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Old 06-20-2017, 12:12 PM   #11
CrissCross
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

I'd agree. Not taking any chances with your writing, not pushing the boundaries. You can always pull back.
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Old 06-20-2017, 02:38 PM   #12
MargoChanning
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

The thing is -- I thought I had.

That said, I'll take this as a learning experience.

Your opinions mean a lot. Thanks.
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Old 06-20-2017, 03:34 PM   #13
AnconRanger
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

don't know if this will help or not. but in one of my stories there were two places where i did not see...they read fine, but they weren't done.

in one scene, an old man is taking care of a boy, and the boy's grandfather drives by but doesn't stop. the old man is scared to death of the grandfather with what all that is going on in the story. i thought it was a good scene. i could feel the fear of that old man. figured a reader could, too. but then one day i realized...what would happen if the grandfather didn't drive by staring, but stopped, and came into the house and there was a dangerous confrontation which showed the conflict in the kid, fear in the old man, etc. glad i ended up having the grandfather pull in.

another part of that story was the kid, in a huge scene at the end, trying to call the police on a radio...with everything going on in that scene, running, broken windows, people getting hurt, etc, it was not lacking for drama, action, etc, and anyway, i had another character take the radio from him and tell the police everything is fine, that the boy just thought he saw a ghost and was shaken up, etc, and the police don't come.

to me the scene was good. pleased with it. it worked. but then, one day i began writing that in the heat of all of that, the police do arrive after being told everything was fine. the teapot on the stove wasn't now just hot, it started screaming when the police banged on that door with broken glass and blood all over the floor.

for me sometimes it takes a story to cook awhile before i see the blood and guts and grit and tears and stuff that i have written right past, pleased with what is already on the page. i try to think now...what if the police do show up, what if the grandfather does stops, what if yada yada... good luck!
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Old 06-20-2017, 04:28 PM   #14
MargoChanning
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnconRanger View Post
don't know if this will help or not. but in one of my stories there were two places where i did not see...they read fine, but they weren't done.

in one scene, an old man is taking care of a boy, and the boy's grandfather drives by but doesn't stop. the old man is scared to death of the grandfather with what all that is going on in the story. i thought it was a good scene. i could feel the fear of that old man. figured a reader could, too. but then one day i realized...what would happen if the grandfather didn't drive by staring, but stopped, and came into the house and there was a dangerous confrontation which showed the conflict in the kid, fear in the old man, etc. glad i ended up having the grandfather pull in.

another part of that story was the kid, in a huge scene at the end, trying to call the police on a radio...with everything going on in that scene, running, broken windows, people getting hurt, etc, it was not lacking for drama, action, etc, and anyway, i had another character take the radio from him and tell the police everything is fine, that the boy just thought he saw a ghost and was shaken up, etc, and the police don't come.

to me the scene was good. pleased with it. it worked. but then, one day i began writing that in the heat of all of that, the police do arrive after being told everything was fine. the teapot on the stove wasn't now just hot, it started screaming when the police banged on that door with broken glass and blood all over the floor.

for me sometimes it takes a story to cook awhile before i see the blood and guts and grit and tears and stuff that i have written right past, pleased with what is already on the page. i try to think now...what if the police do show up, what if the grandfather does stops, what if yada yada... good luck!
That does help. Thanks so much for taking the time to share that.
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Old 06-20-2017, 05:07 PM   #15
amandag
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

Everyone communicates differently so there's really no way to know unless you ask. Someone else suggested this and I would strongly second it. You can waste so much writing time (and immersion fatigue) trying to interpret-- and most times people use completely different words to communicate the same thing.

I would ask for specific examples (scene, plot points, pages) in the script that he felt needed a little more, as well as some tonal specifics. I would ask if he can give you a "bad example," even an example of a scene from another movie, so you can "see what he's seeing and make sure you're on the same page before taking it to the next level."

There's no reason he should have any problem with that. It saves him read time on the next draft. The only time I've ever experienced any resistance to clarification questions is if the note-giver doesn't really know what they're asking for. Being on the same page makes both of your jobs a ton easier.
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Old 06-20-2017, 11:28 PM   #16
AnconRanger
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

i don't understand the above advice although certainly well intended. a lot of really big words in it, for one.

and it's like preparing a meal for a gathering of friends, serving it, and someone can at the end tell you how this wasn't seasoned correctly, the wine wasn't chilled enough, the horsdevors (really bad spelling mishap) were too filling and limp and the the appetizers completely failed, etc.

you know, the reason the evening didn't knock over the critic may have been because his date ditched him, he showed up pissed off, and something about the table reminded him of his mother...who he is currently on the outs with...and he is allergic to seafood.

i wouldn't get too 'specific' trying to understand the specifics of others. most people, when honest, will tell you flat out they don't really know what the hell they're talking about a good bit of the time, generally. and that's just generally, not specifically.

i'd listen to all feedback for sure and be thankful for it, but then absorb and listen to your characters. see what they say about it. they love you, see.
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Old 06-21-2017, 10:02 AM   #17
MargoChanning
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

Quote:
Originally Posted by amandag View Post
Everyone communicates differently so there's really no way to know unless you ask. Someone else suggested this and I would strongly second it. You can waste so much writing time (and immersion fatigue) trying to interpret-- and most times people use completely different words to communicate the same thing.

I would ask for specific examples (scene, plot points, pages) in the script that he felt needed a little more, as well as some tonal specifics. I would ask if he can give you a "bad example," even an example of a scene from another movie, so you can "see what he's seeing and make sure you're on the same page before taking it to the next level."

There's no reason he should have any problem with that. It saves him read time on the next draft. The only time I've ever experienced any resistance to clarification questions is if the note-giver doesn't really know what they're asking for. Being on the same page makes both of your jobs a ton easier.
Great advice from both you and AR. I already told him that after I finish the script he's waiting for, I'd like to delve deeper into the "holding back" observation. He's totally amenable, as I was certain he would be. I'm not gonna grill the guy but you're right: I need to "see what he's seeing." Who knows? Maybe it will be a revelation.
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Old 06-21-2017, 05:28 PM   #18
amandag
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

Glad he's amenable to discussing his thoughts when you're finished with your current rewrite. Hoping you do receive a useful revelation! Good luck with all of your projects, M.
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Old 06-22-2017, 02:40 PM   #19
MargoChanning
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

Quote:
Originally Posted by amandag View Post
Glad he's amenable to discussing his thoughts when you're finished with your current rewrite. Hoping you do receive a useful revelation! Good luck with all of your projects, M.

Thanks so much. That goes double for you!
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Old 06-24-2017, 10:49 AM   #20
mgwriter
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Default Re: When your manager says you're "holding back."

Speak directly to the manager about it. Ask for clarification, specific examples.

Never be afraid of asking your manager a simple question. Talking to a manager is like talking to a regular person, not a god.
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