New Lottery - volume II

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    allright folks - let's get your bets in.

    Now we know one of the previous posters is, in fact, an Alien. I had suspected, but a response to Tao's words have confirmed it for me. Any guesses?

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Huh?

      Tao, sincere thanks for that post. More appreciation then you can know. You've given me validation for my own current feelings about screenwriting. I don't want my writing to CAUSE me pressure and stress. I want it to be my escape from pressure and stress. And it is. Until I start worrying about whether I have "it", about whether my idea is original, commercial, high-concept, about whether I should be starting with an outline or index cards instead of just writing.

      Maybe someday, my writing will improve to the point that someone will want to buy one of my stories. And I can walk into a theater and see people laughing or crying at words I wrote, bonding with characters I created. That would be a wonderful dream.

      Until then, I'd like to do what so many people have said with sarcasm...write for myself. It seems, sometimes, there's a look-down-my-nose attitude on people that write because they enjoy it, without focusing on the Big Prize. Well, I accept that I may not have what it takes, but I still want to write for everything it does for me, as a person. I still want to feel the satisfaction of seeing my work improve, of someday having written the best story I'm capable of writing.

      Okay, I'll stop now.

      The basic point: Thanks, Tao. You've made a difference for me.

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Huh?

        lancer,

        if you won't say what your native language is, at least share with us which level of ESL class you're taking at community college.

        Comment


        • #34
          New Chicago a Mega City of the Federation Empire.

          are you here on a secret mission?

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: New Chicago a Mega City of the Federation Empire.

            at least tell us the enigmatic and cryptic origins of the name "lancer"!

            Comment


            • #36
              I'm no God or a modern day prophet... CRASH

              Sorry for your lack of understanding me. So, I will try to explain myself.

              I think of my self as a simple man, that doesnâ€TMt make so much money. I seldom go to the show. I also think there are many just like me. These men and women that Hollywood wants to attract. And this is why movies are made...

              Take the Rock's movie "Scorpion King" I havenâ€TMt seen it either, but I could guess itâ€TMs a good movie for a person like me to enjoy. But if I look at the "Writing" of the movie I could only guess that is very bad (to a writers point of view.)

              Why is that?

              Just like so many posts of people complaining why such and such did this and this and not that and that. Its not the point as why they (the script writer) didn't follow the rules, it beyond that. The real secret is "Hook, Line, and Sinker"

              As I've explained earlier, the person that is looking at the script is looking for a movie that can be made. Not a well-written script. But a possible movie. They are not going to buy a script unless they think they could get a big return. Most of you that are in the game should know this. And those of us that are new should respect that.

              Then we all forget. And start pointing fingers. Calling names. Saying I'm a modern day prophet. And we over look the real fact.

              IT HAS TO MAKE MONEY.

              This is why most of you think a perfectly written script should sell and it doesnâ€TMt. Because somewhere downs the line, it didn't have the HOOK, LINE, or SINKER. If you couldn't sell your product to them, how could you expect them to sell it?

              Then you start ripping on movies like "Slackers" or "Time Cop." And over looking the fact that these are Movies, they were once scripts that sold.


              When I write, I'm not writing a script, but I'm writing a movie to be made. (I hope this explains what I'm saying)

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: I'm no God or a modern day prophet... CRASH

                Wait, I think I can translate.

                You're saying that there is a difference between commerce and art and that the studios, producers, etc are more interested in commerce? While the writers/artists involved may prefer art?

                That's pretty profound.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: New Lottery - Vol. II

                  Not to denigrate or give short-shrift to Mr. Tao's post...

                  But since when is this subject new?
                  And really... since when should a God come into the matter.

                  Anyone possessing any maturity whatsoever, who has ever visited this message board, must immediately realize that they are visiting the virtual headquarters of Self-Delusion central.
                  And the film industry has always attracted the desperate and deluded, in addition to the hopeful, and the talented.

