White action hero too generic but female not bankable

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  • #16
    Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

    EXACTLY!! There are no descriptions of white or black for the lead because they can get Denzel or a white guy. SALT was a 'guy' in the spec. Didn't say white or black. Even TRAINING DAY didn't describe white or black. I've known a few Alonzo's who were not black. Just sayin'. Unless the casting director screws up and casts a black guy in a white role, then you have problems. DAREDEVIL anyone?

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    • #17
      Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

      One of my past scripts stated that the lead was a minority female in the logline because it was part of the storyline. The number of requests to read it was very, very small. But it might have been the storyline that wasn't interesting. Will never know.

      Re: " Too often writers have generic character types - things they don't even do in TV anymore."

      Bill, interesting comment, any examples? Do you cover this in your action book?

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      • #18
        Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

        The age of the white guy hero ended 20 years ago but nobody told the white guys. Write for the future, not the past.

        As soon as someone has the brains to give Emma Stone superpowers, this forum will be filled with questions about converting heroes to heroines.

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        • #19
          Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

          Do you cover this in your action book?

          Might even be in the free sample chapters on Amazon.

          - Bill (not Boll)
          Free Script Tips:
          http://www.scriptsecrets.net

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          • #20
            Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

            Originally posted by socalwriter1 View Post
            Was up in L.A. and met with some film people -- networking. Discussed my idea for next action script. The hero is a white guy, 30'ish.

            An actor/writer who has appeared in small parts in large action movies said that the script won't attract attention because white action guys are too generic.

            Then met with a successful film executive. Told him what the actor said. Asked the exec if he thought that making the action hero a heroine would attract more interest. Maybe even a minority woman, ala a Hispanic to attract crossover audiences.

            He said no because (1) not too many actresses to choose from who can play action hero types and (2) male audiences would not gravitate toward female leads (usually). But Colombiana covered its costs and made a little money and Salt made lots of money (but they had a superstar in A. Jolie).

            And the idea of a minority female lead would probably not work but he didn't elaborate and I didn't push.

            So who do you believe? Stick with the white guy?

            I've been following the old maxim of writing what I want to write with the characters I like BUT I don't want to bury my head in the sand either.
            White, male, late twenties to thirties, from everything I've heard, is definitely most castable, most preferable.

            It's the "generic" that's the problem -- but that's always going to be true because whoever the star is, or the star's agent or the star's manager, they're going to be looking at the part, even if it's some action movie or whatever, to see if there's anything in it that's going to stand out -- something that a lead star can play -- that makes it *not* be generic.

            NMS

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            • #21
              Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

              Just wanted to add that I understand your frustration and my response was one that was about the facts on the ground as pertain to the OPS's question. I wasn't endorsing the status quo

              Originally posted by emily blake View Post
              I was referring to this:



              Of course a male protagonist is an easier sell. A white protagonist is an easier sell. A Young protagonist is an easier sell. And yet - Red, Book of Eli, Resident Evil.

              OP's original protag is a white male; he should absolutely keep it that way. But if the script calls for a woman, write a woman. And don't apologize.

              I've just heard the same stuff over and over and I get really annoyed by it. I thought Salt make it all better, but noooooo. That doesn't count because Angelina. Resident Evil doesn't count because Adaptation. Underworld doesn't count because I don't know why Underworld doesn't count. But movies that bombed - that's all on the woman.

              If Salt had stayed as Edwin and it had bombed, would anyone have said it failed because of the male protagonist?

              PET PEEVE THREAD.

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              • #22
                Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                Originally posted by Geoff Alexander View Post
                Just wanted to add that I understand your frustration and my response was one that was about the facts on the ground as pertain to the OPS's question. I wasn't endorsing the status quo

                I get that. And it is my mission in life to change the status quo. I want threads like these to cease to exist.
                Chicks Who Script podcast

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                • #23
                  Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                  We do too. Our action comedy spec has a female protagonist and I love it.
                  writertypepeople.tumblr.com
                  twitter.com/susanlbridges
                  pendantaudio.com

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                  • #24
                    Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                    Have the hero start out Irish, ie, as white as possible. Then, gradually darken his skin from scene to scene through the course of the movie. By the last scene, he's as dark as Robert Downey in Tropic Thunder. Good times.
                    If you really like it you can have the rights
                    It could make a million for you overnight

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                    • #25
                      Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                      I have never read a script where they mention the character's race. Unless it's important to the story (Django Unchained, period pieces etc.).

