Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

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  • Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

    I have had my scripts available to download by "industry insiders" on sites like blklst and coverfly for some time now, and because they have done well in competitions, I get weekly notices that someone new has downloaded one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly more worried because in the last few years a number of movies and shows have come out that are unbelievably similar to something I wrote (but just different enough where I probably couldn't prove it). Again, I don't have any proof of stealing because I don't even know who downloaded the scripts and it could be untraceable as in a producer downloads it, sends it to his favorite writer and tells the to "write something similar" blah blah.

    What are your thoughts on this? As a writer trying to get repped and sell and break into the industry, this is frustrating and I'm wondering if my projects should even be "discoverable" on sites like this? But then again if they aren't, well then im even more invisible. Thank you.

  • #2
    Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

    I'm the last one to advise you, given that I'm still trying to "break in", in the traditional view, but posting scripts for "somebody" to download is pretty passive, in my view.

    You say you're looking for a rep (another semi-passive approach), and I've given up looking.

    But what I'm getting to is that you need to connect (in person, if you can, or on-line, via email or LinkedIn, etc.) and sell yourself and your work.

    Oh, and of course you're copyrighting everything you've written, right? Even if your stuff is stolen, and as you suggest it's far more likely that it might be "adapted" by somebody, with copyright protection you make friends with any attorney you end up with. Why? Because if you've registered the copyright then if ("when", hopefully) you win a plagiarism lawsuit, the attorney's massive fees are over and above the award. Lawyers love this.

    All I'm saying is that even if you've gotten good results in contest placements and Blcklst scores, you're leaving your progress up to invisible downloaders right now.

    Even without any sales, I've made some good buds, and very few enemies ("stop sending me emails"), via my on-line connections. The hope is that if/when I ever succeed I'm going to have lots of people in the biz to contact about helping out.

    That is, I do find that in the film biz everybody wants to be involved, but they all want somebody else to go first. You need that one foot in the door, eh?

    So get out there and sell your stuff via plenty of email queries; test their wording here under the appropriate topics on DDPro.

    Got money? Do InkTip or VPF if you can afford it. Do more contests if you can afford it. Pay for LinkedIn if you can afford it. A free LI membership, as I have, lets you do plenty, with nearly 75 industry connections made so far.

    But email is free. So is ScriptRevolution.com (and you don't have to publish the entire script; I only publish my query content).

    And be patient, and professional.

    G'luck!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

      Originally posted by sidgrey View Post
      I have had my scripts available to download by "industry insiders" on sites like blklst and coverfly for some time now, and because they have done well in competitions, I get weekly notices that someone new has downloaded one of them.

      I am becoming increasingly more worried because in the last few years a number of movies and shows have come out that are unbelievably similar to something I wrote (but just different enough where I probably couldn't prove it). Again, I don't have any proof of stealing because I don't even know who downloaded the scripts and it could be untraceable as in a producer downloads it, sends it to his favorite writer and tells the to "write something similar" blah blah.

      What are your thoughts on this? As a writer trying to get repped and sell and break into the industry, this is frustrating and I'm wondering if my projects should even be "discoverable" on sites like this? But then again if they aren't, well then im even more invisible. Thank you.
      Originally posted by catcon View Post
      ... of course you're copyrighting everything you've written, right? Even if your stuff is stolen, and as you suggest it's far more likely that it might be "adapted" by somebody, with copyright protection you make friends with any attorney you end up with. Why? Because if you've registered the copyright then if ("when", hopefully) you win a plagiarism lawsuit, the attorney's massive fees are over and above the award. Lawyers love this.
      How long is “some time, now”? Sometimes it takes years, even decades, for a film to be developed before it sees production. It’s uncanny how two screenwriters on opposite coasts of the United States can have similar storylines in their scripts at the same time. Is there a Universal Consciousness speaking to each of them? Who knows? It happens, though. If you think about it in the correct light, and given the constraints of a screenplay’s structure, the odds are good that it’s going to happen. Add to that all the imitative screenwriting of hit movies that goes on, it’s almost inevitable that people are going to have “eerily similar’” ideas for scripts.

      Generally speaking—and most screenwriters will tell you you’re paranoid and what you’re implying doesn’t go on—it’s less expensive for people to option your screenplay and pursue it from there rather than risk a lawsuit. Those same screenwriters say to be worried about this is the telltale sign of the neophyte and inexperienced screenwriter, one who is overly protective and precious about his or her work.

      On the other hand, if researchers found out that you did not register your screenplays with the U.S. Copyright Office (at $65 per script), then it could be open season on you, which is your fault. Registration with the WGA is less expensive, but offers little in the way of protection of Intellectual Property.

