Is a romantic relationship necessary?

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  • Is a romantic relationship necessary?

    I finished my first script earlier in the week, a family-action-comedy, and just received notes from a paid consultant. For me, personally, the experience was well worth the investment. The review was positive in pointing out numerous strengths, including a confession of surprise that the script's premise could be that entertaining. The review was also constructive in pointing out problems of too many small conflicts and too many characters.

    However, the consultant's harshest and longest criticism focused on the absence of a romantic relationship between the male and female lead characters--Bob and Jane. Their relationship is basically professional--he helps her win a championship. Yes, Jane is attracted to him not only because of his looks and talent, but he also literally saved the family cat. And yes, Bob likes to flirt and hints of a having a crush on her best friend. But he has a romantic interest back home, and when Jane discovers that relationship she breaks off the professional agreement. In the end, Bob does help Jane win the championship and Bob's girl from home saves the life of Jane's sister. In a closing scene, Jane handles a meeting between the three with class and maturity--a significant point in her arc. Earlier she is sarcastic and downright angry when Bob is around any other female. I felt this was a positive message for a family movie.

    In the beginning I believed a romantic relationship would be predictable between the two. If that had been the story, I envisioned the first reader's response to be in the tone of: "Boy meets girl, boy helps girl win championship, girl kisses boy and they ride off into the sunset together--how many times have we seen that before?" I didn't want an involved love story getting in the way of the action and humor--which are the main selling points of this family script. I think back to my early childhood watching some movies and asking, "When's this mushy stuff going to be over?"

    Is a romantic relationship necessary between male and female lead characters in this genre? If so, when does it become cliche? More important, how do you avoid it from becoming cliche? Can't the writer just have fun with romantic tension? I thought "Moonlightling" and the first couple seasons of "Cheers" displayed outstanding writing because of romantic tension.

    Eager to hear thoughts.

  • #2
    Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

    The only time I paid for notes, I got the same advice. Very good notes, but the whole dynamic between the male and female leads was straight out of noir.

    Having the poor schlub and the femme fatale swoon into each others' arms in the end (after all she put the tool through) was sort of an odd suggestion.

    I suppose the convention wisdom is that after spending two hours of watching a man and woman interact, the audience needs them to hook up.

    You don't have to do that, of course. It's your screenplay. But if you actually want to sell it...
    "Forget it, Jake. It's Hollywood."

    My YouTube channel.

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    • #3
      Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

      Your reader must not have known about femme fatales.

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      • #4
        Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

        Well, the thing about both MOONLIGHTING and CHEERS is that we *wanted* them to hook up. And, even though the series was dead once they did - that is the positive way to resolve the romantic tension.

        Maybe the note is really that you didn't resolve the romantic subplot to satisfaction. From the thread title, I thought you just had a male and female lead and *no* romantic element, but it seems you *have* romance in the script. So look at how that is resolved and strengthen that. But the problem you may find is that if you establish romance in the script, the audience will want them to hook up. Just the way it is.

        - Bill
        Free Script Tips:
        http://www.scriptsecrets.net

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        • #5
          Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

          Originally posted by Motorocity View Post
          "Boy meets girl, boy helps girl win championship, girl kisses boy and they ride off into the sunset together--how many times have we seen that before?"
          There's a reason we've seen it so many times before -- it's dramatic. IMO there's no better way to create drama (and comedy stems from drama) than to pull those romantic levers and watch your characters react.

          Think of it this way -- in your own life, when have you had your most maddening moments? When have you felt your happiest, been brought to tears? For me and for most people on earth, it's via romantic relationships. They're maddening. You do things you would never normally do, say things you'd never normally say... it's human drama at it's highest peak.

          And that's why we love it in our movies.

          Just my 2 cents
          Last edited by Bob Smargiassi; 07-22-2011, 10:46 PM.

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          • #6
            Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

            Originally posted by wcmartell View Post
            But the problem you may find is that if you establish romance in the script, the audience will want them to hook up. Just the way it is.

            - Bill
            Can we distinguish between "romance" and "romantic tension?" It seems as if we must follow some kind of "if A, then B" logic. That is, if there is some attraction, respect and playfulness (romantic tension), then it must develop into romance in a successful script?

