Fatal Flaw?

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  • Re: Fatal Flaw?

    while i personally don't feel a separation exists, i respect that there are other views with different levels of experience. i'm just not really sure how this helps, rather than hinders, understanding of story dynamics.

    i keep imagining the chaos of sending a script off to be reviewed, and the notes come back as: protagonist doesn't arc enough. "well, no, that's my mc, and he arcs just fine. the protagonist is the other guy."

    i have followed these boards for awhile, and it seems from my limited view, like there is already a big enough problem in hw, getting us new writers to respect commonly applied aspects of structure...? i don't know, maybe that's on cue or maybe it's overly dramatic. but, really, a common language does have its advantages.
    Last edited by asjah8; 04-10-2010, 12:00 PM.
    life happens
    despite a few cracked pots-
    and random sunlight

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    • Re: Fatal Flaw?

      Originally posted by jonpiper View Post
      I don't understand Jim's theory/model, its quite complex, something an engineer would devise. But I see the benefits of separating the Protagonist and Main character--at times.

      When the protagonist and main character are allowed to be two different characters, I think we can be more flexible and creative when developing a story.

      The protag and MC can be the same character. It's our story, our choice.

      No longer must our main character pursue a single external goal that affects everyone. Our main character, the character who our story is about, the character we will learn the most about, can pursue a variety of internal and external goals as the story progresses.

      Meanwhile, another character, call him the protagonist, pursues the story goal and is instrumental in driving the complete story forward as our main character faces all kinds of obstacles not even related to the story goal.

      Let's call these characters, what they are.

      Character 1. Character Who The Story Is About. (Once called the Main Character)

      Character A. Character Who Pursues The Goal That Shows Up In Our Logline (Once called the Protagonist)
      This my friends, is a sick post.

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      • Re: Fatal Flaw?

        In what sense of the word Sick?

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        • Re: Fatal Flaw?

          As in..."dynamite!"

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          • Re: Fatal Flaw?

            Thanks, Bros. You had me doubting myself. I thought I wasn't clear.

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            • Re: Fatal Flaw?

              Upping for discussion. Who here thinks Frodo is the MC, and Gandalf the protag? And can that situation work successfully in a screenplay?

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              • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                What? The definition of protagonist is main character. I am confused.

                And where did this thread come from - 27 pages?

                - Bill
                Free Script Tips:
                http://www.scriptsecrets.net

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                • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                  It's an old thread. People argued that the Protag and the MC can be split in a movie. They used Shawshank Redemption and other movies for examples. I'm curious if other people believe the same. I always thought the MC and Protag were the same until I read this thread. It had me wondering if it's true they can be split or not.

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                  • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                    The protagonist in the person standing in the middle of the movie poster.

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                    • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                      Originally posted by Deion22 View Post
                      It's an old thread. People argued that the Protag and the MC can be split in a movie. They used Shawshank Redemption and other movies for examples. I'm curious if other people believe the same. I always thought the MC and Protag were the same until I read this thread. It had me wondering if it's true they can be split or not.
                      I believe Pirates uses this model.

                      The writer said that the chick is the hero/protag and Depp is the Main Character.

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                      • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                        Originally posted by BattleDolphinZero View Post
                        I believe Pirates uses this model.

                        The writer said that the chick is the hero/protag and Depp is the Main Character.

                        You bring up a great point about Pirates. That makes sense. Thanks for the insight.

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                        • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                          Originally posted by TwoBrad Bradley View Post
                          And what about Pirates of the Caribbean? Elizabeth is the protagonist while the story is Mainly focused on a different Character.
                          Hello?
                          "I am the story itself; its source, its voice, its music."
                          - Clive Barker, Galilee

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                          • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                            you said that years ago, I gave it a fresh voice

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                            • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                              Originally posted by BattleDolphinZero View Post
                              you said that years ago, I gave it a fresh voice
                              Now that I think about it, your version is truer to the book.

                              A little cameo would have been nice.
                              "I am the story itself; its source, its voice, its music."
                              - Clive Barker, Galilee

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                              • Re: Fatal Flaw?

                                At the script stage on PIRATES the chick was the protagonist and all three of the men were equals. After casting, that changed.

                                Casting can change the intent of a story. I have a Script Tip on the movie BASIC - the script had a female lead with a male secondary character who helps her. They cast Travolta as the secondary character and Connie Neilson as the lead... and that turned Travolta into the lead... except his character can not be the lead if the story is going to work. She didn't even make the poster! It ruined the film. Now, you can look at that film and "decide" that Travolta was the lead and she was the protagonist - but that's not how it was at the script stage.

                                - Bill
                                Free Script Tips:
                                http://www.scriptsecrets.net

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