Nicholl 2016

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  • #16
    Re: Nicholl 2016

    Hi Greg,

    I had a question regarding collaboration. Unfortunately, I submitted my script before reading through your tips. If a few scenes were contributed by another writer (in this case, my husband) which were rewritten does that make it a collaboration? I find this a bit confusing. Thanks for your response.

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    • #17
      Re: Nicholl 2016

      Originally posted by Swansong View Post
      Hi Greg,

      I had a question regarding collaboration. Unfortunately, I submitted my script before reading through your tips. If a few scenes were contributed by another writer (in this case, my husband) which were rewritten does that make it a collaboration? I find this a bit confusing. Thanks for your response.
      Actually, collaborations are determined by the writers, not by us.

      In this instance, if you told us that you considered your entry a collaboration, then it wouldn't be eligible as you and your husband did not work on it as equal partners throughout the creation, development and writing. If you consider the script solely to be your creation, with your husband's contribution akin to notes from another person, then it would be eligible.

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      • #18
        Re: Nicholl 2016

        Thanks for answering and clearing that up, Greg.

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        • #19
          Re: Nicholl 2016

          Originally posted by gregbeal View Post
          Added a line to the Prior to logging in section:

          We assign scripts to readers using genres as the first selection/exclusion criteria.
          Interesting. So it's not just a free-for-all? I am curious as to why the Nicholl does this, is it possible to share Greg?

          It is really great to read so much about the inner workings of the Nicholl.
          pay for soup
          build a fort
          set that on fire

          jmb

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          • #20
            Re: Nicholl 2016

            Originally posted by CarlColt View Post
            Interesting. So it's not just a free-for-all? I am curious as to why the Nicholl does this, is it possible to share Greg?

            It is really great to read so much about the inner workings of the Nicholl.
            Hasn't been a free for all since about 1991, but the assignment system has become more codified over time and eventually was built into the assignment portion of our database.

            We make every attempt to assign scripts by genres to readers who appreciate those genres and to avoid assigning genres to readers who don't appreciate those genres. Why? Because we don't want to assign a horror script to a reader who doesn't want to read horror. We want that horror script to go to a reader who likes horror. Et cetera across all genres.

            We also mix every batch up by submissions per genre, so a group of 12 scripts might include 5 dramas (which would include drama thrillers, drama sf, drama comedy, historical drama, etc.), 3 comedies and 4 of all other genres.

            With second reads, we also mix by scores, so that a batch of 12 would have one script from the top 1/12 by score of all available scripts, one from the next 1/12, et cetera.

            BTW, readers are not told the genres nor the scores nor whether scripts are first or second reads (nor do we share log lines or any information about the scripts other than the titles).

            Why? To be as fair as possible to every entry.

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            • #21
              Re: Nicholl 2016

              Greg, I heard the readers consider several parameters (such as character, plot, setting etc.) when considering a script. Are they assigned a score according to those parameters?

              I know the scripts are scored from 0 to 100, so is it that each category contributes some number of points to the score or does the reader just give an overall score?

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              • #22
                Re: Nicholl 2016

                Originally posted by Dimitri001 View Post
                Greg, I heard the readers consider several parameters (such as character, plot, setting etc.) when considering a script. Are they assigned a score according to those parameters?

                I know the scripts are scored from 0 to 100, so is it that each category contributes some number of points to the score or does the reader just give an overall score?
                Five categories, each with up to 20 points available. Story, Voice, Characters, Craft and Meaning and Magic.

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                • #23
                  Re: Nicholl 2016

                  Originally posted by gregbeal View Post
                  Five categories, each with up to 20 points available. Story, Voice, Characters, Craft and Meaning and Magic.
                  A bit of constructive criticism, Greg:

                  I don't think its the best system. You could have a script like Catch 22 where its a great script, but not much story content, because the story's not the point of the piece, its not what makes it great, its about the gags. So the system would be skewed against such a script.

                  Or for ex. you could have a script that is great because of the plot, but the characters are a bit flat, because its that kind of film, the characters are not the point, its the story twists that make it great, like maybe The Usual Suspect.

