Selling spec vs. selling pitch

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  • Selling spec vs. selling pitch

    hey all

    got a project ready to go. it's as writer-director. have a few buyers lined up who are ready to pull the trigger. what I am giving them: a 25 page treatment and a look book detailing the film. these buyers are also financiers.

    however my agent is ringing warning bells. he wants me to write it on spec. "you will have more control that way".

    really tho?!

    to me the two scenarios are:

    1) sell the current package (i.e. treatment), get paid to write script, get notes, hopefully make the movie I want to make.

    or

    2) write the script on spec, find a buyer who CLAIMS to "get" your movie, hopefully sell it to said buyer, knowing that it's extremely likely they too will have notes.

    Just wondering what the reasoning is for not getting paid to write the script, considering the people who end up paying for the script will also finance the film and, ultimately, should be on the same page from the start.
    Last edited by Done Deal Pro; 10-08-2020, 03:16 PM. Reason: Added tags

  • #2
    Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

    I agree with your agent.
    "Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy b/c you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say." -- Edward Snowden

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    • #3
      Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

      The impression I get from (horror) stories I've read over the years:

      Say you just sell the pitch to a producer (even with financing claimed to be lined up). Now you still have to write the script -- but also on their timetable and incorporating their notes. And there will probably be a lot of notes.

      This draft is likely just for the purposes of attracting talent and getting it set up at a studio. And by "draft" at this point, it will mean however many passes after you actually turn in your completed script for the producer(s) and the money to be confident sending it out wide. Who even knows how close this draft is to the vision of what you originally pitched them?

      In the meantime, while you're waiting to hear from the studios, attached talent are reading other scripts on their own, schedules change, maybe some have to drop out and that affects people's calculations or perception of the property.

      And if for whatever reason all the studios pass, now it's just a dead fish that the producer will probably want to wash their own hands of. Good news is you've at least gotten paid to write a "draft" to get it this far. But likely no second step for completion.

      All of which can still happen if you've written it on spec and take it out as a finished thing. But at least in that form it's the story you want it to be from the start, and it still has potential shelf life if nobody buys it the first time around (throw it in a drawer and maybe dust it off if the concept comes around again later). Also less room for a gap between your vision and the producer/studio's vision of what the end product should be before the notes and development starts.
      Last edited by Done Deal Pro; 05-19-2020, 01:54 PM. Reason: Formatting

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      • #4
        Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

        This is probably not relevant here, but I think some of you are beginning to enjoy the 'outside the box' chase I'm engaged in, and I'm thinking my story has to do with pitch/assignment vs. specs, so...

        After my first spec, in about March 2010, and several dozen pitches, one of the responses I got was from a small company, with credits, in the mid-West.

        They said they liked my story but it wasn't quite right. HOWEVER, they had a treatment and wondered if I'd like to write the script for them! Of course, this was akin to an assignment, but I didn't even know what the hell such a thing was in those days. I thought: I write screenplays, so I'm a screenwriter. At least, I did know what the word 'spec' meant.

        Anyway, we got all the way to a contract, with $50K for 3 polished steps (so, a good intro to how all that worked), and after signing that I got to see their 4-page outline/treatment.

        Ready to go, right? And in several months I figured I might have $50K in my pocket! (And my one spec still on the shelf, waiting for a buyer)

        Well, I read their treatment and made the (ha ha) fatal move of criticizing it, and suggesting changes. I took the job of writer seriously, eh?!

        Surprisingly (?), they didn't like my response, and after some back-and-forth we parted ways amicably without a word written, and no cost to either party.

        But think about it: If I'd taken on that job, and it led to more and more, I most CERTAINLY wouldn't have my 50 specs today. And as I mentioned above, those specs aren't going anywhere. If (no, WHEN) I ever sell one, I'm gonna have 50 total pieces of I.P. to sell (or, make, as I strive to become my own producer), as opposed to having spent the last 10 years writing other people's cr&p. And feeling a mite kicked-around while doing so.

        Sorry, but I'm SOOOO much happier to have made the decision that I did, even though ten years later I'm still nowhere near $50K of income made.

