What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

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  • What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

    I don't know how to proceed here.

    I'm represented, not just hip-pocketed. I've been going out on generals and actively pitching the projects I'm working on. The people I'm meeting have responded with interest to my pitches. We've had lengthy discussions that have ended with "Definitely send it to us when you're done."

    But now the scripts are ready. My reps read them... and responded with "Meh. This isn't THE ONE."

    No notes. No "change this and that." Or "here's a suggestion..." Just "Nah. Not it."

    So now I'm trapped in my own head. Maybe these scripts aren't that good...

    And yet... I've read them with a discerning eye, and I believe in them. I've had independent, trusted readers who believe in them.

    But my reps don't believe in them.

    It's hard to force a salesman to push a product they don't believe in. They're still actively getting me meetings, so I don't want to go over their head and submit to execs directly. On the other hand, I don't want those conversations to die fallow when I have the completed script ready to go.

    The rep is supposed to open the doors, but when they're not on-board, then suddenly EVERY door feels closed.

    Anyone else ever have this problem? And what did you do?

  • #2
    Re: What to do when reps won't take OUT your projects?

    I'm unrepped now, but I had those reps. More than 1. Agents. Managers.

    I had 2 specs go out with 2 different firms, both written w/o their notes.

    I had zero projects go out written with reps, from concept to full draft.

    It's the most frustrating thing I've found in the business. And I had more successful friends say "If I write a script, they're taking it out." But I have not experienced the "they work for you" model of rep.

    I find most unsold writers have this experience, but the people you hear tell stories are the successful writers who didn't' deal with that out of luck or have been in the game too long so they are just on a different level As soon as you sell 1 project you go from unsold writer to sold and I the relationship changes so much.

    The answer is you do most of the work yourself.

    You probably have to leave if they aren't going to show scripts you believe in -- I assume you have friends or other people to validate that they are worthy. I assume they signed you because you could write.

    But since you may leave, why not just get more direct. Say "Bill at Company X wanted to read Script X, will you please send it to him"

    You're not alone.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

      Should probably say something along the lines of, "Don't sugarcoat it. Why don't you want to send these out?"

      I worked for a producer who phrased it to me as he, "only has so many bullets." As in, he can only send so many bad scripts to the same people before they stop returning his calls.

      It kind of sounds like your reps feel as if the scripts in question don't have many redeeming qualities, based on the lack of notes. Page one rewrite kind of stuff. Or just flawed conceptually. And they're trying to avoid that awkward conversation. Do they typically give you more detailed feedback?

      At the same time I'd generally encourage people to stick to their guns if they feel what they have is good. Just because they say it's not worth going out with doesn't mean they're right.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

        The easiest word to say in Hollywood is no.
        Plain and simple.
        No won't cost you your job.

        Fear works against you, their fear of unemployment.

        Sucks, but all you can do is leave and find somebody who believes in you.

        Or you can take a good long look at the work and ask yourself, what if they're right?

        If you accept the premise that they are wrong, then you must accept the opposite point of view.

        At the end of the day, a stellar script sells itself, so just do what we do, keep writing.

        Reps come and go but quality work almost always sells.

        The market is oversupplied, ferocious and flighty.
        Genius sees everything.
        Genius sees.

        Posey Mund.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

          Originally posted by Bunker View Post
          I don't know how to proceed here.

          I'm represented, not just hip-pocketed. I've been going out on generals and actively pitching the projects I'm working on. The people I'm meeting have responded with interest to my pitches. We've had lengthy discussions that have ended with "Definitely send it to us when you're done."

          But now the scripts are ready. My reps read them... and responded with "Meh. This isn't THE ONE."

          No notes. No "change this and that." Or "here's a suggestion..." Just "Nah. Not it."

          So now I'm trapped in my own head. Maybe these scripts aren't that good...

          And yet... I've read them with a discerning eye, and I believe in them. I've had independent, trusted readers who believe in them.

          But my reps don't believe in them.

          It's hard to force a salesman to push a product they don't believe in. They're still actively getting me meetings, so I don't want to go over their head and submit to execs directly. On the other hand, I don't want those conversations to die fallow when I have the completed script ready to go.

          The rep is supposed to open the doors, but when they're not on-board, then suddenly EVERY door feels closed.