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            • #7
              Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

              Here's another way of thinking about it:

              One of the pleasures of a good movie is seeing the romantic relationship between the leads. Audiences expect it in the same way the expect a horror film to be scary and a thriller to be thrilling.

              That doesn't mean it has to be there, but it does mean that there's a space there, in the story, that has to be filled with something or the audience will feel cheated.

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              • #8
                Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                If you set up a mystery and don't deliver a pay off, people will get pissed.

                If you set up a joke and don't deliver a punch line, people will get pissed.

                If you set up horror and don't deliver something, people will get pissed.

                Why set something up and blatantly avoid a pay off?????

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                • #9
                  Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                  I agree with what prescribe22 and others have said. If you're setting it up, then you should also pay it off.

                  But then again, I was also one of those people who was disappointed at the lack of a final reckoning in NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                    Is there actual conflict between these two? Or does she just sort of say "Okay congrats" and disappear at the end? There needs to be CONFLICT. If you're not going to put your leads together but you're hinting at longing, there needs to be a damn good reason, and a genuine effort on the part of at least one of them to make it happen. It's not that they need to get together, but we need to feel without a doubt that this was the right ending for their story.

                    You have to make these people suffer. I'm willing to bet you're making things too easy on them because you don't want either of them to be a cheater. But people are flawed, and your characters need to be flawed - DEEPLY FLAWED - so they have a bigger place to come back from. Jane sounds too subtle in her flaws.

                    See also:

                    My Best Friend's Wedding
                    Casablanca
                    Once
                    Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon
                    Wes Anderson's entire body of work
                    Chicks Who Script podcast

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                    • #11
                      Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                      Originally posted by prescribe22 View Post
                      If you set up a mystery and don't deliver a pay off, people will get pissed.

                      If you set up a joke and don't deliver a punch line, people will get pissed.

                      If you set up horror and don't deliver something, people will get pissed.

                      Why set something up and blatantly avoid a pay off?????
                      I didn't blatantly avoid a payoff because nothing about the theme, premise or plot was designed as romantic comedy. It is an action comedy. As for this small element of the script, the payoff was that Jane matured and Bob was faithful to his girl back home. Positive message, yes? Different, yes? Effective, I guess not, but I didn't realize an automatic red flag popped up for this scenario.

                      I agree a movie written to mystify, humor or scare the audience will flop if there are no respective payoffs in the overall outcome. However, not every gun is a clue in a mystery, not every dog pees on someone's leg in a comedy and sometimes the floor creaks because the guy is delivering a pizza, not wielding a chainsaw. And sometimes guys and girls don't crawl in the sack, even if they have chemistry.

                      I'm not digging a trench on this issue--just contributing to the debate. I intend to write out the love interest back home. This reduces the character count--which the reader suggested--without upsetting any critical beat in the plot. I can let Bob and Jane have a little more fun, although I'm not sure they'll ride off in the sunset together. That's just too convenient at this point.

                      Very useful feedback. Thanks to all.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                        Originally posted by Motorocity View Post
                        I didn't blatantly avoid a payoff because nothing about the theme, premise or plot was designed as romantic comedy. It is an action comedy. As for this small element of the script, the payoff was that Jane matured and Bob was faithful to his girl back home. Positive message, yes? Different, yes? Effective, I guess not, but I didn't realize an automatic red flag popped up for this scenario.

                        I agree a movie written to mystify, humor or scare the audience will flop if there are no respective payoffs in the overall outcome. However, not every gun is a clue in a mystery, not every dog pees on someone's leg in a comedy and sometimes the floor creaks because the guy is delivering a pizza, not wielding a chainsaw. And sometimes guys and girls don't crawl in the sack, even if they have chemistry.

                        I'm not digging a trench on this issue--just contributing to the debate. I intend to write out the love interest back home. This reduces the character count--which the reader suggested--without upsetting any critical beat in the plot. I can let Bob and Jane have a little more fun, although I'm not sure they'll ride off in the sunset together. That's just too convenient at this point.

                        Very useful feedback. Thanks to all.
                        I like this line of thinking... breaking the standard pattern, or at least questioning it. Bodes well for originality in your work.

