Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

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  • Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

    Are there advantages to having/getting a manager after you have an agent?

  • #2
    Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

    The order in which you find representation doesn't matter. Manager and then agent is more common. But most writers have both a manager and agent(s) because there is value in each.

    An agent has many, many more clients than most managers. More clients means less time. And less time means less attention. So with a manager, you get someone who can devote more time and attention to you and your career.

    That's the most important word: Career.

    A manager should have a long-term perspective, whereas many agents have a short-term outlook. Again, because of time and attention. With only an agent, you're placing much more responsibility on yourself to carefully consider each opportunity that comes your way and to ascertain whether it's the appropriate next step for your -- you guessed it -- career.

    Also, managers should have an ability to develop. Another keyword: Development.

    If you send a script to your agent, many times the response will either be great or lukewarm. There's really no in-between. It's either good enough to go out with or to package internally or it's a miss and not worthy of the time-investment to fix or change or mold it into something better.

    With a manager, they should be able and willing to walk the long road with you. To begin at the idea stage and to aide you in developing an idea into a finished script. And if a first draft isn't great, they should aide you in planning and approaching a rewrite, if it's salvageable.

    All that is a long-winded way of saying that, in today's industry, writers need a manager and an agent (and an attorney, when the time comes) because with only one, you're only getting half of what you need to get yourself from where you are to where you want to be.

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    • #3
      Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

      Originally posted by ATB View Post
      The order in which you find representation doesn't matter. Manager and then agent is more common. But most writers have both a manager and agent(s) because there is value in each.

      An agent has many, many more clients than most managers. More clients means less time. And less time means less attention. So with a manager, you get someone who can devote more time and attention to you and your career.

      That's the most important word: Career.

      A manager should have a long-term perspective, whereas many agents have a short-term outlook. Again, because of time and attention. Also, managers should have an ability to develop.

      Another keyword: Development.

      If you send a script to your agent, many times the response will either be great or lukewarm. There's really no in-between. It's either good enough to go out with or to package internally or it's a miss and not worthy of the time-investment to fix or change or mold it into something better.

      With a manager, they should be able to walk the long road with you. To begin at the idea stage and to aide you in developing an idea into a finished script. And if a first draft isn't great, they should aide you in planning and approaching a rewrite, if it's salvageable.

      All that is a long-winded way of saying that, in today's industry, writers need a manager and an agent (and an attorney, when the time comes). Because with only one, you're only getting half of what you need to get yourself from where you are to where you want to be.
      Does this imply that one day you will "outgrow" the need for a manager?

      Also, I feel like the order does matter. If you get a great agent, does that not imply that your writing is at a stage that might not the guidance of a manager? Since I hear managers are more likely to take on a "new" writer than an agent.

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      • #4
        Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

        Originally posted by ATB View Post
        The order in which you find representation doesn't matter. Manager and then agent is more common. But most writers have both a manager and agent(s) because there is value in each.

        An agent has many, many more clients than most managers. More clients means less time. And less time means less attention. So with a manager, you get someone who can devote more time and attention to you and your career.

        That's the most important word: Career.

        A manager should have a long-term perspective, whereas many agents have a short-term outlook. Again, because of time and attention. With only an agent, you're placing much more responsibility on yourself to carefully consider each opportunity that comes your way and to ascertain whether it's the appropriate next step for your -- you guessed it -- career.

        Also, managers should have an ability to develop. Another keyword: Development.

        If you send a script to your agent, many times the response will either be great or lukewarm. There's really no in-between. It's either good enough to go out with or to package internally or it's a miss and not worthy of the time-investment to fix or change or mold it into something better.

        With a manager, they should be able and willing to walk the long road with you. To begin at the idea stage and to aide you in developing an idea into a finished script. And if a first draft isn't great, they should aide you in planning and approaching a rewrite, if it's salvageable.

        All that is a long-winded way of saying that, in today's industry, writers need a manager and an agent (and an attorney, when the time comes) because with only one, you're only getting half of what you need to get yourself from where you are to where you want to be.
        Ah, very interesting. Thank you for that reply. Ok, next question: can I query a manager only saying 'I have an agent and am looking for a manager' or do I need to pitch one of my scripts as well? (or all of them)?

        Thanks again

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        • #5
          Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

          Originally posted by slupo View Post
          Does this imply that one day you will "outgrow" the need for a manager?

          Also, I feel like the order does matter. If you get a great agent, does that not imply that your writing is at a stage that might not the guidance of a manager? Since I hear managers are more likely to take on a "new" writer than an agent.
          IMO, no. Because there is no end to a career (unless your career ends). Managers don't just develop new writers into seasoned ones. They aide clients in developing new material and in carefully considering which step to take next in your career.

          Those two needs never end because you should always be moving forward and always developing new material.

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          • #6
            Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

            Might as well ask why get a mistress when you already have a wife. They both do different things.

            One takes care of your needs on a day-to-day basis and works for you one-on-one. He/she builds you up. They are patient and attentive. They work with you hand-in-hand-in ...

            The other is critical of most of your ideas and doesn't want to discuss them. They just want you to finish -- the process doesn't matter to them. They talk to you when it's necessary and will respond to you only when they want too. Finally, they take a larger percentage of everything you do.

