Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

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  • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

    Originally posted by wickedlies View Post
    For me I think the mistake I have made is that I should have just purchased two reads right away instead of waiting for the first one then immediately signing up for another.

    I received a good review (7 score and great comments. The review and script can be found here https://blcklst.com/members/script/3869 ) so I signed up for another and have been waiting for over 2.5 weeks to see what comes of it. If I had it to do over I would have just bought two reads at the start because the wait time has produced nothing in terms of reads, at least to my knowledge.

    Hey wickedlies,

    I'm not sure I understand why you think buying two reads off the bat would have been better for you. Is it that two good reviews with a 7 rating would drive more industry readers to your script? Or are you thinking a higher rating from a second reader would help?

    I'm trying to figure out the best way to approach this myself. Just signed up with BL yesterday and bought one read. I was thinking I'd wait to see how that turned out before deciding whether to pay for a second read, but your post has me thinking.

    Then again, maybe strategy is irrelevant...

    Comment


    • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

      Franklin - a suggestion - if a writer pays for two reads and the deviation is 3+ (say a 5 and an 8), why not offer that writer a third read for 50% off? This would go a long way in helping appease said writer in dealing with the lower score... Something to think about...

      Calc

      Comment


      • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

        Originally posted by Concord View Post
        Hey wickedlies,

        I'm not sure I understand why you think buying two reads off the bat would have been better for you. Is it that two good reviews with a 7 rating would drive more industry readers to your script? Or are you thinking a higher rating from a second reader would help?

        I'm trying to figure out the best way to approach this myself. Just signed up with BL yesterday and bought one read. I was thinking I'd wait to see how that turned out before deciding whether to pay for a second read, but your post has me thinking.

        Then again, maybe strategy is irrelevant...
        I thought exactly like you. My statement about buying two up front was simply related to the wait time. Having a single read that is good, has done nothing to my script's exposure. Now, granted it is currently one rating at a 7 score and perhaps if it were an 8 or 9 it would have been given more exposure. But if the next read comes back as a 7 or above, I am pretty certain that will kick it into being given some additional exposure on the BL site.

        I am simply impatient. Waiting almost three weeks for the second rating just seems like I wasted time having it sit there with no way to be found.

        Comment


        • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

          Wickedlies, I agree with you. I initially signed up for 1 review, got a middling score (a six) and was planning to pull the script. After Franklin Leonard posted more info on his algorithm, I bought another read. I'll probably have to pay for another month to get the score.

          Comment


          • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

            Originally posted by The Calculator View Post
            Franklin - a suggestion - if a writer pays for two reads and the deviation is 3+ (say a 5 and an 8), why not offer that writer a third read for 50% off? This would go a long way in helping appease said writer in dealing with the lower score... Something to think about...
            How would it help "appease" the writer in dealing with the lower score? Unless you assume a third read would be closer to 8 than to 5, which seems unfounded. At any rate, I doubt a $25 discount matters much.

            Comment


            • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

              I'll probably sound like a penis here but whatever:

              If someone gets a 5 or a 6 why would you want to pay for another read? If someone's seeing your script as mediocre then should you be retreating to your desk to make it better instead of hoping to eeek out something a little bit higher with another read?

              What's the hope in a "good enough" rating? A "good enough" producer?

              Sounds like people shooting for "crap-plus-one".

              http://www.wordplayer.com/columns/wp...-plus-One.html

              Comment


              • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                Originally posted by Concord View Post
                Hey wickedlies,

                I'm not sure I understand why you think buying two reads off the bat would have been better for you. Is it that two good reviews with a 7 rating would drive more industry readers to your script? Or are you thinking a higher rating from a second reader would help?

                I'm trying to figure out the best way to approach this myself. Just signed up with BL yesterday and bought one read. I was thinking I'd wait to see how that turned out before deciding whether to pay for a second read, but your post has me thinking.

                Then again, maybe strategy is irrelevant...
                A rating above the average (like 7 is) gets you on a top list, PROVIDED you have more than 1 rating.

                Comment


                • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                  Originally posted by goldmund View Post
                  A rating above the average (like 7 is) gets you on a top list, PROVIDED you have more than 1 rating.
                  This is exactly right and why I think getting two out of the gate is the best bet.

                  I am curious though how writers are using the service to land reads besides relying on the reviews. Though, if people are having success with that it they may be unlikely to share their plan.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                    Originally posted by FranklinLeonard View Post
                    If you pause the script with a pending read though, your paid read will also be paused.
                    I'm glad you've now clarified that. And, that's too bad.

                    As I mentioned way earlier in this thread, I think someone should be able to get a score (or scores) from BL's readers before making the script available to producers, etc.

                    Franklin, since you have the Pause functionality, I urge you to consider letting a Paused script to nevertheless remain active in the to-be-read queue - and to be read and scored.

