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Old 09-13-2019, 10:23 PM   #361
finalact4
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by gregbeal View Post
Unless things have changed, this is how Nicholl first round reading works:

Every script is read twice. Those scripts receiving at least one strong positive score (typically the cut-off is 80 or just above 80) are read a third time.

For instance, let's say the strong positive read cut-off for a given year is 80. That means all scripts receiving an 80 as one of their first two reads will receive a third read, no matter what the second score is. If a script does not receive at least one 80, it will only be read twice.

The best two scores of the three reads are used to determine the quarterfinalist scripts.

In this example, it would be possible for a top 10% script to garner scores such as 78-78 and not receive a third read.

It would be possible for a top 20% script to be read three times with scores such as 80-65-60 (though most top 20% scripts would only receive two reads with scores similar to 73-72).
thanks, Greg, i wasn't sure how it all works-- just heard someone's experience.
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Old 09-13-2019, 10:42 PM   #362
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by Friday View Post
So, what's the minimum amount you can spend on the Blacklist and still get a good result?
minmum? $105 gets you one month of hosting and one review. if you get an 8 or above you'll get an offer to take on a free eval. but if you get an 8 you'll hit the weekly newsletter, get on the top list for the month and quarter. you'll get attention but will prolly have to continue to host your script. if you get a "reader recommendation" it shows as a blue badge on your script list. if you receive enough positive reviews they may offer you, FREE, to be on their Featured Script and they will team you up with a graphic artist to help you design your movie "poster."

Quote:
I am not too clear on all the jargon about quarterly lists, waiting for your review, while hosting.... Wouldn't you only host if you get an 8 or above and just do it for a few months? For anything below, you just discontinue?
you have to host your script even while you're waiting for your eval to come in. you might keep hosting your script if it's on the list--> weekly, monthly, quarterly, yearly. as long as your average is above the community average which is 6.12 right now.

evals can take three weeks. if it takes more than 3 weeks TBL will give you a month of free hosting. a score of a 7 can also have 8s in the categories, so a 7 can be good, too, it just depends.

as long as you're on the lists the better chance you have a getting downloads.

the contacts i received that offered to option two specs happened in the first couple of months.
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Other questions, people who haven't used the blacklist are: Who's downloading your scripts? Sometimes, you don't want to approach someone who might have already read your script anonymously on the Blacklist. Also, for the top contests, if you do really well in one top contests, usually you'll land in another top contest. What's the consistency of a high contest placer doing well on the Blacklist? Just trying to get a gauge of their judging.
pro members are actors, directors, agents, managers... there could be interns for companies signing on, and other industry people but you NEVER know WHO is downloading your script. you receive an email telling you an industry pro downloaded it. that's all you get.

with any of it, it's a hit or miss. i think that's fair. if you go onto the black list you can look at all the top scripts and see how many are contest place winners. i also posted these numbers earlier today, and feel they are worth considering...

Quote:
so, here are the actual stats from the black list site of all 3256 scripts hosted:

2 have financiers attached
66 have agents
124 have managers
34 have both agents and managers
130 have producers attached

#of scripts on the top lists
167 for the QTR - requires min of 2 ratings above 6.12 (community average)
196 for the YEAR - requires 4 ratings above 6.12 (community average)

and we all KNOW that writers with reps have an advantage because their rep can go onto the site, download the script and rate it a 10. happens all the time. so even if they get a good review and a shitty review they stay way on top.

with that in consideration, how many of those top scripts have a manager, agent, and/or producer? one could assume that the majority of the scripts on the top list for the quarter would be within the "repped" category, no?
not sure if you saw that. hope some of this helps.
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Old 09-13-2019, 10:56 PM   #363
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

I don't know what anyone's point is, but you are all making certain people very, very rich.
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Old 09-14-2019, 04:24 AM   #364
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by finalact4 View Post
minmum? $105 gets you one month of hosting and one review. if you get an 8 or above you'll get an offer to take on a free eval. but if you get an 8 you'll hit the weekly newsletter, get on the top list for the month and quarter. you'll get attention but will prolly have to continue to host your script. if you get a "reader recommendation" it shows as a blue badge on your script list. if you receive enough positive reviews they may offer you, FREE, to be on their Featured Script and they will team you up with a graphic artist to help you design your movie "poster."