                  I suppose the upward bump in script prices over the last decade HAS fueled an increase in fameNfortune seekers, but I suspect the movie trade sees no more of this silliness than the publishing world, in terms of unprepared and clueless folks.
                  Perhaps even less. Though, it's pretty clear that dreams of writing for screen is a popular subject, and the web enables a lot of utterly lazy people to dabble in the fantasy. Its a waste of electricity and technology, truly. And is one reason (I believe) that more serious and capable users on this board finally reach critical mass and lose their patience, and 'finally say it' , to 'Let the cat out of the bag.' Poor Steinberg! I cannot imagine attempting to respond to the number of idiotic emails he must get weekly, from both the chronically and freshly deluded alike. At least as a simple board user, one can opt out of the most nonsensical threads in order to preserve some sanity. Which is key, because as can be seen from the pig-pile onto the Lottery discussion, there is not going to be any relief from the persistent and enduring siege by all who claim the right (to the writer's life), on all those who have earned the right. And as was said, discussion is pointless since each person should write for their own purposes and pleasure. And one's future development is their own goal.

                  Lets hope that the pro's blew out the cobwebs, and peeves, and will soon be back to dispensing valuable words of experience for the benefit of those that can appreciate them.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    kklstef very close...

                    <!--EZCODE BOLD START--> You're saying that there is a difference between commerce and art and that the studios, producers, etc are more interested in commerce? While the writers/artists involved may prefer art?<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->

                    Eminem and Kid Rock makes fun of "Commerce vs Art" with many of their songs. But when you really look into their music it is Commerce and Artistic.

                    Hollywood is looking for Commerce as well as Artistic, and when they find somebody that displays both skills they call that person "Talent."

                    And if you dont believe me then here is something from InZide...

                    <!--EZCODE BOLD START--> Question: What exactly is InZide looking for in a script submission and in what genre?<!--EZCODE BOLD END-->

                    <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--> Answer:
                    InZide <!--EZCODE BOLD START--> is looking for commercially proven stories that appeal to a wide range of audience members.<!--EZCODE BOLD END--> These stories need to be legitimate studio pictures and ideally be producible for a modest budget. They have to have a great story that can hold its own, without depending on a star to give it recognition.
                    But to answer your question, in most cases Zide/Perry doesn't actually look for specific genres when evaluating material. Instead, we approach things fairly scientifically and analyze material based on simple factors. When considering a script, we ask ourselves the following:

                    1) Is this really a movie?

                    Many rookie writers think their idea is just dying to be a film, but the truth is it only has enough content and emotional punch for a short film, nothing more. Weâ€TMve seen tons of set ups and topics that are interesting, but there needs to be enough to fill 90 minutes, with identifiable characters that experience lots of twists and turns en route to learning something, which is a challenge for some writers.

                    2) What movies of a similar subject, tone, budget and genre have been made, and how did they perform at the box office? Once we answer those questions, we ask ourselves: When were those movies made and what was the social political landscape at the time? And what other similar films have come out since then?

                    For example, if we read a script about pilots in the military, we think, "TOPGUN" -- which can be both a good and bad thing. The good things are TOPGUN made tons of money at the box office, solidified Tom Cruise as a major star, and was made 14 years ago which means there is a whole new audience for another airplane movie. The bad things are that another airplane movie would have to be incredibly unique to create its own buzz and rise above the TOPGUN legend. Plus, it would be amazingly expensive to make, which would also demand it be very unique -- otherwise studios wouldn't want to finance it. Additionally, if you recall the politics of the era the USA and foreign market were ready for a modern military movie in 1986. Today's landscape is radically different and possibly not so open to the idea.

                    3) Who is the audience for this movie?

                    We look at who actually goes to this kind of movie vs. what the leads in the script are doing and compare whether the target audience would identify with the characters in the film, and whether we can expand on the target audience to make the movie a hit rather than a movie-that-performed-well-for-it's-demographic.

