Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

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  • Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

    I've named a band of religious zealots "The Faithful". As a proper noun, is it fine to pluralize it when referring to a group of individual members, as the Faithfuls, or just a collective noun, the Faithful (capped)? How about a single member, "he is a Faithful" as against he is a member of the The Faithful?

    It gets confusing as I write, like ... The Faithful fills up the streets chanting "All Yours!", punching their fists up the sky.

    Or, is it all right to just change the brand or the name to "The Faithfuls", like in rock bands.

    Thanks in advance.

  • #2
    Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

    I've usually seen "faithful" treated as a plural when used as a noun. "The Faithful are..." "One of the Faithful is..." That's how I would do it if it were me.
    "Your intuition knows what to write, so get out of the way.-
    ― Ray Bradbury

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    • #3
      Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

      Unless the name of the group is "The Faithfuls" (which sounds kind of awkward) I think it makes the most sense to just keep it as The Faithful whether you're using it plural or singular.

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      • #4
        Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

        The others have pretty much answered your question already.

        When the word is strictly a descriptive adjective, used as a noun, you would keep it as Faithful (singular or plural).

        If the word becomes a true name for the group, and you are using "a Faithful" to refer to one member, as in "he was a Faithful," then "there were two Faithfuls here yesterday" would be a legitimate plural.

        However, the stuff in the last paragraph above is not likely to be the way that the word would be used. In fact, it is more theoretical than realistic.

        The actual use would almost certainly be:
        He was a member of the Faithful.

        They were members of the Faithful.

        Two members of the Faithful were here.

        Two of those Faithful people here.

        You guys really have a knack for coming up with some strange scenarios.

        "The fact that you have seen professionals write poorly is no reason for you to imitate them." - ComicBent.

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        • #5
          Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

          I understand the mechanics behind collective noun. My query is whether the mechanics should strictly apply to a proper noun "The Faithful" as used as. Unlike "The Assembly of God" which is unmistakably a proper noun, “The Faithful” when spoken or used naturally can be excused as a common noun, therefore can be pluralized, I believe.

          Like “those fanatical Faithfuls are a pain in the neck”, instead of “those fanatical members of The Faithful … ”

          Thanks all, I’m polishing my screenplay before submitting to my grammar nazi script reader for the second time.
          Last edited by sunglider; 05-30-2016, 11:26 PM.

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          • #6
            Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

            Unlike "The Assembly of God" which is unmistakably a proper noun, "The Faithful- when spoken or used naturally can be excused as a common noun, therefore can be pluralized, I believe.
            At this point, I am not sure what you are contending, or whether you are contending anything different from what I said. I am not being snarky. I really do not know exactly what the issue is.

            In any case, you can certainly use Faithfuls as a plural of a proper noun.

            As for the plural of a common noun (i.e., anyone who is faithful), you can form a plural with an -s, but it is a bit forced and uncommon. You can theoretically do that with many adjectives. A group of coy and beautiful young women could be referred to as the "coys and the beautifuls" as opposed to the "talkatives and the uglies". The plural adjectival nouns in the second group (talkatives and uglies) work pretty well, better than the plurals in the first group; however, you can pluralize "coy" and "beautiful" the same way if you want to convey (maybe) the individuality of the people in that group, as if you are looking at them as something more than a group.

            The question to consider is whether the context of the use removes the awkwardness of the construction. In general, it is good to avoid awkwardness, because it will probably be a distraction.

            I think that you just have to decide what sounds natural to you and what works to describe your characters.

            Sometimes it is not a matter of grammatical correctness (because nothing is technically wrong) but of what sounds natural.

            "The fact that you have seen professionals write poorly is no reason for you to imitate them." - ComicBent.

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            • #7
              Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

              Originally posted by sunglider View Post
              I understand the mechanics behind collective noun. My query is whether the mechanics should strictly apply to a proper noun "The Faithful" as used as. Unlike "The Assembly of God" which is unmistakably a proper noun, “The Faithful” when spoken or used naturally can be excused as a common noun, therefore can be pluralized, I believe.

              Like “those fanatical Faithfuls are a pain in the neck”, instead of “those fanatical members of The Faithful … ”

              Thanks all, I’m polishing my screenplay before submitting to my grammar nazi script reader for the second time.
              In dialogue:

              You might consider having those within the group simply say something along the lines of "He is Faithful," or "He is not of The Faith," or even "He is lost."

              Non-members can simply refer to them as "those fanatics," (or something similar) unless your story is so chock-ful of zealots that we otherwise can't keep track. :-)

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              • #8
                Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

                Well in dialogue, you can just use whatever you think the character would say. Proper grammar doesn't really apply unless your character's a stickler for grammar as part of their spoken vernacular. I would bet that most people wouldn't bother saying "Those members of the Faithful" - they'd say something like "Those Faithfuls" or "Those Faithful guys" or whatever.

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                • #9
                  Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

                  I am going to bow out of this overlong discussion and wish everyone good luck.

                  If anyone now or later has a question about grammar, I will be happy to help with it. Just send your question to me by email, at:

                  [email protected]

                  "The fact that you have seen professionals write poorly is no reason for you to imitate them." - ComicBent.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

                    Originally posted by sunglider View Post
                    I've named a band of religious zealots "The Faithful". As a proper noun, is it fine to pluralize it when referring to a group of individual members, as the Faithfuls, or just a collective noun, the Faithful (capped)? How about a single member, "he is a Faithful" as against he is a member of the The Faithful?

                    It gets confusing as I write, like ... The Faithful fills up the streets chanting "All Yours!", punching their fists up the sky.

                    Or, is it all right to just change the brand or the name to "The Faithfuls", like in rock bands.

                    Thanks in advance.

                    This isn't a question of grammar. It's a question of aesthetics.

                    You're using a word as a proper name. So the issue of how you make it a into a plural is strictly up to you.

                    You can say "They're Faithful" or "They're Faithfuls" or "They're members of The Faith." or "The belong to the Faithful." or whatever you want.

                    Really, it doesn't come down to grammar. It comes down to what sounds good. Remember -- you're just making it all up.

                    NMS

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                    • #11
                      Re: Grammar question: adjective as a noun.

                      This forum is great. Thanks for all your patience and great wisdom. I can't wait for this long overdue piece of ... to finally get to "The End-. I compare notes with my classmates, it's funny, we share the same amusement. It's like going through a gauntlet. Scriptwriting itself is not really that difficult, but the standards can be misleading. In the end, the best bet is to trust the masters. Majority in the industry are generous to the fault, but there are snarly ones, our teacher told us that they usually are the ones we can't learn much from anyway.

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