Foremost Films

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  • #61
    Re: Foremost Films

    Originally posted by Greenwood View Post
    And i know he or any prospective manager doesn't WORK FOR YOU until they have an agreement with you -- however, just as the writer needs to show that they have the chops to be a writer, so should a rep.

    Hollywood is pretty honest, often times BRUTALLY honest, and if he's incapable of behing honest in passing on my work then that hints at yet another red flag. Will he treat his clients with kid gloves when they give a project he doesn't like? Or will he be honest and tell them what works and doesn't?

    I made it pretty clear in my post that it was not that he passed on the script that makes me question his title, but it's that he doesn't seem to be interested in the traditional role of a manager, but rather a gun-for-hire looking for that "sell itself" project for him to go wide with.

    Quite frankly, if being an effective manager just means sitting back waiting on someone to give you a "can't lose, super awesome" screenplay -- then sign me up. Not as a writer, but a MANAGER. But first you'd have to explain how that strategy would be profitable. lol
    You're reading too much into it. Some people don't like to be mean, even when they are striving to be honest. Also, every human being is different, and their reaction to having their hopes and dreams challenged are different. Not everyone can cope with brutal honesty. Now, some might say that they better get used to it, but others might feel that it's just another human trait and one that some of us ought to try and be considerate of, whether the business is or isn't.

    Your own reaction is an interesting example.

    He passed(politely) on your stuff and on you as a client but said he liked your scripts. Your putting all the focus of your interpretation of his response on the "liked your scripts," and using that to tell yourself and us that perhaps the reason he passed on you is because he is more "agent" than "manager." At the same time your ignoring the other suggestion, the polite hint, that perhaps he doesn't feel your writing is there YET but that you might have potential down the line. This would be a much more painful observation than to say that the manager isn't a good enough manager.

    Of course all of the above is speculation on my part, but you talk a lot about brutal honesty, from your post, I'm not sure you'd be up for it.

    This is a common lament among writers (not just scribes but novelists also). "They keep saying it's good, but not for them, why are these people thinking so short term, etc etc etc.' And the writers are either missing or ignoring the point of the rejection, that maybe it or you are just not for them right now.

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    • #62
      Re: Foremost Films

      Originally posted by TheCleaner View Post
      So much for "brevity is the soul of wit
      A good rant (on the other hand) needs to stretch it's legs and lope around the park a few times.

      I liked how Binger (if that is his real name) referenced a number of quotes (un-related to this thread) that backed up his position and gave his post the momentum to go deep.

      Sorry about all the brackets - too much Mclaren Vale Shiraz.
      Frustrated? Click here for help:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning...3Kruger_effect

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      • #63
        Re: Foremost Films

        Originally posted by Mycroftbrett View Post
        A good rant (on the other hand) needs to stretch it's legs and lope around the park a few times.

        I liked how Binger (if that is his real name) referenced a number of quotes (un-related to this thread) that backed up his position and gave his post the momentum to go deep.

        Sorry about all the brackets - too much Mclaren Vale Shiraz.
        That made me LOL.

        As to the rest, I've said my piece. My intention was only to undermine those baseless accusations. I don't necessarily agree with Greenwood as well, but his standpoint was voiced respectfullly.

        And he's right about one thing. Jeff does act like an agent. With him you get an agent and manager rolled into one!

        best regards

        Ha Binger

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        • #64
          Re: Foremost Films

          It's great of you to defend, Jeff, the dealings I've had with him have been very brief, but I could tell he was a great guy.
          It's the eye of the Tiger, it's the thrill of the fight

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          • #65
            Re: Foremost Films

            Would the fact that he is apparently located in NYC have any bearing on his effectiveness as a manager?

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            • #66
              Re: Foremost Films

              Originally posted by winter dreams View Post
              Would the fact that he is apparently located in NYC have any bearing on his effectiveness as a manager?
              Doesn't seem to. Mr Binger went wide recently and most people repped by him appear happy.