            Does that help explain the differences?
            If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base.
            Dave Barry

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

              Originally posted by Centurio View Post
              Might as well ask why get a mistress when you already have a wife. They both do different things.

              One takes care of your needs on a day-to-day basis and works for you one-on-one. He/she builds you up. They are patient and attentive. They work with you hand-in-hand-in ...

              The other is critical of most of your ideas and doesn't want to discuss them. They just want you to finish -- the process doesn't matter to them. They talk to you when it's necessary and will respond to you only when they want too. Finally, they take a larger percentage of everything you do.

              Does that help explain the differences?
              So what you're saying is we should seek out an mistress who can manage us for free?
              I heard the starting gun


              sigpic

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

                Pretty much what ATB said.

                Slupo: Some people will drop their manager when they get to a certain point to save the 10% but there are plenty of pros who still have both. It depends on what you think their worth is. Some say with the tough climate, having two people talking about you is better than one, especially if they know different people, it broadens how much of the town they cover.

                Even with a good agent -- they don't want to read multiple drafts of something like a manager will. Agents can sometimes have 60-100 clients and don't have time to answer all your emails or calls if you're not super important or pester them. Managers keep 15-30 so they have more time to be hands on and get in the trenches with you to build something from the ground up.

                Filmmagician: Yes you will have to have a logline and pitch a script just like you would if you didn't have an agent. The only thing saying you have an agent will do is maybe make it more enticing for them to read but there's no guarantee. They'll want to read and decide if you are worth taking on regardless. If you have an agent I would try asking them if they can send you out to managers because a referral is taken more seriously than a query. If not, you can query and mention it but they will check in to see who it is likely (I've done it before and they've asked and emailed my last agent). Ideally you would want them to have a good relationship with each other so that's why asking the agent to refer you to someone they work with or they think would be a fit is ideal before the query route.
                Quack.

                Writer on a cable drama.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

                  I will say this:

                  I feel like the manager/agent distinction is getting more and more academic all the time. Yes, in theory an agent is more about the sale and a manager more about the career, but big management companies like Circle of Confusion or Management 360, how are they really any different? The managers have just as many clients.

                  There's the old saying about managers being able to produce, but with packaging departments, honestly, the big agencies are absolutely acting as producers, except in name.

                  If you have an agent, and want a manager, talk to your agent. Those two are going to half to work together, and the industry works on referral. "I think a manager would be a good addition to the team. Are there people you can recommend?" THey will have some names. Do your research. Say, "Can you get my script to A, B, and C?"

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                  • #10
                    Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

                    I know it's usually the other way around, but it was my agents who referred me to my manager. They weren't even my agents at the time. They read something, liked it and asked if I had anything else. Since I didn't, they sent me to a manager to help me develop material even before they signed me.

                    There are no words for how lucky I am to have found him. In addition to having another person passing my work around, the guy is BRILLIANT at story development, he reads every outline, every treatment, every draft. It's been especially helpful when I'm on assignment or pitching on OWAs. I actually think of him more like a writing partner who has the decency not to insist on doing any of the actual writing. :-)

                    I know from reading these forums that not all managers operate this way. But if you can find someone like that, it can be of enormous value.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

                      Originally posted by Ronaldinho View Post
                      I will say this:

                      Yes, in theory an agent is more about the sale and a manager more about the career, but big management companies like Circle of Confusion or Management 360, how are they really any different? The managers have just as many clients.
                      My manager just landed at Circle of Confusion, and it was my original management company way back when when I first signed with a manager so I can say that while it has grown a lot since then, those client lists aren't inflated -- especially compared to agent lists. I used to intern at a company and still surf Studio System when I get bored and would count how many clients some managers/agents had. Agents will have upwards of 60+ and that's probably not counting those they are "working" with but haven't officially put on their list.

                      But it goes back to something I think I've said before on here -- it's about the "who" not the "where". Find someone you connect with and that gets your material, regardless of what banner they are operating under. I haven't felt any changes from my manager being at his last company and now being at CoC. I just put a different name on the front of my scripts.
                      Quack.

                      Writer on a cable drama.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Why get a manager when you already have an agent?

                        Originally posted by ducky1288 View Post
                        Pretty much what ATB said.

                        Slupo: Some people will drop their manager when they get to a certain point to save the 10% but there are plenty of pros who still have both. It depends on what you think their worth is. Some say with the tough climate, having two people talking about you is better than one, especially if they know different people, it broadens how much of the town they cover.

                        Even with a good agent -- they don't want to read multiple drafts of something like a manager will. Agents can sometimes have 60-100 clients and don't have time to answer all your emails or calls if you're not super important or pester them. Managers keep 15-30 so they have more time to be hands on and get in the trenches with you to build something from the ground up.

                        Filmmagician: Yes you will have to have a logline and pitch a script just like you would if you didn't have an agent. The only thing saying you have an agent will do is maybe make it more enticing for them to read but there's no guarantee. They'll want to read and decide if you are worth taking on regardless. If you have an agent I would try asking them if they can send you out to managers because a referral is taken more seriously than a query. If not, you can query and mention it but they will check in to see who it is likely (I've done it before and they've asked and emailed my last agent). Ideally you would want them to have a good relationship with each other so that's why asking the agent to refer you to someone they work with or they think would be a fit is ideal before the query route.

                        Thank you. That all makes sense. Very helpful

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