...if the manager doesn't have a good rep, it can KILL the script, just like having an actress or director nobody wants to work with attached to the script."

Has your manager closed any deals for you or produced anything?

I'm not trying to be harsh or arguementative. I know a lot of people will promise things, but whether they come through with them is another matter.

[Hamboogul]

Justino,

You claim that you aren't trying to be harsh or arguementative (sic). If that's truly the case, why don't you limit your helpful feedback and advice to subjects where you actually know something.

[JustinoIV]

It makes me no difference to me whether anyone here gets a manager or not. I certainly have no personal stake in it one way or another.

However, of those that do, I'm just curious what their managers do for them that an agent or a lawyer can not.

I did not tell anyone to drop their manager.

So Hamb, if you have a manager, you're also free to tell what he or she does that an agent or a lawyer can not.

[MrPembridge]

>>>Can't you practice on your own?<<<

Sure, in front of the mirror, to friends and family, etc. But my manager has the advantage of having been a produced writer / WGA member, sold pitches, gotten assignments, etc. Plus he's produced stuff himself, so he knows what it's like on the other side of the table.

While my housemate may love my Zombie-Western idea, he doesn't exactly have the firmest grasp on what could sell.

>>>And if you have a good agent with a history of sales behind your script, couldn't he or she get a deal for you.<<<

I don't know from personal experience, but I DO know a few working screenwriters, and they've all echoed that it's not only your writing, but YOU that they're buying. Whether you'll be fun to work with, fold under pressure, act like a prima donna, etc. Maybe once I build up a rep / quote / history, I can be pitched, but right now, I'm nothing but a hungry, new writer.

>>>There are script consultants who do that<<<

Yeah, and they charge on an hourly basis. If I were to pay some Consultant at an hourly rate at what my manager's giving me, I'd probably be into them for MORE than 10% of a sale price.

>>>And while your script needs to be a good script, it doesn't and won't be perfect. After it is sold, it will be rewritten.<<<

I'd rather have it as close as possible than simply assume A.K. Walker is going to come in and do a rewrite. And if so, awesome.

But I've met writers who've been the ONLY writer on a project from start to finish. It happens.

>>>Whether or not someone purchases your script often depends on whether or not you have something that would fit an actor or director that they know.<<<

I don't know anything about this, because I've never seen the intricacies of a purchase from a Gods Eye POV. I don't know how all the chess pieces line up, the motivations, etc.

Most writers make their living off assignments, so while a big spec sale may sound really nice, I'm going to try not to think too much about the clockwork behind it.

>>>If you're a screenwriter and that's what you want to be, don't you already know where your career is heading?<<<

I'd be more than happy being "just" a screenwriter. However, I'd like to plant the seeds to possibly direct further down the line / develop video games. But that's long term.

I think of it like a team. If my manager is looking to produce, he'll tell me because that will change his focus / motivations, and how he handles a script.

Likewise, if I write a small western musical ten years down the line with the intention of trying to direct it, my reps could try to guide my career in that direction further down the line so it would be a little easier than just tossing on a hat and saying: "I'm a director!"

>>>Has your manager closed any deals for you or produced anything?<<<

Managers can't close deals. You'd need a Lawyer or an Agent for this. CA law.

>>>Has he produced anything?<<<

Yes. Both in the past / present, and future tense.

>>>I'm not trying to be harsh or arguementative. I know a lot of people will promise things, but whether they come through with them is another matter.<<<

I agree with the second part. The hairs on the back of my neck stick up when someone says: "we're GOING TO sell this."

I prefer people that say: "I believe we can sell this."

False / inflated expectations suck. I've been meeting a lot of agents recently, and my spider sense starts tingling when I hear: "we're going to sell this."

Thankfully, most have been more realistic, if somewhat optimistic about it.

>>>However, of those that do, I'm just curious what their managers do for them that an agent or a lawyer can not.<<<

I thought I covered this a few posts back.

[freebaser14]

Why would I pay a script consultant when I can listen to my manager who has a consistent track record of selling scripts and setting up projects? That's ridiculous. I'd rather pay a great manager, agent and lawyer than a scheister script consultant. Everyone has different needs some people want both an agent and a manager and some don't. You work with a team. Go nickle and dime yourself and be cheapskate - but Justino, this is at least the second time you have brought up this argument and its getting quite boring.

[JustinoIV]

"I'd rather pay a great manager, agent and lawyer than a scheister script consultant. Everyone has different needs some people want both an agent and a manager and some don't."

And if you believe you need a manager, good, then get one for yourself.

I was asking people here what their managers did for them in their own words................

So far, I've for the most part, have seen nothing that an agent and a lawyer can't do, since another poster just said by California law, managers can't close deals.

Not only are there script consultants who can go over scripts, there are peer screenwriting groups, etc.

I've come across credited (www.imdb.com) script consultants who charge between $90 and $500 dollars to go over your script and give you notes. Some will even glance at your script to see if you need the help before going over it and charging you.