                  Or Sweet Smell of Success, one of the greatest American movies of all time. The story's not much, the characters nothing special and yet its a better film than most movies with interesting characters and stories.

                  I think it would be better to score them overall, without categories.
                  Last edited by Dimitri001; 05-08-2016, 12:19 AM.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Nicholl 2016

                    Originally posted by Dimitri001 View Post
                    A bit of constructive criticism, Greg:

                    I don't think its the best system. You could have a script like Catch 22 where its a great script, but not much story content, because the story's not the point of the piece, its not what makes it great, its about the gags. So the system would be skewed against such a script.

                    Or for ex. you could have a script that is great because of the plot, but the characters are a bit flat, because its that kind of film, the characters are not the point, its the story twists that make it great, like maybe The Usual Suspect.

                    Or Sweet Smell of Success, one of the greatest American movies of all time. The story's not much, the characters nothing special and yet its a better film than most movies with interesting characters and stories.

                    I think it would be better to score them overall, without categories.
                    I'm not sure how your idea makes much sense. Screenwriting is a complex art form. Sure, there are scripts that stand out due to excelling in a specific area. But more often than not, a script's quality is the sum of its various parts. Different components influence each other -- for example, a protagonist's character arc typically influences story structure. At the first turning point he gains courage, so he embarks on an adventure; at the second turning point, he's learned his lesson about his flaw, so he recommits himself to his goal.

                    A contest like the Nicholl, with over 7,000 entries, is not looking for a script that is really good in one or two ways. It's looking for a script that is outstanding in as many ways as possible. That's the easiest way to create a consensus. And the best way to determine that is by measuring performance in difference categories.

                    It's not just that -- some people may view some categories as being more important than others. So one reader may value character more than plot, and vice versa. Thus, under your proposed system, one person's overall score from a reader could differ greatly from another person's overall score due to how they weight individual components. [On a side note -- this is one reason I'm still not really a fan of the Black List's scoring system. It doesn't really take into account the different ways people may weight individual categories because the overall score is not based on individual component scores. Even if most readers' scores align with each other within 2 points or so, that's not directly due to the scoring system, but rather a fortunate outcome. But not getting into that conversation.]

                    Requiring readers to apply a score to individual components helps ensure that their viewpoints on all categories are taken into account in determining a final, overall score. It helps avoid confusion and creates fairness. The Nicholl system has worked fine for decades; there's no reason to change it now.
                    "I love being a writer. What I can't stand is the paperwork.-- Peter De Vries

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                    • #25
                      Re: Nicholl 2016

                      Thanks for the suggestions. The Nicholl scoring system has been modified in various ways over the past 30 years and undoubtedly will continue to be into the future.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Nicholl 2016

                        Originally posted by gregbeal View Post
                        Five categories, each with up to 20 points available. Story, Voice, Characters, Craft and Meaning and Magic.
                        I think this is really interesting. Could you tell us how you define these to your readers, especially the last two?

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                        • #27
                          Re: Nicholl 2016

                          Originally posted by carcar View Post
                          I think this is really interesting. Could you tell us how you define these to your readers, especially the last two?
                          As defined by the Nicholl Committee:

                          Nicholl Judging Criteria

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                          • #28
                            Re: Nicholl 2016

                            Thank you.

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                            • #29
                              Re: Nicholl 2016

                              Originally posted by Dimitri001 View Post
                              A bit of constructive criticism, Greg:

                              I don't think its the best system. You could have a script like Catch 22 where its a great script, but not much story content, because the story's not the point of the piece, its not what makes it great, its about the gags. So the system would be skewed against such a script.
                              I look at from the other direction. The gags only work because of Catch 22's powerful story.
                              "I just couldn't live in a world without me."

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                              • #30
                                Re: Nicholl 2016

                                Hi Greg, After receiving some coverage feedback, I took their advice and reworked the characters in my screenplay, changed some scenes and added some more. I also have changed the title. I know that I can submit up to 3 screenplays this contest period.

                                While the log line and the premise of my story remain the same it has been greatly improved upon (imo). My question is: Can I also submit this new version of my work into this year's competition? Also, if I can and do, will that screenplay be read by the same reader or will randomly assigned and judged independently from the previous version?

                                Thank you.

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