Why I don't like (most) contests

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  • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

    Originally posted by C.C.Baxter View Post
    Unless you've paid the extra fee some contests have or entered a contest that includes feedback, this practice is typical.

    How long does it takes to read a script and do full, proper coverage? Two hours? Three? If it's 2 x 100 scripts = 200 hours or five 40 hour work weeks. If you analyze 300 scripts = 600 hours or fifteen 40 hour work weeks.

    What are the judges paid per script read? If someone can't write ten pages, can they write 100?

    Many writers would benefit more from having proofreaders, editors, coverage people (like ones on DDP) check out their work prior to spending hundreds of dollars on entry fees.
    If reading a script properly is too much of a pain and unrealistic than don't advertise as such in your contest or don't sign up to judge such a contest.

    I'd have NO ISSUE with a contest that says "Pay 60$ entry fee, but we might not read your script past page 10 or even page 2, depending."

    What they do is not just fraudulent it's predatory.

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    • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

      Originally posted by JeffLowell View Post
      I was focused on television when I was breaking in. Even though I was writing screenplays concurrently with tv scripts, I don't think I even queried to try to get one read until after I was already working in tv.

      So I know I entered WB and Disney. (I interviewed for both, which is how I remember.) I may have sent a screenplay to Nicholl - I'm honestly not sure. (Greg may know if he's reading this thread.) But I know a lot of people who Nicholl has helped - there really is zero reason not to enter if you're a screenwriter.
      As far as I can tell, no one named Jeff Lowell has ever entered the Nicholl competition.

      I think you were already working professionally when I first met you on the Genie boards in 94 or 95 so there wouldn't have been many years when you could have entered.

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      • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

        That must be why I think so highly of Nicholl. I never got rejected by it.

        Originally posted by C.C.Baxter
        Many writers would benefit more from having proofreaders, editors, coverage people (like ones on DDP) check out their work prior to spending hundreds of dollars on entry fees.
        I'm not sure it's a sound strategy to spend thousands before you spend hundreds to win contests that no one in the industry cares about. But whatever floats your boat.

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        • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

          Do film festivals watch every frame of every film that pays the entry fee?

          For a feature: Is it five minutes? Ten minutes?

          Have you ever talked to a festival judge?
          "I talked to a couple of yes men at Metro. To me they said no."


          http://wagstaffnet.blogspot.com/

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          • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

            When a producer or exec or agent or manager agrees to read a script, it's because they either read a logline that intrigued them, or it was recommended by someone they trusted.

            If they have a reader cover it for them, that reader reads the entire script and judges whether or not it has the potential to be a movie, not if it is formatted correctly or there is a weird title or some grammar mistakes.

            If the person reads it themselves, they don't toss it out after two or three pages. Again, they're trying to see if it's a movie, not if it's well formatted and sticks to imaginary rules that some script consultant came up with.

            What the hell can you tell about a script's story after two or three - or even ten - pages? Not much.

            This is nuts. This is about contests trying to make more money by not paying readers per script. Knock out 75% based on two or three pages, pick the best of what's left, and collect 50k.

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            • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

              isn't there some contest that only accepts the first 10 pages? oh yeah - sundance.

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              • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                I was in a writers group once. This new guy came in to his first meeting, brought to us by this other guy in our group, and one of the first things he talked about was his plan for a contest. He was planning on getting people to pay $50 a pop, then he would read only the first ten pages of each script and give like $200 for the prize and promise to send the winning script to agents (He knew like one crappy nobody agent). This way, he said, he could make a lot of money without doing much work.

                Everybody else in the group just nodded at his awesome idea. That was the last day I spent any time in that group.

                It seems relevant to this conversation.
                Chicks Who Script podcast

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                • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                  Originally posted by NikeeGoddess View Post
                  isn't there some contest that only accepts the first 10 pages? oh yeah - sundance.
                  Sundance isn't a contest.

                  Sundance is upfront about accepting only the first 5 pages. They say if you send more they will not read them.

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                  • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                    When I was younger, I used to think I knew what a story was about just from seeing the plants within the first few minutes. But then I saw the movie, The Game, and realized great screenwriters plan on and use arrogance like mine. Everytime I thought I had it figured out, it took a turn and showed me that I had been manipulated into thinking what I thought, as it had the main character (Michael Douglas) in the story. Hopefully, this will be an awakening for Ms. Froley... and others in her position.

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                    • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                      They are stealing money under the caveat of "contest"... 2 pages?? Come on with that B.S. When you get coverage on a script the reader is going to read the whole thing, if they don't they are not doing their job. She put their business practice out on a blog simple as that. Funny thing is I never thought any contest was relevant for screenwriters except for Sundance & Nicholl.

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                      • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                        And Sundance isn't a good contest to enter as a writer only with no previous experience there. They favor projects that need an extra push.
                        Nobody's perfect.

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                        • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                          Unless you enter a contests that provides coverage/feedback or you pay that extra fee, your script is screened out from the first 10, 20, 30. Then if it's a reject there's a second screening in some contests... or so I've heard from contest judges.

                          If you think that's a short fuse, a friend of mine runs a major MAJOR music festival (you've heard of it). Watched them screen music entries. Ten seconds. Then the next song. "Is that enough??" "If it sucks after ten seconds, chances are it ain't getting any better."

                          I took the initial posting that's caused all the controversy as a tongue-in-cheek 'things that annoy a reader' list. Most books though will tell you to polish your first ten pages as they are key in grabbing a reader's interest.

                          Jeff, do appreciate your interest in the amateur screenwriting world. Do you give feedback to non-pros with your time as well?
                          "I talked to a couple of yes men at Metro. To me they said no."


                          http://wagstaffnet.blogspot.com/

                          Comment


                          • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                            Originally posted by Why One View Post
                            From her blog: "I admit that my post was snarky, glib, exaggerated, and didn't honor the people who invest their money and their hopes in screenplay competitions."

                            For me, that's enough to lay off her. Plus I saw a picture of her on Facebook. Yes, I'm a guy.
                            For sixty bucks, I gotta see more than pictures.

                            I mean, I wanna see detailed coverage. Notes, a plot summary. Suggestions for how to improve. You know.
                            If you really like it you can have the rights
                            It could make a million for you overnight

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                            • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                              ultimately, for any contest to have legs, its past winners and finalists need to be working in the industry.


                              if Jackie Robinson was an epic failure as a major league ballplayer, it would've been a longer time before players like Satchel Paige and Willie Mays got their MLB break. But players like Satchel and Jackie legitimized the Negro Leagues just as writers like Andrew Marlowe and Ehren Khruger legitimized the Nicholl (not that Nicholl needed help but it certainly didn't hurt).

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                              • Re: Why I don't like (most) contests

                                Originally posted by C.C.Baxter View Post
                                Unless you enter a contests that provides coverage/feedback or you pay that extra fee, your script is screened out from the first 10, 20, 30.
                                CC that is simply not true. Traditionally screenwriting contests have always required a scoring judge at minimum provide a one sentence premise summary, fill in a scoring box that addresses aspects of a script like characterization, dialogue, structure [basically, the coverage box everyone industry uses], and write a one to three paragraph statement addressing material's strengths and weaknesses and justifying one of three choices: Pass, Consider, or Recommend.

                                That requires you be cognizant of the material.
                                GirlinGray

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