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                      • #26
                        Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                        Originally posted by emily blake View Post
                        I get that. And it is my mission in life to change the status quo. I want threads like these to cease to exist.
                        I back that mission. Big time.
                        QUESTICLES -- It's about balls on a mission.

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                        • #27
                          Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                          As I mentioned in my earlier response, I tried having that female minority lead in an earlier script that garnered no interest but I may try again down the road.

                          Allow me to quickly follow up on Bill's "generic character/story" comment and his new action book. Bill, I have brought it (an excellent book at that) but can't find where you discuss those (no-no's) generic elements. Could you direct me please?

                          Thanks.

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                          • #28
                            Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                            Taken
                            Mission: Impossible
                            Bourne Identity

                            The list goes on. All white guys. You know your story the best, and if you say it wouldn't work with a female lead, then it probably won't. Go with your gut. A look at popular recent action movies will tell you that the first guy is incorrect.
                            ~* Kelsey *~

                            http://kelseytalksaboutmovies.blog.com/

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                            • #29
                              Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                              Originally posted by Rathmon View Post
                              I think the female-led Underworlds and Resident Evils have done well- and when it comes down to it, they are action movies- we're watching to see kick-butt battle scenes, right?
                              The perception is that those films are carried by the franchise, not the star.

                              This is totally unfair, but the world we live in right now (and I say this having had the star of one of those films attached to one of my films, and then the prodco pulling the emergency brake as the deal was going to paper because she wasn't worth enough).

                              It makes very little sense that Taylor Kitsch is worth more than Milla Jovavich. It makes even less sense that was the case 2-3 years ago. But it's the reality on the ground, or was when I was in meetings involving names like that. Between $10-$20m a lot more people will make the movie with him than with her, even if he's at the high end of that scale and she's at the low end.

                              Takens are white guy action movies, right?
                              Colombiana was an attempt to do Taken with a female lead. If it had hit a little better, Zoe Saldana would be capable of headlining more movies. I suspect it ultimately made money but only modestly - it is not perceived as a success.

                              Part of the problem I ran into when trying to get a $12-20m action film off the ground is that the women who are capable of doing these roles don't seem to want them. I don't want to say that's the cause of the problem, because the list of men we could have theoretically made the movie with was 30 names long, and the list of women was under ten.

                              But Angelina is booked the next three years solid. (She's always booked the next three years solid). And the word back from a lot of other names on the list (Charlize, Hillary Swank, Naomi Watts) was even before seeing the script, they weren't interested in that genre. The intersection of women who could do the project from a financial perspective and who would be interested in reading it was tiny - three or four names, tops.

                              Which sucks and creates a vicious cycle, where agents and managers steer clients away from writing kick-ass female-lead scripts, therefore there aren't the projects out there to talk the top talent into taking them, and so the projects don't get made, which feeds into manager's attitude that their clients shouldn't be writing them.

                              It seems like you have to hit the female star right at the perfect spot in her career, where she feels she can use an action flick as a jumping-off point to "bigger and better" things. That's what we're doing, in any event. (Cross your fingers for us). That same project is hinting at coming back to life with an actress who's a little lower on the totem pole, and my guess is we'll be making it for $5m rather than $12 or $20.

                              But who knows? Maybe Jennifer Lawrence will want to do something in that range once she's done with Hunger Games. Maybe Hillary Swank will feel like the quality of the drama roles she's being offered is fading and she needs to take some risks. Maybe Jennifer Garner will decide she wants to get back into the genre that made her a star.

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                              • #30
                                Re: White action hero too generic but female not bankable

                                Originally posted by emily blake View Post
                                I get that. And it is my mission in life to change the status quo. I want threads like these to cease to exist.

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