                    Considering you've got the $25 and the $50, why should it be sidetracked in the to-be-read queue?

                    Comment


                    • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                      Originally posted by wickedlies View Post
                      This is exactly right and why I think getting two out of the gate is the best bet.

                      I am curious though how writers are using the service to land reads besides relying on the reviews. Though, if people are having success with that it they may be unlikely to share their plan.
                      Just wanted to jump in here and say that I'm loving this new line of conversation. Wanted to provide a bit more information that might be helpful.

                      Currently, scripts receiving a rating of 8 or better overall are highlighted in a weekly email to our members. There are a number of other updates that go out based on members' preferences that highlight scripts that scored highly on any of the subratings or by genre. 8 is not the controlling number in those emails.

                      Lastly, Calculator, your idea re: an automatically triggered offer of a third read for $25 in the event that the two previous scores are separated by three or more is a good one. Definitely something we will look at more closely in the context of a full month of data, which happens next week.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                        Originally posted by cjkahle View Post
                        I'll probably sound like a penis here but whatever:

                        If someone gets a 5 or a 6 why would you want to pay for another read? If someone's seeing your script as mediocre then should you be retreating to your desk to make it better instead of hoping to eeek out something a little bit higher with another read?

                        What's the hope in a "good enough" rating? A "good enough" producer?

                        Sounds like people shooting for "crap-plus-one".

                        http://www.wordplayer.com/columns/wp...-plus-One.html
                        Rating screenplays is not an exact science. The standard deviation gives you an idea of the agreement between reviewers. Franklin Leonard has stated that the standard deviation is about 1.8

                        What this means: there is about a 68% chance that a script's rating is within 1 standard deviation (plus or minus) of what it should be. There is a ninety-something percent chance that it is rated within two standard deviations of what it should be. And so on.

                        Statisticians feel free to chime in.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                          Originally posted by Manchester View Post
                          I'm glad you've now clarified that. And, that's too bad.

                          As I mentioned way earlier in this thread, I think someone should be able to get a score (or scores) from BL's readers before making the script available to producers, etc.

                          Franklin, since you have the Pause functionality, I urge you to consider letting a Paused script to nevertheless remain active in the to-be-read queue - and to be read and scored.

                          Considering you've got the $25 and the $50, why should it be sidetracked in the to-be-read queue?
                          I've addressed this question a few times in this thread already, but I'm happy to address it again. We built our pay model to be as simple (and function as simply) as possible. We believe that it does.

                          If you're uncomfortable "doing nothing" while you're waiting for your paid read from one of our readers, I encourage you to find alternate ways to get reads from industry professionals during that period. A number of writers have already done just that. And the conversation here appears to be veering to towards brainstorming ways to do just that.

                          I can tell you confidently that we will not be changing this aspect of our site for the foreseeable future.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                            Originally posted by kenklmn View Post
                            Rating screenplays is not an exact science. The standard deviation gives you an idea of the agreement between reviewers. Franklin Leonard has stated that the standard deviation is about 1.8

                            What this means: there is about a 68% chance that a script's rating is within 1 standard deviation (plus or minus) of what it should be. There is a ninety-something percent chance that it is rated within two standard deviations of what it should be. And so on.

                            Statisticians feel free to chime in.
                            I have a feeling this conversation is about to go all Nate Silver. I like it.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                              Originally posted by Paul Striver View Post
                              How would it help "appease" the writer in dealing with the lower score? Unless you assume a third read would be closer to 8 than to 5, which seems unfounded. At any rate, I doubt a $25 discount matters much.
                              Well it would give the writer a crucial third read w/o having to pay full freight, obviously. In fact, I was going to say that the third read should be free. Because, really, the +/- of professional readers should be 1-2, max. Not 3+.

                              I'm not a "professional" reader, but then, define professional reader for me? I think we all know that the majority of readers are 25 year-old Arts grads trying to break into the industry. They're given a template to follow and told to get to it. Some are really good at it, some are not.

                              In a pragmatic sense, judging a script on defined criteria like story, character, plot, originality, marketability - should be fairly straight forward. Is the writing clear? Is the story decent?

                              A gap of 3 tells me that there's a possible bias involved. Therefore a third read would go a long way in indicating where the slant is. No?

                              Comment


                              • Re: Black List founder Franklin Leonard answers your questions about the Black List

                                Originally posted by FranklinLeonard View Post
                                I have a feeling this conversation is about to go all Nate Silver. I like it.
                                I've tried it out for a few weeks, my main concerns have been addressed, customer service has been tops and the suggestion that a third read for 25 if the difference of the first two scores is greater than 3 is a fantastic one that shows BL cares about its subscribers. Franklin, I think it might be time to drop the mic.

                                Comment

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