Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

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  • #31
    Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

    Originally posted by figment View Post
    But he wants writers to work with a manager that has a second job as a READER.
    Mmhmmmmmmm.

    And DangoForth, even just 4 scripts a WEEK (super easy given how many desperate writers there are out there querying him) means he makes a somewhat livable income for a single, childless guy in LA who also makes money as a manager - however little he must be making. Though, I heard he charges 15% to writers who don't have agents, which I'm assuming means he thinks he's doing more work since there isn't one.

    This whole thing is just... gross. And then you have Scripts & Scribes calling him such a great guy and justifying his tactics and encouraging writers to view him as awesome, while claiming they're not endorsing this method at all. Smh.

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    • #32
      Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

      It's like he's realised he can make more money by selling picks and shovels than he can by prospecting or panning for gold.
      Know this: I'm a lazy amateur, so trust not a word what I write.
      "The ugly can be beautiful. The pretty, never." ~ Oscar Wilde

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      • #33
        Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

        Originally posted by Crayon View Post
        It's like he's realised he can make more money by selling picks and shovels than he can by prospecting or panning for gold.
        Hahahaha, yep!

        I laugh, but I'm also shaking my head at the ridiculousness.

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        • #34
          Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

          Oh man...

          I've been watching this evolve in the literary agencies over the years.
          There was a time when any agent charging any money was a scam. However, legitimate agents would make themselves available at writing conferences for a fee. Well, ok, I'm getting some agent time and feedback even if they don't decide to rep me. It's legit.

          But then agents might decide, "I can give this same service via Skype meetings." Now, that agent can be seen and submitted to via Skype for a fee.
          The next step down from that is to offer these submission consultations via email for a fee.
          The final step down is submitting for a fee and getting told, "This does not work for us at this time."

          It may be different in screenwriting but in literature, poor people have stories to tell. An agent that is culling his slush pile by charging money is hurting themselves.

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          • #35
            Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

            Originally posted by Novelist View Post
            Oh man...
            ...The final step down is submitting for a fee and getting told, "This does not work for us at this time."...
            Funniest one I'd seen was one of the stock responses from VPF's "pros":
            It just didn't grab us.

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            • #36
              Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

              Originally posted by JeffLowell View Post
              If he really wanted to whittle down potential clients, he'd just move to a referrals only system. This feels like a guy trying to keep the lights on.
              I think that's the story. He's going through a dry spell, and this is his way of earning an income. Might be a nice guy, but I wouldn't want to be one of his writers.

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              • #37
                Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                John Tomko doesn't say he's charging you directly, instead he refers you to a trusted consultant, ScriptGal (his wife). Doesn't get anymore slithery than this.

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                • #38
                  Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                  Originally posted by scripto80 View Post
                  Mmhmmmmmmm.

                  And DangoForth, even just 4 scripts a WEEK (super easy given how many desperate writers there are out there querying him) means he makes a somewhat livable income for a single, childless guy in LA who also makes money as a manager - however little he must be making. Though, I heard he charges 15% to writers who don't have agents, which I'm assuming means he thinks he's doing more work since there isn't one.

                  This whole thing is just... gross. And then you have Scripts & Scribes calling him such a great guy and justifying his tactics and encouraging writers to view him as awesome, while claiming they're not endorsing this method at all. Smh.
                  Hey Scripto,
                  First off, thanks for watching/listening to the podcast. It's much appreciated.

                  Second, I TOTALLY get what you're saying. I've known Scott for a few years now and honestly do feel that he is genuinely a good guy - which can't be said about a lot of people/companies who peddle paid services to aspiring writers.

                  We (Scripts & Scribes) have specifically attempted to NOT go the commercial route. We don't sell consulting or coverage services or special lists or a self-published "break into screenwriting" book or charge for access to the site or podcast. The only money we make (for the site and server costs and the thousands of hours we have spent making the website and 200+ podcast episodes over the 6+ years we've done it) is from Google Ads (paid for by advertisers) and a few affiliate links (paid by companies like Amazon). I never wanted to charge writers themselves.

                  We did have a "donation" link up for a couple years that earned maybe $50 in total and we've been approached by a number of different companies and script coverage services and competitions over the years, who wanted to partner with us to become our "official ___ service", which would have potentially brought in a substantial amount of additional revenue. But as I said, I don't think I'd feel right about becoming part of a machine designed solely to profit from new writers. At the same time, I'm not diametrically opposed to someone charging a small fee for their time actually helping writers, if that's what truly happens.

                  I get it that NO ONE wants to pay for something they feel should be free. And I get that having a legit rep read your material (assuming they agree to do so) SHOULD be free. But the way Scott explained it to me was that it was more like BOTH a read AND a coverage service (by a working manager who HAS broken clients and gotten them paid work.) I can see how the line is blurry and it really is a slippery slope, but my dealings with Scott have always been positive and I've found him to be a stand-up guy. Perhaps it's to keep his lights on, I don't know. I do know he has a number of working clients though.