If anyone here feels they need the manager's services, go right ahead and keep them. I'm not telling you what to do. I just personally see no need for a manager.

That my personal OPINION, which I have a right to. You have a right to yours.

[freebaser14]

"And if you believe you need a manager, good, then get one for yourself."

I have one. A good one who has a consistent track record of selling scripts.

Secondly, screenwriters are different with different needs. Some are fine with an agent, some want more. I mean, if it were that unnecessary, companies like Brillstein and Benderspink would be bankrupt. Many writers want a more involved approach and that is what a manager provides. You may not see the need for yourself. But many do. I see the longterm investment and overall business relationship my management has with me vs. some cash I fork over to a script consultant and there is no comparison.

[BROUGHCUT]

So far, I've for the most part, have seen nothing that an agent and a lawyer can't do, since another poster just said by California law, managers can't close deals.

It's not that agents and lawyers can't do these things, but they may very well be disinclined to invest the time and effort, lawyers especially if they are on a (relatively modest) commission. There is a reason why so many agents who go solo hang out shingles as lit managers.

You imply that it would be better value for money for the writer if managers could also negotiate the script deals they help to instigate. But as you know the vast majority of managers also attach themselves to produce -- that forms a large part of their motivation to manage the writer (or the project, depending on your pov) as best they can. Obviously, this is a recipe for a symbiotic relationship, otherwise manager-producers wouldn't have carved out their niche so successfully. When it comes to the writer's deal, any self-interest on the part of the manager is counterbalanced by the fact that business affairs executives will only negotiate with the writer's agent or lawyer.

If managers were allowed to "close" writers' deals there would be a huge conflict of interest whereby the manager could negotiate your compensation as writer to be acquiescent to the demands of their own development deal. That could cost you far more than an additional 5 or 10%.

[Gary Whitta]

A (good) manager can be invaluable in so many ways. They'll help you sort through your various concepts and figure out which are the best ones to be developing at any given time. They'll work closely with you on the script, helping to develop it into the most sale-able property possible. They'll work on pitches with you, giving you feedback on how to punch up your presentation and what areas to focus on. They'll get you hooked up with all sorts of cool people in the biz. They'll massage your ego and do a lot of idiot-proofing for you when you're talking to prodcos and other biz entities and are unsure how to handle a situation. They are super-useful people to have on your side.

[JustinoIV]

"You imply that it would be better value for money for the writer if managers could also negotiate the script deals they help to instigate. But as you know the vast majority of managers also attach themselves to produce -- that forms a large part of their motivation to manage the writer (or the project, depending on your pov) as best they can."

These managers sound like small scales hustlers. Your script stands the best chance of being made into a movie if you have an agent that can sell it to a studio or studio backed prodco.

So many scripts that optioned or that have these kinds of attachments never get made.

"A (good) manager can be invaluable in so many ways. They'll help you sort through your various concepts and figure out which are the best ones to be developing at any given time. They'll work closely with you on the script, helping to develop it into the most sale-able property possible. They'll work on pitches with you, giving you feedback on how to punch up your presentation and what areas to focus on."


It sounds like you have a co writer here. If that's the case, you may end up paying far more than 15%.

"They'll get you hooked up with all sorts of cool people in the biz."


This is quite true, but beware. I once submitted a script to a "producer". He turned out to be one of those manager/producers you talked about. He claimed that some people were interested in a horror script and he's like to pass it on. They'd want to attach themselves. Supposedly it was going to be a done deal.

So anyway, I give him permission to submit to those people. It turns out they were two screenwriters supposedly under a couple of work for hire deadlines. They wanted to rewrite my script, and submit it to their agent with all of their names on it. After they read my script they just asked that I mail it to the agent (I did not sign any agreement with them, nor did they rewrite my script).
They'll massage your ego and do a lot of idiot-proofing for you when you're talking to prodcos and other biz entities and are unsure how to handle a situation. They are super-useful people to have on your side."

[JustinoIV]

This is quite true, but beware. I once submitted a script to a "producer". He turned out to be one of those manager/producers you talked about. He claimed that some people were interested in a horror script and he's like to pass it on. They'd want to attach themselves. Supposedly it was going to be a done deal.

So anyway, I give him permission to submit to those people. It turns out they were two screenwriters supposedly under a couple of work for hire deadlines. They wanted to rewrite my script, and submit it to their agent with all of their names on it. After they read my script they just asked that I mail it to the agent (I did not sign any agreement with them, nor did they rewrite my script).

I rejected the entire deal. What would have happened is that any proceeds from the sale would have been divided up between myself, and the other two screenwriters, and the manager would have taken 25%.

So I would have gotten 25% of a script I wrote (actually less, because the agent would have taken 10%). The deal would have been for $50000 (the script sale). Agent would have taken 10%, and I would have taken $10,000.

So after telling all parties no, I then decided I only deal with mainstream agents.

