Star Trek Into Darkness

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  • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

    I pretty much agree with karsten.

    The fact is that there are legitimate criticisms to be made regarding both the plot of the film and the deliberately duplicitous statements of the filmmakers leading up to its release and people should be free to make those criticisms, just as you should be free to ignore, unfollow or argue with those opinions.

    Who cares what the mindset or mood of the critic is going into the theater? What matters is whether their criticisms are a legitimate gripe or a nitpicking irrelevancy. If it's the latter feel free to dismiss it and move on with your life.

    I'm certain many people went to Star Wars: Episode II with incredibly low expectations, indeed many probably went knowing they would hate it, but that doesn't mean their post-screening criticisms of the film are immediately illegitimate.

    Edit: pre-release spoilers are another issue and the height of assholishness

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    • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

      A lot of these "legitimate criticisms" leveled against the film are really weak and unfounded. It's like decrying Raiders of the Lost Ark because the opening didn't make sense and had nothing to do with the rest of the story, etc.

      If you want to pick apart a movie, I know a lot of you have slept on TDKR, coincidentally (what did I say about modern audiences and style, again?). Tackle that one, why don't you? Leave the better films alone and give discredit where it's actually due.

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      • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

        Originally posted by Biohazard View Post
        A lot of these "legitimate criticisms" leveled against the film are really weak and unfounded.
        Then argue them on their merits or lack thereof. No need to make ad hominem assumptions about the mindset or motives of the criticizer.

        Edit: it does go both ways, you know. How would you like your praise of a film simply dismissed because you were "just a typical fanboy" or "you went to the cinema determined to like it regardless of how bad it was"?

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        • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

          I liked this movie. Sure it's dumb and has a lot of plot holes and the Alice Eve underwear thing was terrible but I definitely found it a fun time. The visuals and sound were great and Cumberbatch was way more fun to watch than Bana slouching in a chair and grumbling.

          People will cling to plot issues when trying to justify why they didn't like a film. For example, I really love Inception. Yes, it has a ton of things wrong with it but they don't really bother me because I just like it. On the other hand I hated Prometheus, TDKR, and The Avengers, so I spent a lot of time annoyed with the dumber aspects of those movies. Like why in TDKR did Batman come back to Gotham while there's a bomb driving around and time is of the essence but he opts to spend probably hours lugging gasoline onto a bridge and then burning a giant bat symbol into it causing expensive damage to public property only in an attempt to help his enemies by warning them that he's back. Maybe he should trade in that stealthy black suit for a clown costume lined with strobe lights and a megaphone. Now that probably wouldn't have bothered me too much if I had liked the film.

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          • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

            Originally posted by Fortean View Post
            Definitely not!

            And, you didn't notice that upside-down flag?

            SPOILER ALERT




            This earlier appearance of a tribble ruined the film for me. I was frustrated enough, sensing that few (if any) of the principal characters were really going to be killed or die, despite all of the dangers; but, how could they forget about the tribble, later on in their adventures, when they visited Sherman's Planet?
            ... who says they did?

            Different timelines, dude. Different timelines.

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            • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

              Originally posted by emily blake View Post
              You seriously don't think there were any people on the Internet who were determined to hate this film before they saw it? Really? You're not willing to accept that maybe - just MAYBE - some people, not necessarily you, would have hated this film no matter what?
              Of course there were; but equally you have to acknowledge that there are plenty - probably more - who wanted to love the film no matter what because they're massive JJ fans. In fact a considerable chunk of JJ's success is because of that following on the beastly internet.

              And that's fine - I love Terrence Malick, I go into all his films wanting them to be amazing, so much so that when they're slightly disappointing I try and convince myself that it's my fault for not watching the film properly.

              I think much of this is just the good old fashioned Tall Poppy Syndrome. Happened to Michael Cimino 30 years ago. Instead of Twitter they did their slating at pubs, film festivals and via the letters page of Sight and Sound.

              As that genius David Byrne puts it: 'Same as it ever was.'
              My stuff

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              • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                Originally posted by Jon Jay View Post
                Of course there were; but equally you have to acknowledge that there are plenty - probably more - who wanted to love the film no matter what because they're massive JJ fans.
                I did acknowledge that there were people who genuinely hated the movie because it just didn't work for them. I said so many times. But I posted Bitter's piece because it's something to remember when SOME people get into a fervor with their criticism when they think it makes them cool to hate.