          Anyone else ever have this problem? And what did you do?
          I won't tell you what to do. I'll tell you what I'd do. What I've done. If the production company asked to see it when I was done and rep said no, I'd email the producer, remind him/her what was said and tell him/her it was done and ask if I could send it. If they said yes, I'd send it. I've made more deals myself than my rep ever has. You can't wait around for other people to do what you can yourself. Reps don't know any more than anyone else. But sometimes they have other clients projects at these same producers and don't want you to muddy the water. They have a business the juggle and it's not always thinking of you. It's business. Your business is taking care of yourself.

          If that producer said you'd get a read if you finished it, go get your read.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

            Interesting to think of it that way: that the rep' has other - more established clients - with similar projects so won't send your work out because he/she's too busy trying to set up the more established dude (and more established usually means more money.).

            I was in the situation where I had a damn good action script, but the rep' did nothing with it. He said that Hollywood's flooded with action scripts at the moment, citing one or two break-away hits as the cause.
            Stupidly, I accepted that and went back to working on new projects.
            What I should have done was ask, "If action's in, why not go out with it then?", but live and learn.

            I hadn't contacted any producers because I had the rep', but had I done and any expressed an interest, I'd definitely have sent the script out. After all, it won the manager over, so it had to at least be of an acceptable standard.

            Annnnyway, after all this talk of approaching producers oneself and skipping the rep' when he/she won't believe in/work for you, I'm curious as to whether or not the rep' still gets 10% of any sale, or would it be best to go back to the manager and say, "Hey, Mr. X loved that script after all and wants to buy it - could you negotiate?"
            That would earn him his cut.
            Cufk, Tish, Sips.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

              Originally posted by Grandmaster View Post
              Interesting to think of it that way: that the rep' has other - more established clients - with similar projects so won't send your work out because he/she's too busy trying to set up the more established dude (and more established usually means more money.).

              I was in the situation where I had a damn good action script, but the rep' did nothing with it. He said that Hollywood's flooded with action scripts at the moment, citing one or two break-away hits as the cause.
              Stupidly, I accepted that and went back to working on new projects.
              What I should have done was ask, "If action's in, why not go out with it then?", but live and learn.

              I hadn't contacted any producers because I had the rep', but had I done and any expressed an interest, I'd definitely have sent the script out. After all, it won the manager over, so it had to at least be of an acceptable standard.

              Annnnyway, after all this talk of approaching producers oneself and skipping the rep' when he/she won't believe in/work for you, I'm curious as to whether or not the rep' still gets 10% of any sale, or would it be best to go back to the manager and say, "Hey, Mr. X loved that script after all and wants to buy it - could you negotiate?"
              That would earn him his cut.
              Exactly. When I sold my series, which I wrote and sold without ever telling my rep because I didn't need him trying to be a producer, I had an established relationship with the production company who had mentioned at the end a meeting what they were looking for series wise. I asked if I could give it a shot. They said sure, why not. They had other writers they'd talked to trying to come up with something to fit the kind of show they wanted. I wrote a pilot. They loved it. They bought it. I called my rep and said, "Guess what? I sold a series to so and so, negotiate the deal for me." He got mad for about half a second that he was out of the loop, then thought about the money. He negotiated a good deal. Now we'll see if it goes anywhere. I've paid him on every deal that I've gotten myself except one that was done when he signed me. But,

              He's not my boss. No rep is your boss. The only person who's going to watch out for you all the time is you.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                Thanks everyone! Some real good words and advice here. It's reassuring to know that it's not an uncommon problem.

                My plan now is to call in some favors for honest reads from colleagues in the industry. If those reads come back positive, then I'll send the script out myself.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                  All good advice here. It's crucial to now get other feedback on your script from people who won't sugar-coat, and it sounds like you're doing that.