you have to host your script even while you're waiting for your eval to come in. you might keep hosting your script if it's on the list--> weekly, monthly, quarterly, yearly. as long as your average is above the community average which is 6.12 right now.

evals can take three weeks. if it takes more than 3 weeks TBL will give you a month of free hosting. a score of a 7 can also have 8s in the categories, so a 7 can be good, too, it just depends.

as long as you're on the lists the better chance you have a getting downloads.

the contacts i received that offered to option two specs happened in the first couple of months.


pro members are actors, directors, agents, managers... there could be interns for companies signing on, and other industry people but you NEVER know WHO is downloading your script. you receive an email telling you an industry pro downloaded it. that's all you get.

with any of it, it's a hit or miss. i think that's fair. if you go onto the black list you can look at all the top scripts and see how many are contest place winners. i also posted these numbers earlier today, and feel they are worth considering...



not sure if you saw that. hope some of this helps.

Thanks for unpacking all this. For the uninitiated who know about the Blacklist, but never used it, all the little ins and outs about hosting, newsletters is a little confusing.



So, if you get an 8, wouldn't it be better just to stand pat....not risk another review where a reviewer could give a lower score? Of all those listed, I'd probably only want managers and their assistants to be downloading. I don't think any big name actors are really downloading stuff, neither are big name directors.
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:01 AM   #365
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by finalact4 View Post
i wasn't automatically assuming, joe. that's the difference joe. i'm talking from experiences, you're not. you are assuming.
This is why you exhaust me. This will be my last post to you on this topic. No guarantees about future topics.

finalact4, you say, “What you want to use for your purposes and take it out of context in doing so, imo.”

You stood up on the Done Deal pedestal and boldly announced: “so i’m here to retract previous glowing reviews of TBL website. Not afraid to admit when i’m wrong.”

You’re making a sweeping generalization that TBL, as a whole, has incompetent reviewers and that their scoring criteria is flawed.

Now, you may say I’m taking what you’ve said out of context -- again. You may say you never said you’re talking about TBL as a whole, but sorry, that’s what your statement implies.

What analysis and research did you use to make this bold statement? You heard a few writers complain about the difference in the range of their scores? You did your own personal test by submitting a screenplay?

Jeff Lowell pointed out that Franklin said scores “that diverged by more than 2 points only accounted for 4% of submissions.”

I don’t know how many hundreds or thousands of scripts TBL receives over the year, but considering, don’t you think 4% ain’t bad.

finalact4, you say, “When we look at reviews and rating I’d expect that a well written script, at the most could maybe receive a disparity of maybe 2, but mostly one rating difference. There should be an established set of standards, criteria, and guidelines. It seriously can’t or shouldn’t be what ever the **** the reader thinks that day.”

What you’re looking for is perfection, but you’re forgetting an important equation: Humans are not computers where you could punch in a program. Humans are not cloned to be alike. There unique with their own essence, thoughts, etc.

The point of all of this comes down to one word: subjectivity. A writer may not like the outcome of someone’s subjectivity, but that’s what it is.

An extreme example of this subjectivity is where I mentioned in my “rejection” thread, which sc111 pooh-pooh when I was making this point earlier, that when Quentin Tarrantino turned in his future Oscar winner for Best Screenplay, “Pulp Fiction,” to Columbia he was told, “This is the worst screenplay that this film company has ever been handed.”

finalact4, yes, I selected you as a reviewer, then you pissed me off, where I promptly unselected you, but after I cooled off, I thought just because you exhaust me in threads like the “BOLD” thread, the “Betsey Ross Flag thread in the ONE ON ONE forum, this thread, etc., it wasn’t fair of me to carry that over about swapping feedback.

Last edited by JoeNYC : 09-14-2019 at 08:20 AM.
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:05 AM   #366
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by Bono View Post
I'm afraid to ask -- is it new???
The completed script is new. And it's MARVELOUS!
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:12 AM   #367
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by JoeNYC View Post
The completed script is new. And it's MARVELOUS!
Good job. Hope to hear more about it soon. And hope you try to get it out there in some way.

We all should go back to our real jobs of writing -- scripts. Not posts.
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:37 AM   #368
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

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Originally Posted by docgonzo View Post
Someone posted the Verve Coverage Guide on r/screenwriting the other day and it mentions the BL specifically in regard to how the go about covering scripts.