        Of course, I'd not ever have even imagined that 50 specs is what I'd have not done, but that's the value of the rear view mirror, eh?

        My ScriptRevolution Profile (you should check out SR, if you're not familiar with it)

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        • #5
          Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

          I think some of the above comments are more than fair & accurate enough, but I'm still going to offer a more contrarian and frank view.

          The vast, vast, vast majority of script writers will never, ever make it. Ever. It's a simple fact that no one can argue.

          If someone is offering you decent money to buy your project and have you write it, I say go for it. Why? Because, based on the undeniable odds, you may never get this chance again. No one wants a bad movie made of their script. (I certainly didn't and yet it happened. Thank God, I used a pen name.) But being produced & paid, in many cases, is better than not having anything. Not always, so do be cautious, but at least you might have something made of your work. Most never will.

          I will note the following as delicately as I can. If "you" have written a bunch of scripts yet you have never won a contest, never been optioned (free or a dollar doesn't count), you've not really been praised by a number of people who read your work, you've never been paid, etc. then there is most likely a problem with you and your writing. No working (WGA or nonWGA) writer I know had to write dozens & dozens of scripts to break-in or be recognized. None.

          If someone is offering you decent money, in most cases it's best to strongly consider it, since that's possibly all you will ever get in your career/life time as a writer based on the odds. Don't pass up opportunity unless the people are complete idiots and they are offering you very, very little. Even with the film I worked on & wrote, which turned out to be an unwatchable movie for me at least, I still learned from the experience. It was a good exercise to go through the process since there was little pressure due to the size of the very indie project.

          Now if you are constantly being praised for your work, are winning or placing high up in the contests, have numerous people requesting your work all the time, etc. OR if money means nothing to you and you're good, then sure, pass. But I'd say think a bit more about it. Money is money and even a not-so-great credit is a credit. Everyone starts somewhere.
          Last edited by Done Deal Pro; 05-20-2020, 07:45 AM.
          Will
          Done Deal Pro
          www.donedealpro.com

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          • #6
            Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

            Well, I know you're not talking about moi (because in the example provided I accepted the offer of money to write from someone else's treatment, even though it didn't pan out). Plus, at the time I was making more money, than was offered there, in my F-T computer work. I could see myself doing things differently now that I have my nice padding of specs under my belt, and since I'm now semi-retired.

            (Well, fully-retired since I'm not working-employed now, but semi-employed because I work virtually 7 days a week on furthering my writing ambitions in some form)

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            • #7
              Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

              My post was primarily directed to Travis, but there are different points in my response which I hope others will take note of and keep in mind. I generally lean more towards the practical, realistic and grounded approach to things.

              Most of my posts cover the broader sense of things to hopefully help many as possible, since we have any number of visitors who might read it with varying backgrounds & degrees of experiences. I like to try to cover what I can in any given post, so there is as much info as possible which someone can take away from what was suggested or noted.

              From there it's ultimately up to them how they move forward.
              Last edited by Done Deal Pro; 05-20-2020, 07:10 PM.
              Will
              Done Deal Pro
              www.donedealpro.com

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              • #8
                Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

                I'd write it. (And that's what I have done) That's how you work as a writer. Someone wants to *pay* you to write something. That's crazy! I'd do it.

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                • #9
                  Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

                  If you can afford to, I'd say write it - if it doesn't sell, you still own it. I've had plenty of scripts come back to life. I've had many sold pitches die out of my control.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

                    I also think if they are paying you to write it, you should take the offer and write it. Plus it's a good opportunity to further build a relationship with these buyers.

                    I guess what confuses me about your agents thinking is that even if you sell a script on spec, the execs or producers involved will still expect you to make changes based on their notes. And then, after that, even more changes leading into production. Did they elaborate on their reasoning beyond "more control"?

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                    • #11
                      Re: Selling spec vs. selling pitch

                      RE:1) sell the current package (i.e. treatment), get paid to write script.
                      And we are talking decision making here?

                      Will has wisdom behind his ears. Seriously. This one is a no brainer...(to me)

                      my 2 cents...
                      --fallen

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