Fatal Flaw?

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  • Re: Fatal Flaw?

    I think you're onto something! I have a team of scholars running it through the Dramatica Story Engine as we speak. Expect an answer in two to three months.

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    • Re: Fatal Flaw?

      Come on. Everybody knows the nightclub is the protagonist and the flashback is the antagonist.

      Silly screenwriters.

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      • Re: Fatal Flaw?

        Originally posted by JeffLowell View Post
        No, no. Clearly Rick is the antagonist of Casablanca.
        What's the catch

        Oh,who cares.
        "Would you take a f**k to save your president?"

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        • Re: Fatal Flaw?

          Personally, my favorite scene in CASABLANCA is when the fat man swats the fly in the BLUE PARROT. I think he should have been developed into a Main Character

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          • Re: Fatal Flaw?

            Originally posted by Rantanplan View Post
            Personally, my favorite scene in CASABLANCA is when the fat man swats the fly in the BLUE PARROT. I think he should have been developed into a Main Character
            The fly or the fat man?

            I can see both working.
            "Only nothing is impossible."
            - Grant Morrison

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            • Re: Fatal Flaw?

              I've had enough of Casablanca - who's the Protag in "A Christmas Carol"?

              Is it Bob Cratchit?

              Ok - laugh it up

              (Sorry - this isn't a serious question!)
              Last edited by Steven Jenkins; 04-01-2010, 09:19 AM.
              "Would you take a f**k to save your president?"

              Comment


              • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                Re: loglines for Shawshank and Casablanca

                I have an idea where you are headed with this question, but before I bite...

                In my estimation, loglines are about as useful to an author as the concept of "raising the stakes." They're great for development executives and the back of DVD boxes, but they don't really give a writer the tools necessary to write a complete story. They are reductive and meaningless and should not be a part of the creative process as they don't delineate any structural features of a story. Likewise, they are not a useful tool when it comes to analysis. If they did somehow communicate the true meaning behind the author's original intent, then we would all be writing loglines instead of elaborate well thought out screenplays.

                That being said, I will concede that if I were to write loglines for those films, the first would center on Andy's story, the second on Rick's. Those are the most compelling parts of the story and would do well in the marketing or pitching of said story.

                Loglines illustrate and summarize the most interesting or compelling parts of a story. An author may choose to emphasize any portion of a story's structure, making one element more interesting than the next, with little to no effect on the structure itself. The intensity of one does not negate the necessity of the other. Whether or not Darabont spent more time on Andy's story does not change the fact that the film is seen through Red's eyes. It is his personal perspective on the events that unfold that we as an audience share, and it is an integral part of the story's message.
                StoryFanatic - story structure and analysis for screenwriters
                http://storyfanatic.com

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                • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                  Originally posted by JimHull View Post
                  Loglines illustrate and summarize the most interesting or compelling parts of a story. An author may choose to emphasize any portion of a story's structure, making one element more interesting than the next, with little to no effect on the structure itself. The intensity of one does not negate the necessity of the other. Whether or not Darabont spent more time on Andy's story does not change the fact that the film is seen through Red's eyes. It is his personal perspective on the events that unfold that we as an audience share, and it is an integral part of the story's message.
                  I still don't see anything here that goes against the idea that Red is simply the Narrator, telling the story of Andy, the Protagonist.

                  If you don't think Red's role fits this already pretty well established storytelling device, could you please explain why.

                  It seems like you're trying to sell a new paradigm to replace one that currently works perfectly well.
                  "Only nothing is impossible."
                  - Grant Morrison

                  Comment


                  • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                    Originally posted by Steven Jenkins View Post
                    I've had enough of Casablanca - who's the Protag in "A Christmas Carol"?

                    Is it Bob Cratchit?

                    Ok - laugh it up

                    (Sorry - this wasn't a serious question!)
                    "Would you take a f**k to save your president?"

                    Comment


                    • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                      Originally posted by instant_karma View Post
                      I still don't see anything here that goes against the idea that Red is simply the Narrator, telling the story of Andy, the Protagonist.

                      If you don't think Red's role fits this already pretty well established storytelling device, could you please explain why.