      A good rule of thumb, one which many contests tout in their submission guidelines, is not to submit until you’ve registered your script(s) with the U.S. Copyright Office. That advice also applies to submitting your scripts to places other than contests.
      Last edited by Clint Hill; 04-14-2020, 10:19 AM.
      “Nothing is what rocks dream about” ― Aristotle

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

        I used to register my scripts with WGAW before I had a dazzling epiphany moment, realizing no one in the business would ever want to steal 'em.

        A paper trail -- or a software trail -- is going to offer you some protection, screenplays uploaded to sites you don't own have a date stamp on them, proving you wrote this. I'm not saying that's ironclad evidence but it's gotta put someone off pilfering your script.

        Ideas can't be copyrighted though. If someone wanted to take your concept and re-do it as their own unique story, you're pretty screwed as regards making a claim on it.

        Also no idea is unique, someone's going to come up with something similar no matter how much you protect your writing. A million wannabe screenwriters tapping on their keyboards, one of 'em is bound to write a near-identical story to yours sometime. It happens. Might have happened last week.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

          I’m not overly worried about it, yet I know some people it’s happened to.

          Like --

          One was a line producer who also wrote scripts (low budget) and found the very company who turned him down made his exact script and discovered it in the (then) VHS bin at Oddessy Video.

          Another was a WGA award winner who had also headed a mini-major that made some very classic films back in the day (you’d think he’d have enough juice/friends but…)

          Who together with a newcomer worked on a script, got it to a star, got in negotiations with a big 3 network and they ripped them off.

          Eventually went to court and the very day the trial was to start they got made an offer they couldn’t refuse (he told me they expected to lose since the big 3 network got the star to turn on them).

          And in the last few years someone told me about a spec similar to a produced film (again with notable stars, etc.) like this... [I changed some of the words to protect the innocent (me)]

          Code:
                    SCRIPT A                                               SCRIPT B
            But. We're not going to.                       But. We're not going to.
             
            All ears on Trump.                                  All ears on Biden.
             
                    SCRIPT A                                         SCRIPT B
            Just to make it clear, there is                Just to make it clear. There is
            absolutely no ****ing way we are going            absolutely no ****ing way we are going to
            to do that.                                            we are going do to that
             
            Ears still on Trump                                 All ears still on Biden
          And so on for 6 pages, from what I was told.

          Same rep also had a different writer do a blatant knock-off of a classic Twilight Zone as a feature.

          So look on the bright side, they have a lot of Rod Serling and others to go through before they reach you!

          So stuff happens. Still… I guess the lesson is simply be so good they need you more than they need to rip you off.
          Last edited by AK7576; 04-14-2020, 10:35 AM. Reason: Remove extra spacing between paragraphs

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

            A long time ago, when I first started writing screenplays, I thought I was ripped off by a producer I had never submitted a certain screenplay to -- but he could have accessed my script through other means. I contacted an entertainment attorney to see if I had any case. He told me three things:
            1. I would have to prove a definitive link (i.e. paper trail) showing that the producer did read my script.
            2. In addition to proving a link, I would have to show that not only the concept was the same, but I'd have to make a long list showing specific similarities in terms of characters, scenes, structure, dialogue, etc.
            3. Unless I had definitive proof of the link plus that list of very specific similarities, no lawyer would take my case on a contingency basis.

            A WGA registration and/or U.S. Library of Congress copyright would be less important than the points above. I know people have been ripped off, but you can't worry about it or you'll never move ahead. You should still register your stuff and always keep a log of your submissions/rejections -- but keep writing and submitting. And remember that even though you may think your concept/script is one-of-a-kind, that's rarely the case. Unless it's based on a true story and you own the rights, chances are that someone else somewhere has written something similar.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

              I'm a skeptic. And a realist. Without proof, claims like this don't hold a lot of water with me. That's my own opinion. Nor do I give them a lot of weight if they are hearsay, and have nothing to back them up.

              It can seem that writing is so similar that it seems stolen, but more times than not, nothing has been stolen. Does it happen? I don't know, I've never really seen a story that proved something WAS stolen.

              Originally posted by AK7576 View Post
              I'm not overly worried about it, yet I know some people it's happened to.

              Like --

              One was a line producer who also wrote scripts (low budget) and found the very company who turned him down made his exact script and discovered it in the (then) VHS bin at Oddessy Video.
              What did this writer do about it? Stating that it's the EXACT script seems the writer would have a viable claim, right?

              Another was a WGA award winner who had also headed a mini-major that made some very classic films back in the day (you'd think he'd have enough juice/friends but...)

