Is my lawyer doing his job?

[elephant1978]

I hooked up with an entertainment attorney through a friend about 2 months ago. I know he's reputable, that's been proven to me. Problem is, I told him my concern was getting a manager or agent in the next few months. He said he has people he can refer me to after he looks at the work. So far, he's had my scripts for 3 weeks and hasn't looked at them. He made one call to one company about a reality pitch I have (2 months ago!!!) and still no news. He has invited me to a couple social events where I met some good connections--but no follow up by him. I emailed him for an update about the reality company and my scripts and the response is simply another invite to a social event. Just ignores my question.

Now I know a lawyer's job is to do contracts. But part of his selling point was helping me get a rep, which in reality, is what I need to get work and get him contracts to do. But I can't help but feel sidelined here. If he was an agent/manager, he'd be in the trash can already. But what should I do with this guy? He said he'd go the extra mile for me and hasn't. Or am I expecting too much from a lawyer?

Ele...

[zz9]

I'd assume he has a lot of work, so maybe it takes time for him to look at your work or get second opinions, he doesn't want to put his rep at risk by recommending sub standard work.

Bottom line is, he will want you to get some deals, 'cos that's when he gets paid!

However, without knowing him or the full facts he could just be useless.

If you've met a few connections at parties I'd concentrate on following up with them, without pestering them of course.

[diehardatthegetty]

It isn't really your lawyer's job to find you representation or find your work. They may offer to do this, but you shouldn't expect him to make it a priority. If he is a busy, reputable lawyer, he was doing you a favor in "taking you on" without your being already represented - did you sign an official contingency retainer with him?

As a friend of a friend, he is trying to be nice because it's practically risk-free (unless you bring him tiny deals and contracts that require more time than their worth). He probably has enough work as it is from paying clients.

The best way you can use an attorney in this situation is to get him (or his assistant) to agree to send your stuff out for you, i.e. after you've done the leg work of getting your work requested (through queries etc). Make it as painless as possible for the lawyer and his firm - e.g. give them copies in advance etc.

In cold queries to prodcos, if the lawyer/firm is reputable, citing their name is almost as good as having an agent - you'll get requests/reads where you might not have otherwise.

count your blessings at this point.

dh

[JustinoIV]

This depends on the entertainment attorney, but many may not be interested in making submissions. Going over contracts and doing other kinds of work that they can charge their hourly fees on is usually what they are interested in.

So you may have to be willing to find an agent or a manager on your own. Sometimes personal connections can get us only so far, the rest is up to you.

[jimjimgrande]

Not to attack you personally ele - just make you think -

but these complaints about your lawyer sound just like the complaints you had against your old boss.

Maybe it's the way you deal with these people, or perhaps you have unrealistic expectations.

getting no response for submitted work is par for the course a lot of the time - and what kind of follow up are you looking for when you've made personal contact with people? I don't get that.

You want to work for you? Give him more of your work.

[elephant1978]

grande,

My complaints about my lawyer and my old boss are exactly the same. The reason for those complaints are simple--both offered to do things for me and never did. To make it clear, I never asked for their help. They offered. I did, however, follow up on their offer. Let's face it, if you don't chase these people down they won't get off their ass. So, no, I don't think it's me. I feel I've been very patient--especially with my old boss. That friendship is still very strong. I still get more offers to help. Still no action. It's just him. He's lazy. I accept that now.

The follow up I'm looking for is for these people to make the calls they promise to make. In the case of my old boss, fine, he didn't do it and that sucks. But the lawyer--he technically works for me. I pay him. So I think he should try very hard to keep me happy. Because right now, I'm thinking I'll drop his ass when I get a manager or agent and get a new lawyer that they recommend when a deal comes around. Because of his actions he'll miss out. I'm simply saying--this guy doesn't seem like he's trying very hard.

And in response to something earlier, he's not repping me as a favor to a friend. I met him through a friend who's roomie is his assistant. That's it.

Ele...

[JustinoIV]

"Because right now, I'm thinking I'll drop his ass when I get a manager or agent and get a new lawyer that they recommend when a deal comes around. Because of his actions he'll miss out. I'm simply saying--this guy doesn't seem like he's trying very hard."