                    We were drawn to AMERICAN PIE not only because of the teenage market, but because we believed people from other age groups would be drawn to the story for its nostalgic value --and it seemed to have worked. Additionally, we were drawn to AMERICAN PIE because it could be made rather inexpensively --for under $11 Million -- and did not depend on huge stars to attract audiences.

                    Another example is FIRST WIVE'S CLUB, which brought all age groups and sexes into the theatre, despite the fact its leads were 3 women over 40 â€"which is a phenomenon. The reason it worked? It brought wish fulfillment to a whole new level. See, woman ages 35 â€" 50 traditionally do not go to the movies, but they were dying to see women seek justice from their ex-husbands. If we read a feature script about women in this age group, we ask ourselves, "Is this script fun or interesting enough to get women to come to the movies?" We also ask ourselves, "What actresses out there would be willing to play someone 45 - 50, that is also a big enough star to guarantee all kinds of people would show up at the theatres?" Every once in awhile, the movie comes along -- FIRST WIVES CLUB worked, but there are dozens that didn't.

                    4) What is the Hollywood market value of the overall subject?

                    For the most part, the answer to this question is something only people working in the industry can know. As a writer you can take a look around at a productâ€TMs success in the theatres and use common sense to make a decent guess, but it really is up to us to know the answer to this one.

                    For example, right now the value of Mafia movies is ice cold. It doesn't matter whether the mafia script is a comedy or drama, set in NYC or elsewhere...studios just aren't buying them because they have plenty of them sitting on their shelves that they can't do anything with so they won't add more, and THE SOPRANOS has moved the viewer market to television.

                    5) What is the foreign market for this kind of script?

                    As you may or may not realize, the foreign market interest is a big factor in deciding whether or not to get behind a project. Foreign Buyers need a few simple things: the story must be universal and translate to an overseas market â€"- thus action and physical comedy work the best. Next guns, sex and great stars close the deal. Of course the Foreign Market loves thematically charged, beautifully made films…but just like in America, the box office for these kind of projects is risky at best, whereas action and comedy seem more bankable.

                    6) Is this the kind of movie Zide/Perry would make, or can we find someone who is a better match?

                    As we said, Zide/Perry is interested in making studio-sized, commercial films that a wide-spread audience will go see. (When we say commercial, we mean, "Can you tell me the movie in one-two sentences?) We might read scripts that are well-written and interesting, but if we do not feel they fall into the studio/commercial category it is very difficult for us to get involved. Sometimes we pass them along to people who are looking for film festival-type material, other times we team up with producers who have a track record in the genre and will bring value to the project.

                    We use all of the above in order to decide whether to pursue a script â€" all before reading the actual writing, which just goes to show you what a crazy this business this is.
                    <!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->

                    That one line says it all.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: kklstef very close...

                      "...which just goes to show you what a crazy this business this is. "

                      I love when production/management companies (or anyone else likely to throw away a script with typos) have typos on their site. It makes me giggle.

                      I wonder if they'd accept my logline that starts out "This funny this script is about..."

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Turning Your Plot Into The Subplot

                        As a screenwriter who needs to take marketability into consideration, one should look at the script they're writing and judge whether it's commercial enough to be made into a movie.

                        If the story is too personal (something only the writer would understand or want to see) or too esoteric, dark, etc., then consider how you can turn your personal story into a more marketable story. Maybe the personal story that you want to tell of a couple who's marriage slowly deteriorates could be changed from your main plot to your subplot while wrapping a more commercial main plot around that. This way you can still tell your personal story but at the same time have a main plot that's commercial enough for people to take notice.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Writers

                          The best thing about these Lottery threads? Most aspiring writers probably haven't paid any attention to them.