[Camera Obscura]

Just because a manager is helping you develop or polish a script does not mean he/she becomes a co-writer. When you're working on a studio film you will have numerous executives helping you develop the script, even more so than a manager would. Does that mean they get co-writing credit too?

Think a little.

[Augie Kestrel]

If you're referring to Justino's post, I think the point was that this guy never really intended to be his "manager" at all. He just talked the talk. He really was more interested in being a producer.

At least, that was my take. But then, I'm tired. :)

[BROUGHCUT]

"These managers sound like small scales hustlers. "

Perhaps if you had posted a topic first asking for Managers with great rep (and it wasn't hijacked by an alien) you wouldn't have got burned.

[JustinoIV]

I did not give them one sent, and I did not accept the deal. So I'm not burned.

However, it is why I'm personally do not see the need for the manager, who can not close the sale, and who isn't a lawyer.

If you must have a manager, be very, very careful, or else you may end up having a huge chunk taken out of your deal.

[Gary Whitta]

Justino, with all due respect you really don't sound like someone who knows what he's talking about. As another poster rightly said, managers (alongside producers, development execs and all kinds of other "creatives") may indeed (and usually do) have strong input in helping writers develop their scripts, from pre-first-draft story focus to fifth-rewrite dialog tweaks. But this does not make them a co-writer, nor would any reputable manager seek to establish themselves as such.

It sounds like you've had some bad experiences with various low-rent opportunists and rip-off artists. There are certainly plenty of those out there, and one indeed should be careful. But since this was a thread about *reputable* managers, I posted my thoughts on what writers can (and should) expect from a reputable manager.

[JustinoIV]

"As another poster rightly said, managers (alongside producers, development execs and all kinds of other "creatives") may indeed (and usually do) have strong input in helping writers develop their scripts, from pre-first-draft story focus to fifth-rewrite dialog tweaks. But this does not make them a co-writer, nor would any reputable manager seek to establish themselves as such."

Producers and development executives do indeed have in strong input in developing scripts, when the writer has been HIRED or when the project has been PURCHASED. Of course that does not make them co-writers.

In regards to managers, depending on how much they helped a screenwriters, there are indeed managers who would try to establish themselves as co-writers. The con artists I came across hadn't anything and they attempted to attach themselves as co writers (with their so called manager, taking 75% of the sale)! So yes, be very, very careful in letting people help you with their scripts. If your manager or someone else substantially contributed to the development of your script, they may indeed be able to get a big chunk or your earnings. It's easier for a con artist to be a "manager" because managers are not licensed by the state. Agents are licensed and you can look up their numbers with the state of California(www.dir.ca.gov/ftproot/TALENTA.TXT). (http://www.dir.ca.gov/ftproot/TALENTA.TXT).) An advantage to dealing with agents and lawyers only is neither the agent and the lawyer can attach himself/herself to your project, or establish themselves as co-writers.

[Camera Obscura]

Justino, a bit of advice to avoid being scammed again.

Educate yourself.

It also helps to know what you're talking about. Good luck.

[JustinoIV]

A word of advice to yourself, Camera.

Learn how to read. I was not scammed. That what a proposal I rejected.

All I have said here is that I am only interested in the future in dealing with mainstream agents and entertainment lawyers.

If I'm so wrong, please tell me how I'm so wrong. If you're such a successful screenwriter, feel free to reveal your name and telephone to me in a private message. I'll be more than happy to intern under you.

Well?

[cluckyburger]

justino
i guess your claim that it's easier for managers to be slime b/c they're unregulated is potentially accurate but that doesn't mean that managers are always slime. fact is, nobody worth your time in LA would pull that. align yourself with a winner

[Writorman]

Justino, you'd be doing yourself a great favor by refraining from giving your two "sents" on this board. There is nothing more irritating than a writer with no experience arguing about something he/she has limited knowledge on. You're not impressing anyone here (notice how no one rushed to welcome you to LA in your other post).

"The way of a fool seems right to him, but a wise man listens to advice."

[Gary Whitta]

"In regards to managers, depending on how much they helped a screenwriters, there are indeed managers who would try to establish themselves as co-writers. The con artists I came across hadn't anything and they attempted to attach themselves as co writers"

Justino, once again your view on this issue is colored by your limited, and negative, experiences with con artists and scammers. However, the original question was about *reputable* managers. Perhaps when you have actually dealt with one you'd be in a better position to contribute to this discussion.

[JakeSchuster aka Ostroff]

A (good) manager can be invaluable in so many ways. They'll help you sort through your various concepts and figure out which are the best ones to be developing at any given time. They'll work closely with you on the script, helping to develop it into the most sale-able property possible. They'll work on pitches with you, giving you feedback on how to punch up your presentation and what areas to focus on. They'll get you hooked up with all sorts of cool people in the biz. They'll massage your ego and do a lot of idiot-proofing for you when you're talking to prodcos and other biz entities and are unsure how to handle a situation. They are super-useful people to have on your side.


This has been my experience entirely with my manager.