              Who together with a newcomer worked on a script, got it to a star, got in negotiations with a big 3 network and they ripped them off.

              Eventually went to court and the very day the trial was to start they got made an offer they couldn't refuse (he told me they expected to lose since the big 3 network got the star to turn on them).
              I'm not sure I'm understanding this statement clearly. Are you saying the writer lost out, because the network turned the actor on them? Or are you saying the network settled with the writer because the actor turned on the network?

              If this was a civil suit, it would be in the public record as a filing, right?

              It would have been in the trades (Deadline or THR) no? Can you point us to the case?


              And in the last few years someone told me about a spec similar to a produced film (again with notable stars, etc.) like this... [I changed some of the words to protect the innocent (me)]

              Code:
                        SCRIPT A                                               SCRIPT B
                But. We're not going to.                       But. We're not going to.
                 
                All ears on Trump.                                  All ears on Biden.
                 
                        SCRIPT A                                         SCRIPT B
                Just to make it clear, there is                Just to make it clear. There is
                absolutely no ****ing way we are going            absolutely no ****ing way we are going to
                to do that.                                            we are going do to that
                 
                Ears still on Trump                                 All ears still on Biden
              Were the pages similar or exact. What you're showing above is EXACT. Changing a name is not changing the writing. So was it really exact?

              And if it was, did the writer do anything about it?

              Sometimes I can rewrite lines of dialogue and say the same thing in a variety of ways. Anyone else could do the same, but if someone used 6 pages of my script and I could prove that 1) my draft predates their draft, AND 2) they read my script before they wrote their draft and 3) it was EXACTLY the same, I would do something about it.

              But if it's SIMILAR, and they had no access to my script, it doesn't mean anything to me.

              And so on for 6 pages, from what I was told.
              I'd need to see proof before I repeated a story like this as fact. Otherwise the claim means nothing, really. Should be easy enough to prove.

              Same rep also had a different writer do a blatant knock-off of a classic Twilight Zone as a feature.
              There's a difference between plagiarizing and writing something similar. Look at the movies Rear Window and Disturbia, which have very similar plots. Disturbia won the suit that claimed they copied Rear Window.

              https://www.reuters.com/article/us-d...68L00E20100922

              So, there are different ways to look at "ripped off," I think.

              So look on the bright side, they have a lot of Rod Serling and others to go through before they reach you!

              So stuff happens. Still... I guess the lesson is simply be so good they need you more than they need to rip you off.
              Hard to say if it's true if there's no proof.
              "Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy b/c you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say." -- Edward Snowden

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                Originally posted by catcon View Post
                I'm the last one to advise you, given that I'm still trying to "break in", in the traditional view, but posting scripts for "somebody" to download is pretty passive, in my view.

                You say you're looking for a rep (another semi-passive approach), and I've given up looking.

                But what I'm getting to is that you need to connect (in person, if you can, or on-line, via email or LinkedIn, etc.) and sell yourself and your work.

                Oh, and of course you're copyrighting everything you've written, right? Even if your stuff is stolen, and as you suggest it's far more likely that it might be "adapted" by somebody, with copyright protection you make friends with any attorney you end up with. Why? Because if you've registered the copyright then if ("when", hopefully) you win a plagiarism lawsuit, the attorney's massive fees are over and above the award. Lawyers love this.

                All I'm saying is that even if you've gotten good results in contest placements and Blcklst scores, you're leaving your progress up to invisible downloaders right now.

                Even without any sales, I've made some good buds, and very few enemies ("stop sending me emails"), via my on-line connections. The hope is that if/when I ever succeed I'm going to have lots of people in the biz to contact about helping out.

                That is, I do find that in the film biz everybody wants to be involved, but they all want somebody else to go first. You need that one foot in the door, eh?

                So get out there and sell your stuff via plenty of email queries; test their wording here under the appropriate topics on DDPro.

                Got money? Do InkTip or VPF if you can afford it. Do more contests if you can afford it. Pay for LinkedIn if you can afford it. A free LI membership, as I have, lets you do plenty, with nearly 75 industry connections made so far.

                But email is free. So is ScriptRevolution.com (and you don't have to publish the entire script; I only publish my query content).

                And be patient, and professional.

                G'luck!
                Catcon, I would love to hear how you use LinkedIn to make industry connections. Thank you.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                  Originally posted by sidgrey View Post
                  I have had my scripts available to download by "industry insiders" on sites like blklst and coverfly for some time now, and because they have done well in competitions, I get weekly notices that someone new has downloaded one of them.