The Blacklist is a company that monitors unrepresented writers with unsolicited materials. Generally, the material is not strong enough to be considered for representation but, sometimes, there is an excellent screenplay or writer waiting to be discovered. More often than not, these submissions are a pass. If so, you will probably know within the first 30 or 40 pages.

So while they are getting subs from the BL, they're looking at them with a jaundiced eye. The implication is pretty clear: aside from a rare exception, they don't see BL scripts as being ready for primetime. If that's the prevailing attitude at a mid-tier agency that is more writer-friendly than most, it's not hard to imagine how CAA or WME might feel.
This would/should cause many who are querying to not even mention their BL placement, I would think, in order to not prejudice the coverage giver even more? Is that how you took it? Or that the company itself is sometimes assigning a BL (website) script to cover, because it might interest them, and in that case... why is anyone even using the BL if its already a pariah to some agencies. Either way, holy cow.



ETA: You're missing the forest for the trees.

Per the above quote -- it doesn't matter what you think of the BL if AGENCIES think very little of the BL.

Last edited by figment : 09-14-2019 at 04:42 PM.
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Old 09-14-2019, 09:59 AM   #369
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

Quote:
Originally Posted by Friday View Post
Thanks for unpacking all this. For the uninitiated who know about the Blacklist, but never used it, all the little ins and outs about hosting, newsletters is a little confusing.



So, if you get an 8, wouldn't it be better just to stand pat....not risk another review where a reviewer could give a lower score? Of all those listed, I'd probably only want managers and their assistants to be downloading. I don't think any big name actors are really downloading stuff, neither are big name directors.
no, because all one 8 gets you is on the weekly email letter. everyone may not read every single week's email because they're on vaca, traveling in production...

to get on the weekly, monthly and quarterly lists you need TWO evaluations or an industry pro's rating (which is not equal, it's worth less even if it is an 8) pretty sure that's still the way.

if you get two 8s out of the gate i'd sit pat, or even a combo of 8/7, 8/8, 8/6, those will all keep you on the list.

you can't get on the yearly list unless you have four ratings that give you an average above the community during that timeframe.


to all who cares to listen: my only point when contributing to this thread is to provide an opinion about a service i have used for several years. i am offering this information up to help you make an informed and educated decision with your money and your writing.

i am in no way telling anyone not to use the service or to use it. i share why i do use it, how it's helped me and what my concerns are as a patron to the service site. you decide whether its of value to you or not. you decide where you spend your money, it's not my business. for me, this is about managing expectations and the more you know, hopefully, the better decisions you can make and anticipate the return/reward.

what i don't appreciate is when someone claims i'm saying something i'm not. or twists my words into something that does not align with my intentions. i've found myself baited into an argument with someone who disagrees with my experience. i'm fine with disagreements. i'm not looking for anyone to agree with me. we can't and don't all agree.

the only thing i would say, is that if you want to know what I SAID, read MY POSTS and not the interpretation of someone who doesn't like what i have to say and often mischaracterizes them, imo. if i misstate something or it comes off as not intended that's one thing, i'm happy to clarify, but what i won't do is argue with someone who continues to attack my words over and over again like a pit bull with an old sock, or referring to me by name as if i'm not in the room. it's childish and petty.

my intention is not to offend. i'm here to help with my limited experience. i'm here to learn from others that have more experience.

good luck on your projects
.
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Last edited by finalact4 : 09-14-2019 at 11:02 AM.
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Old 09-14-2019, 10:32 AM   #370
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Default Re: Franklin Leonard

Well said FA4.

Also I should add that most of my points on this or any topic can boil down to -- if you think this is bad and unfair and not transparent -- it only gets worse the closer you get to being a successful writer.

Just be prepared to be even more frustrated that you already are. Your spec can go wide and die on a vine -- 3 years of hard work just gone in 48 hours -- no idea why. NO feedback... just gone!

There is safety in knowing the rules and how to play the game. But the real game of Hollywood has no rules. There is no A to Z. No clear paint by numbers. No logic really. No numbers when you get out there... just yes or no.... and that can change every second on same project....

Somewhere there is a list of writers who tried. And a list of writers who made it all the way. And it's a very small list of writers who can have a career for more than a hot minute. This is the reality! It sucks.

If you have a backup career, save yourself. I don't. I wish I did. I don't think I'm going to make it. But I can't stop trying either. I wish I could quit it.

Good Luck. I'm done.
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