If you feel you aren't a good match, then when you do get an agent or a manager you should get a new lawyer. You're the one facing the situation, so you know best.

[Hamboogul]

Justino,

I dunno... You speak of the value of a manager but I just don't think you ever need one. I mean, you are giving... what, like 10, 15, (and from some posters on DD I heard about, 25) percent for what? Just to help you get a lawyer?

I'm sure you know what you are talking about but I dunno. Do you really need a manager?

[JustinoIV]

"I'm sure you know what you are talking about but I dunno. Do you really need a manager?"

It was the so called producer/manager who wanted 25%, and who attempted to do the attachhments (the other screenwriters.

I do need representation, just not a manager. It's just my personal preference for a good agent. (I can easily get a lawyer) So if you can recommend someone, I'm all yours.................

[filmcarver]

ele

you've been here before with this stuff and quite frankly, I'm beginning to think you may just not get it for this biz. many don't.

this attorney does not need a career, you do. that is his message by inviting you to gatherings where you could make valuable contacts and sink or swim on your own merit and hard work, not his. did you pass the bar exam?

attorneys put together deals for pay and make introductions when it has a chance of expanding their interests. it sounds as if he is going well beyond the average reponse.

this is not a business of quacking out a decent script and sitting back on presumed promises, it's the quick and dead.

all in love, bro

[Channel Zero]

I'm curious to know if you're expectations for your attorney match his relative position in the business.

My lawyer got me my agent. But my attorney was at an top of a line firm, and landing there with him was a stroke of good fortune. My writing partner and I hadn't done anything yet, and this firm represents A list talent like Nicole Kidman and Owen Wilson.

But he really responded to our material, and decided to take us on as clients. And at that first meeting, he said, 'I think the first order of business is to get you guys an agent'.

He approached a lot of agents and agencies over the next 5 months, before we finally landed with our current agent. So think about it. Even with a big time guy out there pushing hard for us, it still took months before an agent agreed to take on a couple of new guys.

I don't know anything about your lawyer, but is he the kidn of guy who can get your stuff in to an agent at the agencies?
Have you had this conversation with him? If not, you should.

And I agree with some of the other posters. Sitting back and waiting for people to do something for you doesn't work. You need to be out shaking the trees for yourself as well.

The people that make it in this business are the ones who work all the angles.

[elephant1978]

this is not a business of quacking out a decent script and sitting back on presumed promises, it's the quick and dead.

Carver, all in love my ass. This is quite an implication considering you've never read any of my work. And I never said I wasn't out there "shaking trees." All I said was I have a lawyer who made some offers and hasn't delivered on them. I make efforts every day to find representation and get my work read. I don't appreciate the accusation that I'm sitting on my ass waiting for people to do things for me. I love how a simple question on whether or not a lawyer is doing his job gives people a greenlight for cheap shots.

Ele...

[burnaise]

to move past the personal nonsense...

it sounds like your lawyer has made perfectly clear how he defines his role. he's willing to open the doors for you at social events and handle any legal work you may have.

but it appears that that's as far as the relationship is going to go. as unfortunate as that may be, it's not that bad. graciously accept the continued invitations, and if something should break from them great. otherwise, you're going to have to come to terms with the fact that he's not going to call on agents he knows to get you a rep. that's pretty clearly going to have to come from somewhere else (despite his initial assurance).

you'll have to find a different angle...

as a last resort, call (don't email anymore since he can easily duck your email question) and ask directly, "will you call these agents in my behalf and recommend me this week?" if not, you know where you stand...but frankly, i think you know the answer already.

[filmcarver]

My comment was NOT (edit) meant as cheap shot, but a pointed comment in the hope it would jerk your chain hard enough to conjole you to action. What your work looks like is meaningless to the situation. I assume it is pretty good, or the attorney certainly would not have made any attempt to expose you to his circle of friends.

One day you will realize the best business advice you ever got was virtually always the advice you liked the least at the time you received it.

And if I did not care, I sure as hell would not have taken the time to respond at all.