                  As far as paid coverage services or consultants or resources, I also think that a few of them (Andrew the Script Mechanic, Lee Jessup, Carole Kirschner, or even DDP, etc.) CAN be beneficial to aspiring writers who do not have any access, experience, nor anyone capable of reading their scripts and offering useful and actionable feedback (from someone who has the experience to actually provide it). If a writer has the means and can afford to pay for professional assistance, I won't tell them not to. My only hope is their money is well spent and not squandered with some shyster offering false promises.

                  We both know there are LOTS of shady individuals who prey on newer writers and try to pilfer as much cash as they can, but I don't believe that they're all like that. The good ones are just trying to make a living in the same industry you are and if they charge a little for their time and provide a valuable and useful service in return, I don't see how that's necessarily a bad thing.

                  The prevalence for smaller managers (and even assistants!) making money off of services like pitchfests has become endemic to the industry, unfortunately, and because there are dozens of new writers entering the industry every day, I don't see it going away any time soon. All we try to do is point out who we feel are the better options, if you're going to go down that route and spend money, so that it's hopefully not wasted. Again, it's always better if you don't have to spend the money, but if a writer comes to the conclusion that they need real, professional feedback, and they have no other way of getting it (and have the means to pay for it), we're just offering our opinion of who we think isn't trying to scam them.

                  Honestly I do appreciate your feedback and will definitely take it into consideration in future interviews. I'm not perfect and/or sometimes my message doesn't come out in the right way, but we do try to remain in the corner of the writer and provide as much useful and (hopefully) helpful information we can (for free!)

                  Best,
                  Kevin
                  (Scripts & Scribes)
                  http://www.scriptsandscribes.com/

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                    Originally posted by Kfu3000 View Post
                    The prevalence for smaller managers (and even assistants!) making money off of services like pitchfests has become endemic to the industry,
                    The pitch fests started offering money because they couldn't get anyone to show up otherwise.

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                    • #40
                      Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                      Originally posted by FeechLaManna View Post
                      John Tomko doesn't say he's charging you directly, instead he refers you to a trusted consultant, ScriptGal (his wife). Doesn't get anymore slithery than this.
                      Amanda got married????

                      Can't wait to tell her because she'll be SHOCKED!

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                        Well, Kfu3000 it was nice of you to follow up with this reply. I'm still grossed out by Carr's opinions and tactics and think it sends a terrible message to writers, but I respect where you and your site are coming from at least.

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                        • #42
                          Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                          Hey Kevin (Kfu300), glad you're back from hiatus and posted 2 bonus episodes. I've always enjoyed your podcasts and your heavy emphasis on getting interviews with managers (who seem to give the best and most informative interviews). I also like how you get right to the point without wasting a lot of time with mindless chit chat like other podcasts. I was a little concerned there when I saw that the website hadn't updated for 6 months...I thought Scripts & Scribes was leaving.

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                          • #43
                            Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                            Originally posted by scripto80 View Post
                            Well, Kfu3000 it was nice of you to follow up with this reply. I'm still grossed out by Carr's opinions and tactics and think it sends a terrible message to writers, but I respect where you and your site are coming from at least.
                            I totally understand.

                            Originally posted by Friday View Post
                            Hey Kevin (Kfu300), glad you're back from hiatus and posted 2 bonus episodes. I've always enjoyed your podcasts and your heavy emphasis on getting interviews with managers (who seem to give the best and most informative interviews). I also like how you get right to the point without wasting a lot of time with mindless chit chat like other podcasts. I was a little concerned there when I saw that the website hadn't updated for 6 months...I thought Scripts & Scribes was leaving.
                            Hey, thanks Friday! We've got a new episode (with lit manager Chris Cook) on Monday and I'm recording more next week to go up later this month. Thanks for listening and the nice comment!
                            http://www.scriptsandscribes.com/

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                              Originally posted by Kfu3000 View Post
                              I totally understand.



                              Hey, thanks Friday! We've got a new episode (with lit manager Chris Cook) on Monday and I'm recording more next week to go up later this month. Thanks for listening and the nice comment!

                              Oh cool. i love how your podcast is the only one that's heavily fixated on bringing managers in to talk - let's face it, writers want to hear from those the most. And also, how you keep it lean and mean like a good movie - not a lot of wasting time. You always ask them questions that writers would want to ask them if they were there.

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                              • #45
                                Re: Reputable agents/managers charging a fee to read

                                Resurrecting this to report that Chris Sablan is now in the pay-to-play space and wants you to pay him a fee to "consult" about your script.

                                Anyone repped by him should consider what kind of loser their manager is to prey on writers in this fashion, and anyone seeking a rep should stay far the f away.

                                you have been warned.

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