                        Try this: All you have to do is think of a similar movie, that was successful, that didn't end up with the guy and gal riding off into the sunset. Sometimes it's worth the ambiguity, or leaving a little to the audience's imagination. Think Denzel and Julia in "The Pelican Brief". In fact, I stole that very type of relationship for one of my own scripts, even to writing the protag for Washington himself and putting that casting suggestion right into my query!

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                        • #13
                          Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                          You are fighting the note instead of listening to it. There was a reason the note was given - find the way to resolve that problem.

                          - Bill
                          Free Script Tips:
                          http://www.scriptsecrets.net

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                          • #14
                            Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                            Or the note was wrong and listening to it will ruin your script.

                            Or somewhere in the middle.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Is a romantic relationship necessary?

                              Originally posted by Motorocity View Post
                              However, not every gun is a clue in a mystery, not every dog pees on someone's leg in a comedy and sometimes the floor creaks because the guy is delivering a pizza, not wielding a chainsaw.
                              I think that's wrong on all counts. If you set up something, you pay it off. If you are filling out your script with meaning less details that don't pay off, it's just weak, incoherent writing. If the gun serves no purpose, cut it. If the dog serves no purpose, cut it. If the creaking floor serves no purpose, cut it. In screenwriting, everything should be in there for a purpose. Moreover, your romance example is much bigger than any of the minor details you just mentioned.

                              In other words: It sounds like you have introduced a major side-plot in the story, it literally lasts throughout the entire script. But you never resolve it. It never builds up into a CLIMAX. You have to resolve side-plots as well, now you just leave it hanging.

                              That's a lot of build-up with no payoff.

                              TV-series are not very good comparisons BTW, because usually on TV the audiences expect the characters and character relationships to stay more or less the same from year to year. That's the appeal - We turn on to watch them because we like those characters and their relationships exactly as they are. When the dynamics do change, the series often fail to work - Which is what happened with Moonlighting.

                              But in movies we expect the characters relationships to be permanently resolved in two hours. So it's wiser to look for comparisons in movies, not on serialized TV.

                              Since you don't want these two characters to end up romantically/sexually engaged, but you want to keep the sparks flying... Look for examples in other movies with similar romantic stories. It could be the main plot, or a side plot, doesn't matter. But in good movies there is always a clear climax to every story-line, they are resolved. Other people already mentioned good titles.

                              You can't have a major side-plot end up with the characters shrugging their shoulders and just carrying on with their lives. You have to build up into a bigger emotional climax, even if it's executed in a subtle way.

                              Characters should have clear and definitive needs, and major obstacles on their way. So if Jane wants the Bob, what is the force that stops her?

                              And if Bob wants Jane, what is the force that stops him? You description of him makes him sound a bit like an ass - He flirts and has a crush on Jane, despite having a "romantic interest" back home?

                              Just an example: I don't know what the "romantic interest" is, but if Bob has a girlfriend he has dated for one year, it's low stakes and weak obstacle. If he has a wife of 15 years and two kids, that's big stakes and a strong obstacle. The audience can also understand him better, because we all know that people get bored in long marriages and might get tempted. And at the end of the story it makes perfect sense that the two leads don't end up together.

                              Writing the romantic interested out of the script like you suggested makes the whole thing sound weird. If Jane and Bob are romantically and sexually interested in each other, and there is nothing stopping them... Then they should have sex, and get romantically involved. Not having them end up together makes no sense anymore.

                              If they don't end up together despite wanting to, you better give a very good reason.

                              You have to think everything from the audience's perspective, they are going to be asking questions:

                              "These two characters want to have sex together, but they don't. Why is that?" - You have to answer this, and the answer has to be so strong and good that the audience buys it.

                              "These two characters are romantically interested in each other, but they don't hook up. Why is that?" - Again you have to give an answer, and answer has to be so strong that the audience understands it.

                              "The male lead has a romantic interest back home, but he keeps on flirting with our heroine. Why is that? Is he a womanizer? A cheater?" - What's your answer, so that the audience buys it without starting to dislike your male lead?

                              Just something to ponder.
                              Last edited by tuukka; 07-23-2011, 12:55 AM.

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