                          For the past two days, while some (me included) have been going on and on about what writing is REALLY about, what is a real writer, why you should write, why you should take a long look in the mirror and quit trying to sell your work because...isn't it obvious, you'll never make it, who is going to make it, who won't, is luck involved, who is blessed and who is not, etc., aspiring screenwriters have just been out there, working on their stuff, posting something in the logline forum, critiquing someone's first five pages, preparing a package for that agent who just requested their script, getting ready for a seminar, downloading a script to study, etc. etc. etc. They could probably give two shi&$s what anyone (especially me), pro or rookie, has to say about why they should write, what writing should mean to them and when they should face the music and quit dreaming about selling their "mediocre" work. They write and are pursuing this dream because...they want to, and they're trying to get better at it. They may have read what's been spoken in sermons, then agreed, diagreed, laughed, cursed or whatever, and then just kept working. Good for them.

                          On another note, I think D. Steinberg probably took on that column to not only help serious wanna-bes, but help and enlighten novice writers who are testing the waters and don't know much about screenwriting. I'm sure he does get a lot of dumb questions from the delusional and starry-eyed. I'm still that way myself, sometimes. Most of us are green to some extent on this board. I've learned a ton there.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            aliens can - as proven -

                            cut and paste in this thread.

                            Addicted from space

                            Loglines: When aliens send one of their own to infiltrate Hollywood with hopes of making alien friendly films.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: aliens can - as proven -

                              Ancon...

                              I think the worst thing about these lottery threads is that most haven't paid attention. In between the boxing of the ears have been some real gems of information that enlighten those who want to pursue this masochism... and then call it gainful employment. Novices SHOULD read most of the long rambling threads that are posted here and in other threads because the collective intelligence of several voices on one topic have wisdom as a group and can relay correct information if one is willing to pull the gold from the goop.

                              Lancer...

                              I know you're new to this... and you have passion, man. Don't lose it. Got anything on Zoetrope? I'd like to read your stuff... I have one to review left and then if you want, I'll take a look. You're right when you say what it comes down to is that $8.00. And that has to be kept in mind. But that has nothing to do with the actual writing process. If an idea is original enough and a great writer is behind the wheel of it, then the $8.00 rule is going to take care of itself without having to focus on it for the story...

                              Crash...

                              You're right. And I wasn't taking all that much offense with Lancer's post. I was more curious about where he found the information he said he saw... But I forgot I have some loglines over at the Escape site... maybe there.

                              Have a great day, people...

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Ok, going to finally throw my worthless two cents in.......

                                A couple of years ago I stumbled across a book, "How to Write It, How to Sell It", by Linda Palmer. My questions to life were all answered. I was destined to be a screenwriter. I took classes, even went to Rockport, Maine, read scripts, and many how-to books, and the more I learn the more the industry itself turns me off. Writing is a personal thing, at least I feel it should be. Every story you write is connected to you, at least in the beginning.

                                Soon people will start correcting you and telling you to lose material and to gain it elsewhere. Develop this character more, lose this character. You need another subplot, I was hoping for a happier ending, blah, blah, blah. People that conform to this or doing it for one reason...the money. I see very little art in screenwriting. I have started to relate screenwriting to the people who make coloring books. They draw the pictures and let others finish the vision.

                                I have recently start writing my first feature length screenplay and there is no way in hell anyone would want to buy it. It's a special effects laden horror piece. Why did I write it? Because I wanted to see my characters develop on paper. I wanted to hear what they had to say. I have been told I should write in novel form as my writing style is better suited for that. PPTTHHH! I want to write screenplays, I want to use flowery descriptions. I WANT EVERY SCENE TO BE EXACTLY HOW I SEE IT IN MY HEAD. I don't want to birth a baby and throw it up for adoption the second it is out of my womb. I want to raise the child. It seems you can't do this and make a living UNLESS you plan on producing and directing your flick on your own - nearly impossible unless you want to shoot dv or 16 mm.

                                I guess my point, maybe I should have written an outline , is that I can't see writer's choosing to be screenwriters for anything but the money - initially. You can get your ENTIRE message across in novel or short story format, not just the framework - so if you are doing it for the love of writing why even bother with writing screenplays? The reason I do is because I am a fool I just keep on writing flowery, but in script format. Anyone else have any ideas why an artist would choose a format that limits them?

                                Sorry for the rambling,
                                JC

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X