                If you think his piece applies to you, maybe step back and think about your motivations for criticizing something. If you don't think his piece applies to you, then don't worry about it.
                Chicks Who Script podcast

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                • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                  None of this applies to me - I'm too apathetic to hate anything.

                  Actually maybe that's more the problem here - that a by-product of this age of noise in which we live is that everyone has to shout louder, so arguments quickly descend into hating versus loving.

                  I was monumentally disappointed by Prometheus, but I wouldn't say I hated it because, y'know... it's a film, it cost me £6 to see, the seat was pretty comfy and I had a nice coffee, so...
                  My stuff

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                  • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                    Originally posted by Jon Jay View Post
                    Of course there were; but equally you have to acknowledge that there are plenty - probably more - who wanted to love the film no matter what because they're massive JJ fans. In fact a considerable chunk of JJ's success is because of that following on the beastly internet.
                    Also pure Trekkies, don't forget them. Despite the perception that lots of Trekkers hate AbramsTrek because of all the changes, there are puh-lenty of Trekkies who love AbramsTrek because it's freakin' Star Trek.

                    I'm one of them. I saw STV and Nemesis in the theaters, and actually sat through all of "Enterprise". Abrams would have had to have made a much, much, much, much worse movie for me to hate it. There's a whole good load of way damn worse things out there with "Star Trek" on the name than anything Abrams has done with these movies.

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                    • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                      Once a film takes you OUT of the movie going experience, there is no going back, all you see from then on is the strings. It can happen anytime, it all depends on your own level of acceptance.
                      My guilty pleasure film is, Armageddon! Yes, it`s as dumb as nuts but I`ll take it over Inception, TDK(R), Loopers and Prometheus any day. Maybe it`s because it`s not trying to be anything other than what it is, it has it`s own identity and I can relate to that. But a film that is almost demanding that you take it seriously when it is anything but, comes across as pretentious. While I can appreciate the initial thought that went into those films, the minute it starts to lose steam and its identity, and then relies on you not noticing, you`ve lost me as a viewer.

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                      • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                        Originally posted by Rhodi View Post
                        Then argue them on their merits or lack thereof. No need to make ad hominem assumptions about the mindset or motives of the criticizer.
                        I responded to MacG's points.

                        If you want to make claims of terrible writing in this film, it's your duty to point out where you see a fault.

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                        • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                          Originally posted by miktal-1 View Post
                          My guilty pleasure film is, Armageddon!
                          I've generally kept it a secret that Armageddon was one of my favorite films when it came out and the years after. I was 11 at the time. I'm curious what would happen if I rewatched it now.

                          Also, hating on movies can be fun. See: Pinkerton's Star Wars Prequels reviews. So I sympathize with the haters, but usually only when the tone is mocking versus legitimate anger/outrage over all these little details.

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                          • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                            I enjoyed Armageddon. How can you dislike a movie that has a scene with animal crackers being marched across Liv Tyler's bare belly?
                            "Forget it, Jake. It's Hollywood."

                            My YouTube channel.

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                            • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                              Originally posted by Jon Jay View Post
                              Of course there were; but equally you have to acknowledge that there are plenty - probably more - who wanted to love the film no matter what because they're massive JJ fans. In fact a considerable chunk of JJ's success is because of that following on the beastly internet.
                              That's definitely me. And I liked Inception and The Dark Knight but didn't like The Dark Knight Rises.

                              Hate's too strong a word for these movies. There's an entertainment value to all of them. It's personal choice anyway, no one has to agree with anyone.

                              Personally I was disappointed by Into Darkness. Fun, and Cumberbatch's one of my favorite villains, really such a great job, but still disappointing as a whole.

                              I've tried to work out why.

                              Maybe my expectations were too high. Maybe I didn't like the way they meshed the two villains together. Maybe the opening sequence seemed dumb. Maybe I wanted Kirk to save the day and not Spock.

                              For the record I'm not a Trekkie, but I went in there expecting to love it.

                              The first JJ movie, but with Cumberbatch as the villain, still seems like it would have been the perfect mix.

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                              • Re: Star Trek Into Darkness

                                Having learned my lesson eons ago about how expectations ultimately leads to disappointing movie experiences, I made sure not to look at any the trailers or reviews about the movie ahead of time. I knew zero about the plot coming in. I'm not a Trekkie, but I thoroughly enjoyed this movie. The main villain intrigued me, so after the movie I went and watched a copy of the old Star Trek show that introduced him. Good stuff! I love when a movie inspires me to go out and find out more about it!

                                www.cheapskate-a-holic.com Release your inner cheapskate!!

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