[Augie Kestrel]

I thought filmcarver's original post was good advice, not a cheap shot. It's the "squeaky wheel" thing. No one here can tell you if your lawyer is doing what YOU think he should be doing. In the immortal words of the late Frank Reynolds, you've got to "nail it down". If you don't turn up the heat on your lawyer, he won't do any more for you than he's doing already. At least he's providing you with plenty of opportunities to make new contacts. A lot of writers would kill for an attorney like that. I'd keep this guy, if only for the things he's already shown he's willing to do. You can always hook up with another lawyer, too. You two don't have a contract, do you?

And filmcarver didn't make any disparaging remarks on the quality of your writing, either. I don't know how you came up with that.

[elephant1978]

his is not a business of quacking out a decent script and sitting back on presumed promises, it's the quick and dead.

To quote the same thing again, this is what bothtered me about carver's post. It seems to suggest to me that he believes I'm writing mediocre stuff and expecting others to get me noticed.

All I'm saying is that I work very hard on pursuing interest in my work. I don't like the implication that I'm lazy just because I expect people to live up to their promises.

Again, carver suggests it here:

My comment was meant as cheap shot, but a pointed comment in the hope it would jerk your chain hard enough to conjole you to action

Why is it that you think I need to be pushed to take action with my career? I asked a focused question on one of my pursuits. I didn't say it was my only pursuit.

And Augie, as for the squeaky wheel thing. I agree completely. That's one reason I'm disappointed in this lawyer's lack of response despite my continuous efforts to get him to follow up on his offers. I have turned up the heat quite a bit and am not getting great results. But I don't think carver is suggesting I be the squeaky wheel. He's suggesting I be more pro-active in getting my career moving, that I stop expecting others to help me. That, I feel, is unwarranted for the question I asked and an opinion based on personal info about me that he doesn't have. That's what pissed me off.

As for the lawyer...I'm still not sure. It's most likely a dead issue on this board now. It's gotten too personal to get unbiased info. I'll just follow my instincts on it.

Ele...

[LauriD]

Three weeks is nothing. If it was 3 months, you might have something to complain about -- to the board, not to the lawyer.

Sounds like this guy is doing you a FAVOR. I assume you haven't paid anything yet, and the attorney is investing in you as a potential client. The fact that he's inviting you to meet people is FABULOUS. You should be sending him fruit baskets, not dissing him on DD.

So give it some time and pursue your own leads. If someone needs you to submit via a lawyer, you've got one.

It took my lawyer about a year and several referrals to agents and managers to finally hook me up with an agent who responded to my work. I am not complaining ONE LITTLE BIT -- I'm delighted that he was willing to stick with me this long and feel that he's certainly earned my business.

LauriD

[seeb55]

Reading through the responses in this thread, it seems like the original poster (Ele) takes things a little too personally. Your comments make it seem like you are a little on the defensive side.

I'm willing to bet that same trait (being overly defensive, taking things too personally) has a detrimental effect on your business relationships in general.

Just because someone doesn't follow through with something doesn't mean they are lazy, perhaps they are busy. Don't take it as a personal knock against you or your writing.

Sometimes reps DO follow through and make the calls and the people they call might hate your work. Sometimes reps try to shield you from that rather than say, 'so and so, thinks this is crap'. Of course 'so and so' might be wrong, but a writer must develop a thick skin before being ready to hear something like that. Judging from your posts Ele, you take things too personally and would benefit from someone shielding you from the sometimes harsh reality. Maybe they are following through and getting rejected, maybe they aren't? I have no way of knowing. I offer this only as food for thought.

Of course that's just one hypothetical posibility, and but one person's opinion.

[elephant1978]

If I got answers as simple as "3 weeks is nothing, stick it out." then fine. But it frustrates me that the answer has to come along with people saying I'm defensive and need shelter from reality. Gimme a break. I just wanted a simple answer and as it typically happens on DD, people decide to judge instead of give facts. Go ahead and call this post defensive as well. I call it frustration.

Ele...

[JustinoIV]

Elephant, if you find that people here are unfairly hostile to you, you don't have to ask these people anything.

Don't you personally know entertainment industry professionals you can talk to and ask them questions like this?

This is not meant as an attack against you, I'm just offering you alternatives.