                  I am becoming increasingly more worried because in the last few years a number of movies and shows have come out that are unbelievably similar to something I wrote (but just different enough where I probably couldn't prove it). Again, I don't have any proof of stealing because I don't even know who downloaded the scripts and it could be untraceable as in a producer downloads it, sends it to his favorite writer and tells the to "write something similar" blah blah.

                  What are your thoughts on this? As a writer trying to get repped and sell and break into the industry, this is frustrating and I'm wondering if my projects should even be "discoverable" on sites like this? But then again if they aren't, well then im even more invisible. Thank you.
                  I say this without an ounce of paranoia left in me, but I'm fairly certain I've been ripped off. In most cases, there's nothing we can do.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                    Warning: long post ahead. Everything others have shared is true. Usually, it's not worth it for producers to "steal" your script and you cannot copyright an "idea," which makes it possible for someone else to take that idea, change it just enough to avoid lawsuits, then take credit for it.

                    Not only has it happened to me, I spoke to veteran staff writers on hit TV shows and the writer of an iconic sci-fi movie who shared their experiences of being ripped off by producers and fellow screenwriters. I won't say who because they also said if they had gone public, there was a good chance they'd be blackballed and never hired again by producers who fear being sued.

                    I always assumed that entering contests was a safe way of putting my stuff out there and protecting it at the same time, since it would prove my screenplay was written and being read by other people. What happens though if your scripts are advancing in contests is that you get read by a lot of judges -- and people in the business that they might share your script with (usually they will ask you if that's okay).

                    So, many years ago I wrote a script about an aspiring actress in NYC who gets hired by a mysterious woman to be a nanny -- to a lifelike doll. Turns out the actress is being framed for the death of the woman's real baby, and the actress must elude police until she can find out why she was framed. Any similarities to SERVANT on Apple TV is "probably" a coincidence... which is ironic, since a woman who wrote and produced a movie about a girl who befriends a neighbor that treats a doll like it was a real baby, accused the makers of SERVANT of ripping her off. Her movie came out about 10 years after my script was a finalist in a number of contests and read by dozens of people in the business.

                    I could shrug it off as mere coincidence, except for something else that happened a few years ago. After that same doll script had made the contest rounds, I was watching LAW & ORDER. There was an episode in which a nanny was pushing a baby carriage and there was a doll in it instead of baby. Eh, no big deal. But then there were other scenes that seemed very similar to my screenplay.

                    So I googled the producers. Lo and behold, one of them was also a judge in a small contest my script was a finalist in -- and that same L&O producer was sued by another writer who had been a finalist in that same contest in a prior year. The writer lost in court.

                    Parallel development of ideas is common. Writers and artists read the same things or experience similar events. I also think that writers/readers in contests may come across scripts they feel have good ideas that aren't well executed, and they might take a stab at putting their own spin on it, or talk about it with their contacts in the business. Nothing you can do about that, especially if it's subject material in the public domain. The best you can do is try to make your script the best you can before you start sending it out for others to read, I guess.

                    I have another long story involving a sci-fi script that I have very good reason to believe was plagiarized, and consulted my former manager on taking action. She used to rep Tarantino, so she was ready to pull the trigger. However, that same TV series had ripped off other movies and writers to such a degree that I said, forget it. It's Chinatown, Jake. Sigh.

                    And yet, I think you have to take that risk and get your scripts out there, anyway you can to people who may be able to help your career.

                    Thanks for letting me get this off my chest. Fortunately, I've written other scripts that have been optioned or gotten me meetings with high level TV execs, and are still alive... provided someone else doesn't get something similar greenlighted before my projects!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                      Originally posted by MargoChanning View Post
                      Catcon, I would love to hear how you use LinkedIn to make industry connections. Thank you.
                      Well, there're the instructions on LI, but you'd love to see a real-world example, eh?

                      I just got connected to a CEO of a production company yesterday. Well, that was through a certain wording of the connection request (a proposal) that I sent, plus the timing, plus mainly, hopefully, my I.P. and my LinkedIn profile itself. His response? A terse "free free to send". (The kind of "terse" we like to see!)

                      Here's my profile link, FYI: (Your personal link like this is what you might start to put on all your emails, in addition to ScriptRevolution, Blklst, your own website, etc.)

                      https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevegarry

                      I'm pretty busy these days (frankly, I've ramped up my marketing, and polishing, since the big "P" began), but I'll put something together.

                      Honestly, though, when researching I'd run EVERY name and contact I find in any other source through LI before you email/phone whatever.

                      It seems to me that companies don't keep their "people" info as up-to-date on IMDB etc., as they do their slates - and even then. Some of their people contacts lists are stale-dated by several years. Meanwhile, LI profiles are essentially a person's on-line resume. Members have a vested interest in keeping them more current than most sources, sometimes even more than their own websites when they have them.