                  Most of us have run into this before. Hell, the original draft of my best script ever landed with a complete thud at my agency. Very awkward conversation where they said they really couldn't do much with it After getting equally unenthusiastic feedback from others, I accepted that it wasn't resonating with people, rewrote it and boom - totally different reaction from everyone, lots of enthusiasm, went out wide. Turns out the idea was sound, but people weren't feeling the original execution, even though I liked it. Not saying this is the case with you, but listen to your other feedback, and if it's not what you'd hoped, take a long, hard look at it before taking it out yourself. Maybe there is a better way to execute. Hope that's not the case, and good luck!
                  https://twitter.com/DavidCoggeshall
                  http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1548597/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                    I recall having an idea my manager and I were excited about, but our agent said "no" because a bigger client at the agency (not his client) had "similar idea." I've yet to see that script come out from that writer, maybe he wrote it, maybe he didn't. But WTF do you do then? You can write it, but then you have to probably find a new agent. It's so weird. You have to be original, but as we all know from reading screenplays and seeing movies, that's hard. Voice is what is original. Concepts rarely are. Maybe never. It's the way they are made or written that makes them unique. Voice.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                      Originally posted by Bunker View Post
                      It's reassuring to know that it's not an uncommon problem.
                      It happens literally all the time and it's a rude awakening, especially if you had a big splashy entrance into an agency. I have written some that make noise and others not at all - crickets. I found a lot of solace in this forum when others said they had been through it too, especially pro writers.

                      I find agents in particular are much harder to please. When in situations like this, I try to gather more opinions before making any quick judgements. A quiet slip to a producer you trust is always a good gauge. Sometimes it comes down to just moving on. I burned a lot of time on rewriting a clunker one year, and it definitely was not the best use of my time.

                      I've also worked with very established producers and had a tremendous amount of agency support, and then those have fallen through too. You just never know. It's a gamble every time. It seems things really *really* need to stand out now for a rep to invest their time, especially a spec. The execution of course has to be great, but market timing is also an (uncontrollable) factor.

                      That said, agents can be wrong too. Only thing you can do is gather enough meaningful opinions to see if something is there, and if not, move on. Sometimes you might hit a single, a double, sometimes a home run.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                        Originally posted by Grandmaster View Post
                        ...

                        Annnnyway, after all this talk of approaching producers oneself and skipping the rep' when he/she won't believe in/work for you, I'm curious as to whether or not the rep' still gets 10% of any sale, or would it be best to go back to the manager and say, "Hey, Mr. X loved that script after all and wants to buy it - could you negotiate?"
                        That would earn him his cut.
                        Technically, managers are not supposed to negotiate deals for the writer.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                          I've had this happen to me on two scripts back to back with my agents last year. Both times they called and said they didn't think the pilot was of the same caliber as my past work and they didn't want to send it out and disappoint the "fan base" I had built... At the time it sucked because I liked those projects and it stung to think about all the time that went into them. Over a year later I look back and believe my agents were absolutely right. Those pilots weren't on the same level and wouldn't have made any sort of splash - sending them out would have been a waste of time. They weren't terrible by any means, but people in this industry, especially agents, read and see a lot. Sometimes writers don't which is why feedback can be different -- it passes the test with some writers because they don't read 15 scripts a week.

                          Not saying this is the case for you, and maybe you just send it over to the production company yourself because you established a relationship - it could go well or you could never hear from them. You never know.

                          As for those two scripts, I learned my lesson and wrote another pilot and that one they loved and to be fair it was better than the last two in almost every aspect. That's how it goes in this business.
                          Quack.

                          Writer on a cable drama.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                            Originally posted by ducky1288 View Post
                            As for those two scripts, I learned my lesson and wrote another pilot and that one they loved and to be fair it was better than the last two in almost every aspect.
                            I'm really curious as to what the "lesson" was. Did you end up changing your writing style, or your vetting of concepts? Did you start doing the "send the reps 5 loglines a week to get their approval"? Or did you just keep writing as usual, and the next one happened to hit?

                            Your story is very similar to mine, with the back-to-back passes and phrases like "fan base."

                            Right now, I'm mentally oscillating between "defiant conviction" and "self-doubt." (I guess another way to put it is, "Is the problem them or is the problem me?") This had led to a week-long creative paralysis and I'm trying to break out of it.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: What to do when reps won't take our your projects?

                              Originally posted by Bunker View Post
                              Right now, I'm mentally oscillating between "defiant conviction" and "self-doubt." (I guess another way to put it is, "Is the problem them or is the problem me?") This had led to a week-long creative paralysis and I'm trying to break out of it.
                              Jesus, this is definitely me right now. You're not alone!

                              Comment

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