              I'm not, btw. That is to say I'm not repped by him. I'm happy. Well, reasonably happy. I could do with a manager and a agent. And a gig...
              @MacBullitt

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              • #67
                Re: Foremost Films

                I just queried him this morning and he responded within 30 minutes - he passed, already having a similar project, but my question is, do I query him again with another script I have that's totally different in genre?

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                • #68
                  Re: Foremost Films

                  Jeff's a great guy. He's not gonna email smackdown you for a follow up message. My suggestion would be perhaps a follow up email thanking him for his rapid response and mentioning the other script. Along the lines of-

                  'Thank you for taking the time to read ....... I understand your reluctance if you already have something similar in the works. I wish you all the best on that project.

                  In the meantime, I have another script. Totally different concept and genre....


                  Then treat it as a normal query with your logline included.

                  To be honest I'm not the best person to speak to in terms of queries. Never written one. But I know Jeff and he's a good guy always on the look out for undiscovered talent Good Luck

                  EDIT: Belated thanks to Jules. Wasn't sure how that rant of mine was gonna be recieved.

                  EDIT: And twofinger for the shoutout.

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                  • #69
                    Re: Foremost Films

                    Thanks for your advice, Harbinger, I appreciate it! I'll send him a followup and cross my fingers!

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Foremost Films

                      Originally posted by Greenwood View Post
                      And i know he or any prospective manager doesn't WORK FOR YOU until they have an agreement with you -- however, just as the writer needs to show that they have the chops to be a writer, so should a rep.

                      Hollywood is pretty honest, often times BRUTALLY honest, and if he's incapable of behing honest in passing on my work then that hints at yet another red flag. Will he treat his clients with kid gloves when they give a project he doesn't like? Or will he be honest and tell them what works and doesn't?

                      I made it pretty clear in my post that it was not that he passed on the script that makes me question his title, but it's that he doesn't seem to be interested in the traditional role of a manager, but rather a gun-for-hire looking for that "sell itself" project for him to go wide with.

                      Quite frankly, if being an effective manager just means sitting back waiting on someone to give you a "can't lose, super awesome" screenplay -- then sign me up. Not as a writer, but a MANAGER. But first you'd have to explain how that strategy would be profitable. lol
                      How have you been around this board since '06 and not figured this out for yourself? No managers write you back and say, "Look, your script shows a little bit of promise, but until you figure out how to write dialog and understand the basics of a commercial premise there's nothing I can do for you." There's no margin in it for them because writers have memories for slights like elephants.

                      I know you want to take his polite pass at face value, which is certainly easier for your ego. But given that he has worked with other writers on developing their scripts, maybe you should accept the fact that he didn't think developing your script would be worthwhile rather than drawing all sorts of inferences about his approach to the business.

                      In my experience it's a waste of time to read anything into a pass other than that the person isn't enthusiastic enough about your project to go any further. You can speculate all you want about their business practices or taste or whether they, in fact, have been hiding their illiteracy since the second grade. But while that may be an important part of the process of dealing with rejection and moving forward, at the end of the day it's just that... speculation.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Foremost Films

                        Originally posted by MrEarbrass View Post
                        How have you been around this board since '06 and not figured this out for yourself? No managers write you back and say, "Look, your script shows a little bit of promise, but until you figure out how to write dialog and understand the basics of a commercial premise there's nothing I can do for you." There's no margin in it for them because writers have memories for slights like elephants.

                        I know you want to take his polite pass at face value, which is certainly easier for your ego. But given that he has worked with other writers on developing their scripts, maybe you should accept the fact that he didn't think developing your script would be worthwhile rather than drawing all sorts of inferences about his approach to the business.

                        In my experience it's a waste of time to read anything into a pass other than that the person isn't enthusiastic enough about your project to go any further. You can speculate all you want about their business practices or taste or whether they, in fact, have been hiding their illiteracy since the second grade. But while that may be an important part of the process of dealing with rejection and moving forward, at the end of the day it's just that... speculation.

                        I stand by what I said, even moreso. And I'm amazed you allowed the entire point of my posts to go over your head. SImply put, as writers, we have to not only consider our own talents/connections, but also that of any potential reps.