                      And then there're the clickable links/filters (to past companies, and thus to current/past employees there, websites, and thus to email domain structures, etc.) It's the searching and drilling down that you can do, to come up with incredible stuff. Being an ex-database guy, before I retired, that's the best thing about LI (along with the currency of its data, most of the time).

                      Essentially, then, even with a free profile you get an incredible amount of info. You can't just connect to "anybody" (unless you're lucky), but it's a great tool. I don't have any real "money deals" yet, but for instance I've made connections to film financiers, etc. that might help when that big day comes.

                      I'll put something together when I have some down-time, and when I figure out how to do something useful without disclosing names or specific strategy in that case (sorry ).

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                        Originally posted by richfigel View Post
                        Warning: long post ahead. Everything others have shared is true. Usually, it's not worth it for producers to "steal" your script and you cannot copyright an "idea," which makes it possible for someone else to take that idea, change it just enough to avoid lawsuits, then take credit for it.

                        ...

                        Thanks for letting me get this off my chest. Fortunately, I've written other scripts that have been optioned or gotten me meetings with high level TV execs, and are still alive... provided someone else doesn't get something similar greenlighted before my projects!
                        Read it all but truncated it.

                        I will say this. With all the scripts that managers, agents, producers, studio execs, network execs, and, yes, even writers have read, it is entirely possible and even more than tha,t likely, that more than once, someone working on a project has had an idea that they believe is their own, but unintentionally pulled from something they read in the past.

                        It's impossible to read all that material and be able to separate out a story beat of a pitch you read three years ago. If it was a cool idea, chances are they don't even know where it came from. They just think it's their own idea. I've experienced this specifically myself.

                        I think that's fair to admit.
                        Last edited by finalact4; 04-20-2020, 08:43 AM.
                        "Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy b/c you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say." -- Edward Snowden

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                          I think there are two things to keep in mind:

                          1. You can't work if no one reads your writing. So you need to get it out to everyone who could possibly help, not guard it.

                          2. The key to being successful is to be valued as a writer. The execution of your script is more important than the plot and character elements in it. You want people to read your work and want to hire you to write other things.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                            Originally posted by finalact4 View Post
                            Read it all but truncated it.
                            If it was a cool idea, chances are they don't even know where it came from. They just think it's there own idea. I've experienced this specifically myself
                            Story time. A couple of years ago I was working as the writer's room assistant on a basic cable series. It was one of the best rooms I've had of the pleasure of working in. The writers were all terrific and friendly and there was never any toxicity or politicking. But what really made it great was that the writers (from the showrunner down) were really cool with letting the writer's assistant (me) pitch in the room. The TV folks on this board can back me up that this doesn't always happen since sometimes showrunners just want the writer's assistant to keep their trap shut and type.

                            So one day we were trying to break a particularly tricky piece of story and just couldn't seem to nail it. A really cool solution popped into my mind and I threw it out to the room. All the other writers were really into my pitch ... except for the EP level writer who ran the room in the showrunner's absence. And to be fair he wasn't belittling or dismissive. He just didn't think it was the right play for us to bring to the showrunner, expressed as much, and because he was the boss we all moved on. I think we ended up putting a pin in the problem we were trying to solve.

                            I'd actually forgotten about it until a week or two later when the room went back to brainstorming a solution to that same narrative problem. And amidst all the writer's pitches that same EP takes the floor and suggests to the room MY PITCH! MY EXACT SAME PITCH FROM A WEEK AGO! The one everyone loved except him. And of course we went with it.

                            Maybe he did steal my pitch. But to this day I actually believe this is what happened: He heard my pitch in the room and dismissed it. He forgot about it and got busy doing other work. And then two weeks later, with fresh perspective, the idea popped back into his mind. Except he didn't remember that he'd heard it from someone else.

                            All that is to say that while there are totally thiefs in this business (and I'll challenge anyone who says otherwise) there are also plenty of people who hear ideas, forget about them, and then remember them later as their own. Hell, I'm sure I've done it too.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Thought on scripts being stolen and used?

                              Originally posted by JS90 View Post
                              I'd actually forgotten about it until a week or two later when the room went back to brainstorming a solution to that same narrative problem. And amidst all the writer's pitches that same EP takes the floor and suggests to the room MY PITCH! MY EXACT SAME PITCH FROM A WEEK AGO! The one everyone loved except him. And of course we went with it.
                              Super tale. But how annoying is that?! Everyone else in the room didn't shout, "HEY THAT WAS JS90'S PITCH!" -- or at least look at you and raise their eyebrows to say WTF?

                              Comment

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