Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

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  • #76
    Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

    Originally posted by Dr. Vergerus View Post
    When I started this thread I didn't think it would be worthless
    Really?

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    • #77
      Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

      Originally posted by bjamin View Post
      Really?
      Why would I want to start a worthless thread?

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      • #78
        Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

        Originally posted by Dr. Vergerus View Post
        Why would I want to start a worthless thread?
        Don't know, dude. I don't know.

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        • #79
          Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

          This thread commenced when the OP referenced a RECENT email linking to an article authored by Write Brothers, maker's of Movie Magic that specified 5 mistakes aspiring Screenwriters ought to avoid. Moreover, in it's first bright-line suggestion, it said never to use camera directions, which included the use of "we see" etc.

          The point of the thread, as I took it, was that for some not so familiar, and who might otherwise be misled by the article, many spec screenwriters don't adhere to such a blanket-wide proscription. Or at a minimum, that there's ample disagreement on it.

          Seems valid given the numerous sagely-sorts who've weighed in on it here as well. In any event, and if only for the fact that the seminal "we see" thread hadn't surfaced in some time, it was a valid thread-starter...

          okay, okay-- back to your regularly-scheduled programming.
          " Don't really like writing. But I do like having written." Vince Gilligan, Breaking Bad.

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          • #80
            Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

            Originally posted by Dr. Vergerus View Post
            When I started this thread I didn't think it would be worthless, although that's what's turning into. Too bad.
            Turning into, sure, but the OP at the very least, and maybe the first two pages, are worth the thread creation. If only the following posts had just been continued speculation of how many pages the thread would inevitably get to. <grin>

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            • #81
              Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

              I'll take it back. It's good to share opinions, but debating those opinions, to me, is worthless and always seems to cause more harm than good. JMHO

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              • #82
                Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                I dunno...

                I submit that sharing opinions without delving/discussing the elements or merits of either side doesn't foster any further understanding of the "rule" at all.

                If nothing else, discourse on the quote rule at least provides that the opinions become intelligently held and/or offered down the road. Or, at least in this case, employed while writing...
                " Don't really like writing. But I do like having written." Vince Gilligan, Breaking Bad.

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                • #83
                  Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                  It's been proven - proven - countless times that including "we" "cut to" or camera directions does not matter to readers of consequence. These things are done regularly by writers at every stage of their careers and are in countless scripts that have won contests, been repped, optioned and sold. All you have to do is thumb through a few scripts to see this. You'll get much further developing your voice, and not curtailing that voice because of a fictitious rule.

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                  • #84
                    Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                    Originally posted by bjamin View Post
                    It's good to share opinions, but debating those opinions, to me, is worthless and always seems to cause more harm than good. JMHO
                    Maybe we should start a new thread to debate this topic...

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                    • #85
                      Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                      Originally posted by Eric Boellner View Post
                      Maybe we should start a new thread to debate this topic...
                      Call it: Arguing Preferences - Is It Worth It?

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                      • #86
                        Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                        Originally posted by wrytnow View Post
                        How do we do that, exactly? I mean, what are you telling the filmmaker to do? Are "we" belly-crawling across the floor? Or are "we" sneaking peeks around the doorjamb and then tip-toeing over to hide next to the dresser?
                        From a filmmaker's perspective, an action description such as "We sneak into a dark bedroom" has sufficient specificity and sufficient latitude to be able to understand what is intended and to envisage how it might be seen/filmed in the context of that script. It doesn't need to be more exact than that, although it could be if the writer wanted. It implies plenty, and gives anyone reading the script enough information to form a picture in their mind which is apt to the scene.

                        I'm making this observation not to be argumentative, but to try to illustrate a point. There are many ways to say the same thing and it's the writer's decision when to be very precise and when to be suggestive. There's always a balance between the two and it's a skill that improves with experience.

                        As others have said, it's a good not to get into the habit of over-thinking or over-analyzing these things because a writer can start worrying about minutiae of writing that isn't going to affect the attractiveness of their script. This goes back to Dr. Vergerus' original post in which he submits an example of how-to guides that nurture myths about scriptwriting rules or conventions.

                        The other point some of us are trying to make comes back to your comment regarding "how in touch a professional is with what the unagented writer experiences or who occupies the bottom row of the reader arena? Not very in touch, I suspect." Professionals are very in touch with writer experiences across the board, but what matters is that this all makes no difference in terms of how you write. All scripts are contenders in the same industry and the only aim is to write the most engaging and compelling movie you can within the basic conventions of screenwriting and without getting bogged down by minor detail and the merits of different variations.

                        Another matter is the tailoring of scripts to appease readers and the point has been made that it's simply not necessary to do this. I can tell you that in 23-24 years I've never once heard of a script being rejected because a writer used a device such as "we see" and I can guarantee that every professional and every experienced writer on this board can say the same thing. If it has happened, the frequency is so incredibly low that it is irrelevant. Similarly, a reader is not always the first gate-keeper - although they are usually the first person in the evaluation process, scripts are often read first by people other positions. It really is a distraction to worry about appeasing the reader, or anyone else for that matter. The real benefit for the writer is to learn not to worry about these things and focus only the movie; any other concerns are just a form of self-censorship.

                        The best way to know how this works is simply to read lots of scripts. It soon becomes clear that writers of all measures of success adhere generally to a range of basic conventions but within that there's a lot of stylistic difference and a lot of variation in the way specific details and formatting are handled. This is what the OP was writing about because it debunks the myths that so many guides try to perpetuate.
                        "Friends make the worst enemies." Frank Underwood

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                        • #87
                          Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                          Yes. I think I've said it before in other thread: the best cure for screenwriting don'ts is reading screenplays. You see all the different ways screenwriters break so-called rules and make it work.

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                          • #88
                            Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                            There is a problem with that experience, however. That problem is how in touch a professional is with what the unagented writer experiences or who occupies the bottom row of the reader arena? Not very in touch, I suspect.
                            I mentor new writers through the wga, I read for contests, I read new writers that get to me through many channels (including this place) and often read scripts by new writers in my role as a producer. On top of that, I've been reading about new writers' experiences and handing out advice here and on other boards for a decade.

                            Admittedly, I haven't read many anonymous threads on reddit, but putting that one weakness aside, I feel like I've got a handle on what's going on in the industry.

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                            • #89
                              Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                              I was hauled over the coals for the formatting style on my last script by a reader, but I'm inclined to think had I told a better story they wouldn't have cared.

                              Only thing I'll change is coming up with (hopefully) a better tale this time.
                              Last edited by Twofingeredtypist; 01-16-2014, 06:59 PM.
                              @MacBullitt

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                              • #90
                                Re: Spreading erroneous screenwriting myths

                                Originally posted by JeffLowell View Post
                                I mentor new writers through the wga, I read for contests, I read new writers that get to me through many channels (including this place) and often read scripts by new writers in my role as a producer. On top of that, I've been reading about new writers' experiences and handing out advice here and on other boards for a decade.

                                Admittedly, I haven't read many anonymous threads on reddit, but putting that one weakness aside, I feel like I've got a handle on what's going on in the industry.
                                Jeff look. The whole point of this thread, and really every thread, was to get to the point where I ask you to mentor me, and you say okay. Okay there, I've said it.

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