                        I could care less about the "essence" of the pass, but when it starts to become clear and evident (from MANY other writers, some of whom have PM'ed me with similar experiences) that a certain rep does not fit the title in which they claim -- We should, I should, and I WILL point it out. Which, I thought, was the purpose of a DISCUSSION BOARD.

                        You can speculate, and talk sh!t all day with the "maybe he didn't wanna tell you that you suck" crap -- bottom line is just because someone OFFERS A SERVICE (writers and reps included) doesn't mean they're experts at it.

                        There's a talent aspect involved with every profession. Too often writers think that anybody that's ever worked anywhere in hollywood has the industry and craft down to a sweet science. If that were the case then 80% of studio films wouldn't flop.

                        And I respect Harbinger's urge to defend his rep, as would I. And I hope (and pretty sure) that Jeff is doing a great job for him and his project -- therein lies my whole point -- is he just great at getting scripts into studios that meet a certain alleged "can't miss" description -- or does he fit the definitive model of a manager that not only gets specs on desks to sell, but also for assignments and supports the writer's career and specific style.

                        Seems pretty simple to me. If you still don't understand it -- get taller.
                        "U don' know me, muddafugga..."
                        - Al Pacino, Carlito's Way

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Foremost Films

                          Originally posted by Greenwood View Post
                          I stand by what I said, even moreso. And I'm amazed you allowed the entire point of my posts to go over your head. SImply put, as writers, we have to not only consider our own talents/connections, but also that of any potential reps.

                          I could care less about the "essence" of the pass, but when it starts to become clear and evident (from MANY other writers, some of whom have PM'ed me with similar experiences) that a certain rep does not fit the title in which they claim -- We should, I should, and I WILL point it out. Which, I thought, was the purpose of a DISCUSSION BOARD.

                          You can speculate, and talk sh!t all day with the "maybe he didn't wanna tell you that you suck" crap -- bottom line is just because someone OFFERS A SERVICE (writers and reps included) doesn't mean they're experts at it.

                          There's a talent aspect involved with every profession. Too often writers think that anybody that's ever worked anywhere in hollywood has the industry and craft down to a sweet science. If that were the case then 80% of studio films wouldn't flop.

                          And I respect Harbinger's urge to defend his rep, as would I. And I hope (and pretty sure) that Jeff is doing a great job for him and his project -- therein lies my whole point -- is he just great at getting scripts into studios that meet a certain alleged "can't miss" description -- or does he fit the definitive model of a manager that not only gets specs on desks to sell, but also for assignments and supports the writer's career and specific style.

                          Seems pretty simple to me. If you still don't understand it -- get taller.
                          All I can go on is what you've posted. And the essence of your argument is that because he gave you a polite pass, he's not into development and isn't really a manager. Which is asinine.

                          There is no such thing as a "can't miss" script in this environment. There are scripts and concepts that might serve as solid writing samples. Until you write one of those, there's nothing that any manager can do for you. And nobody owes you their time--certainly not someone you solicited out of the blue.

                          The irony here is that you probably wouldn't have posted about him if he had never responded. Which is exactly why most reps don't respond when they pass and why they give bland praise when they do... although apparently even that can lead to seemingly baseless speculation about their abilities.

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                          • #73
                            Re: Foremost Films

                            Jeff is excellent at development and fits the "manager" mold more than most managers I've met. He is looking out for the long run--but if you're not repped by him, I don't see why you'd experience this. But I, and Harbinger, can vouch for it and him.

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                            • #74
                              Re: Foremost Films

                              Have you or Harb ever asked him why he's located in NYC? Does he have close relationships with NY-based prodcos? Does he rep theater types?

                              We always hear about how important it is for a writer to be in LA, I would think that would be especially true for a rep.

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                              • #75
                                Re: Foremost Films

                                It's just his home, but he makes frequent, prolonged trips to LA. Trust me--it's just not an issue. He knows all the right people in LA. As far as I know, he doesn't rep theater writers, but who knows?

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