[filmcarver]

Again, no intent to insult or demean was ever present. Meat and potatoes is what you usually will get here and most certainly from the industry.

I think many here, certainly myself, were surprised you did not seem to have a grip on how desireable a situation with this attorney you were already in.

One thing is clear to me; the attorney either has other motivations (what who would know), or was testing you to see if you were ready to work the "rooms" and go after a career he can benefit putting his time into.

You were invited into arenas where you can expand valuable contacts that can make things happen for you, people who will root for you when the time and script is right.

This is an extremely hard to come by and desireable thing. You actually received some very excellent and thoughtful answers whether that makes sense just now or not.

Best of luck

[captain bligh]

three weeks is not a long time. you did not come to him with a deal, you came with (a) script(s) and ambition, but ambition doesn't pay anyone's mortgage. you're not a high priority, bottom line, nor should you expect to be. not that you should sit around and wait an indefinite period -- you shouldn't; check in, and keep reminding him that you're here, and if he still hasn't read your script after having it for three months, you have a real reason to complain -- but what you should do is, understand why in a three week period, a reputable lawyer who has clients' deals to negotiate, contracts to go over, people to yell at about clauses, a girlfriend and/or a wife and/or a boyfriend and/or a husband to deal with, etc., hasn't gotten to your scripts yet. (he doesn't even know if you can write; you know he's a lawyer.)

if he's invited you to several social events, provided contacts and made a couple phone calls about a reality series idea, he's done plenty. as of now, what have you done for him? the answer is, nothing. until the relationship turns from parasitic to symbiotic, it's just asking for an ulcer to count the minutes. he has clients who make him money now who need to be attended to first.

[vstm10]

I know you're a woman (you mentioned an husband).

I just bet you're attractive.

Maybe that's why you get unsolicited offers of help? Alluring offers that don't really deliver like you were led to believe? Maybe your ex boss is not lazy, he just enjoys your view?

Social events? Good Lord, take the chance and ride with it.
You have a good script, you have charm, use it.

And count you blessings.

[vstm10]

ps. you ARE aware that he's dating you, right?

[YeahWrite]

Ele - One thing you are not thinking about... it's pilot season.

If your entertainment attorney is at a good firm more than likely they're swamped with test and holding deals right now. Getting him to read a script at this time of year is not going to be the quickest thing. Just because you write features doesn't mean he/she doesn't handle actors or tv writers and a seven figure pilot contract may deserve more time than getting through your 120.

Give your attorney some time to read. In the meantime follow DH's advice and send letters mentioning that if the prodco is interested, you can have your firm send them a script. It's cool how being repped by a large firm grants you instant status.

Embrace the status.

[YeahWrite]

Ele - One more thing... don't be a dick. You threatening to drop your attorney the first chance you get is not cool. The fact that he is inviting you to social gatherings in a huge deal. Whether you realize it or not he's putting his rep on the line. If you do something stupid at one of these events it will reflect on him, the one that invited you. This business is a game of who you know and he is furthering your efforts by making sure you know more people.

So be grateful for these opportunities that your attorney is giving you. Not spiteful because he's not reading you fast enough.

[morphitologist]

I'm with Julie: Ele, you should feel lucky to be in such a predicament.

And I'll ape a few other posters: 3 weeks is NOT that much time! I'm sure you've got a feeling for how little people actually READ in this town. I'd say give him 2 months before asking - that's right, go ahead and ask him if he's read your stuff. And by the way; how many scripts did you give him to read?

Some more aping: Getting invites to parties is GOLDEN. How do you know your agent or manager isn't at the party, just waiting for you two to kvetch over martinis in the back patio? Introductions and invitations are almost as key in this town as a signed contract (okay, I said ALMOST).

I, too, understand the frustration caused by people not reading your stuff, or not getting back to you, or just plain not COMMUNICATING if they're too busy to do either (would it hurt to drop a simple email saying "not now - busy - be in touch soon"?).

But - as annoying as this is - people can sense your frustration, and it can often come off as "difficult writer" status with busy pros who've got real clients to feed. I say even if you are immensely frustrated, put a cap on it and be as cheery as you can to their faces.

Just my two pesos.