                      It seems like you're trying to sell a new paradigm to replace one that currently works perfectly well.
                      here's my take that i posted several pages back.

                      redd talks about how he spent so many years inside that he didn't think he could survive in the real world. remember when the first old guy got released and hung himself? redd thought he was on that same path but andy's desire to get out of that prison even after 17 years inspired him to survive out there. that's why redd is the protagonist and andy is the main character.

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                      • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                        Originally posted by NikeeGoddess View Post
                        here's my take that i posted several pages back.

                        redd talks about how he spent so many years inside that he didn't think he could survive in the real world. remember when the first old guy got released and hung himself? redd thought he was on that same path but andy's desire to get out of that prison even after 17 years inspired him to survive out there. that's why redd is the protagonist and andy is the main character.
                        To me, that's just a character's arc being altered by interacting with the protagonist. Which should happen to a greater or lesser degree with almost every major character the protagonist encounters. Again, I think this has already been quite well established in various story telling theories, and I don't see the need to try and create a new storytelling device to address a problem that doesn't exist.
                        "Only nothing is impossible."
                        - Grant Morrison

                        Comment


                        • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                          Can you make it that the USB is encrypted and can only be decrypted by inserting it into a specif computer with the proper MAC address [ Media Access Control ]

                          That solves your issue right there.

                          Originally posted by Steven Jenkins View Post
                          I just spotted a huge flaw in my story - but think it isn't critical. Just after some advice

                          My plot is about getting a mem-stick with vitally important data on it to a particular person & place.

                          My flaw is that this data could feasibly be uploaded to the person via the internet, or the mem-stick posted in the mail, which kinda undermines my hero's hazardous trek across the country.

                          I'm covering this flaw by exposing that the mem-stick is hardware protected, so if it's inserted into a standard USB port the data gets fried - and if it's posted in the mail it could get intercepted by the authrities who are hunting for the mem-stick.

                          This arse-covering seems a bit feeble I know, but I'm still feeling kinda safe here because my flaw is the self-same one I've just spotted in STAR-WARS, and nobody else ever seems to have done so.

                          What do you think? Am I safe on this one, or not?

                          Many thanks

                          Steve Jenkins
                          rebel base
                          3rd planet on left past death-star
                          galaxy far-far-way

                          hmm!
                          Maybe I just answered my own question.
                          Screenplay Questions & Answers - http://screenplayqa.com

                          Comment


                          • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                            Thanks for the hint

                            I was more thinking along the lines of USB voltage, with the higher voltage of a standard USB burning out the circuits.

                            But that would have needed unnecessary exposition.

                            I thought about a give-away line that it's protected, which later turns out to be a lie.

                            But in the end I've abandoned that ploy altogether, and made the antagonist (the cat ) want my hero to read the contents as part of her cunning stunt.
                            "Would you take a f**k to save your president?"

                            Comment


                            • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                              hahaha

                              if you ever need any computer/hacker ideas just let me know. I'm a programmer for a living - ya know until someone decides to pay me to write about stuff, instead of actually doing stuff.

                              Originally posted by Steven Jenkins View Post
                              Thanks for the hint

                              I was more thinking along the lines of USB voltage, with the higher voltage of a standard USB burning out the circuits.

                              But that would have needed unnecessary exposition.

                              I thought about a give-away line that it's protected, which later turns out to be a lie.

                              But in the end I've abandoned that ploy altogether, and made the antagonist (the cat ) want my hero to read the contents as part of her cunning stunt.
                              Screenplay Questions & Answers - http://screenplayqa.com

                              Comment


                              • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                                Originally posted by JimHull View Post
                                Re: loglines for Shawshank and Casablanca

                                I have an idea where you are headed with this question, but before I bite...

                                In my estimation, loglines are about as useful to an author as the concept of "raising the stakes." They're great for development executives and the back of DVD boxes, but they don't really give a writer the tools necessary to write a complete story. They are reductive and meaningless and should not be a part of the creative process as they don't delineate any structural features of a story.
                                Reductive in a good way. Loglines are crucial to my creative process, crucial as headlights on a car.

                                Protagonist, antagonist, goal and stakes - understanding a story at its base lets a writer see where other elements should build, branch and connect. Loglines aren't mandatory, but they're really not meaningless endeavors.
                                Standing on a hill in my mountain of dreams telling myself it's not as hard, hard, hard as it seems.

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