The Last 10 Days

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Crayon
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Originally posted by Bono View Post
    I give up Crayon. I don't know what your point is in all this other than to give me a headache and avoid posting actual work YOU ARE DOING in the 'What are you doing?" thread. Do you have a point? It just sounds like to me you're trying to insult my friend in some way. Or me. I'm trying to figure out the reasoning behind all this. I got nothing.

    You took advice that helped me (again it was just a throwaway line based off memory of something in an email not a term paper) and put way too much into what I said my friend told me in an email to help me. My friends ability as a writer has nothing to do with this at all.

    Basically the advice was "you can do it." Some writers around here dissect every single word of threads like it's some puzzle to solve. It was just encouraging words -- not a UFO video.

    If you ask me my writer friend is a much better writer than me. But it's the same advice I give writers who are worse than me when I read work that I think is good -- "Keep on writing."

    It doesn't matter what the other writer's talent is -- it's the point of telling me to finish work and not just think about writing. That simple.

    You beat the horse to death. And killed it. And cooked it. And ate it. Then asked -- why does the horse taste so delicious over and over -- he just does okay????!!!
    Bono - I don't have a point - I've simply highlighted a point that's within what you said your pro-writer friend told you. It's right there, in black and white, in your original post:

    Originally posted by Bono View Post
    A pro writer friend of mine told me once -- I'm not a better writer than you -- I just write more than you do and consistently.
    Do you really not see it? Your friend said that they write more than you do and consistently - and they also said that they are not a better writer than you - therefore, with basic logic, it can be concluded that: consistently writing significantly more than another writer will not necessarily make one a better writer than that other writer.

    It may not be the point that your friend wanted to make, and it may not be a point that you want to hear, but, nonetheless, there it is.

    I'm sorry if it upsets you, or you take offence from it, or you find it an unwanted distraction, but it's a somewhat remarkable point, not least in how it contradicts conventional wisdom, and therefore it's worth highlighting.

    However, it does not have to be believed.

    Leave a comment:


  • socalwriter1
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Re: Good sharing, Final Act! Inspires others to do the work.

    Final Act -- totally agree with Bono here, it is inspirational and:

    (1) What's your schedule for writing with your "day job?" Do you pass on details like eating and sleeping?

    (2) Have you sold/optioned anything yet? (I really, really hope so with all the effort you're putting in!)

    Leave a comment:


  • Bono
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    I was surprised no response from anyone in that orange log thread. I welcome it. It’s all good you’re all my buddies. We may fight but it’s not real. At least not to me.

    Today I got Wendy’s for first time in 2 months and almost finished my rewrite.

    Leave a comment:


  • DDoc
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    My theory is that he's salty about about your response in the Agent Orange thread. Simple as that, but what do I know? I don't care either way. I guess we needed more conflict to keep this story interesting.

    Spent yesterday and today doing a final polish on my latest and then submitted to Austin. Doubt it places but I feel ok. Time to read and watch movies.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bono
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Please let's keep this about writing and not real life. I'm trying to escape from the horrors on here.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bono
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    I give up Crayon. I don't know what your point is in all this other than to give me a headache and avoid posting actual work YOU ARE DOING in the 'What are you doing?" thread. Do you have a point? It just sounds like to me you're trying to insult my friend in some way. Or me. I'm trying to figure out the reasoning behind all this. I got nothing.

    You took advice that helped me (again it was just a throwaway line based off memory of something in an email not a term paper) and put way too much into what I said my friend told me in an email to help me. My friends ability as a writer has nothing to do with this at all.

    Basically the advice was "you can do it." Some writers around here dissect every single word of threads like it's some puzzle to solve. It was just encouraging words -- not a UFO video.

    If you ask me my writer friend is a much better writer than me. But it's the same advice I give writers who are worse than me when I read work that I think is good -- "Keep on writing."

    It doesn't matter what the other writer's talent is -- it's the point of telling me to finish work and not just think about writing. That simple.

    You beat the horse to death. And killed it. And cooked it. And ate it. Then asked -- why does the horse taste so delicious over and over -- he just does okay????!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • Crayon
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Originally posted by Bono View Post
    No he wasn't saying that. He was trying to give me advice to write more scripts, calculate less and get stuff done.

    You have to keep writing screenplays to get to a level where you can write screenplays that are at the pro level. At some point, yes I don't think you get better -- you just get to the point where you're capable of doing this.

    It's not like Script 100 is better than Script 99. It's more like you have to write 20 scripts and if you have talent and drive you learn how to write the first real one on Script 21... and 22... and 23....

    So he was saying -- I reached that level of writing ability. And no it's not like me and him are 100% equal - but that I joined the pro league in terms of talent in the skill of writing comedy screenplays. But what I wasn't doing was generating new material to try and sell. I was living in the past and bitching and making excuses. I can't sell talent -- I can only sell a spec. So I could even be a better comedy writer than the pro comedy writers -- but if they wrote 4 specs in 4 years and I wrote 0 -- guess who is going to have a better career? If they wrote 10 and I wrote 2... same thing...

    Does that make more sense?

    The same way an athlete works their way up to the pros.

    In other words -- he's saying I AM A "PRO-READY" WRITER. I just haven't sold a spec yet like he did. And it's luck -- but also he gave himself more chances to sell material but writing more specs than I did. Way more.

    Honestly, I got paid to write a script -- full WGA minimum -- the real deal through an agency. So I may even "technically" fit the definition of "pro" writer. But until I sell a spec of my own material -- I won't feel that way.

    I sort of play my minor accomplishments down -- but I should also have some confidence in my talent based on past achievements. We all should.
    Bono - Yes, I do see the advice that you say your pro-writer friend was trying give. It does indeed make sense. (To paraphrase it: Once a writer is writing at a professional level, having a greater amount of product to pitch will increase their chances of making a sale.)

    However, within your pro-writer friend's statement is also their belief that having written significantly more than you, and consistently so for however long, has not made them a 'better' writer than you. Perhaps, qualitatively, they have plateaued, but you may yet go higher?

    Leave a comment:


  • DDoc
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    ^The wife and I tried to watch Good Will Hunting last night but got distracted by all the riot/protest streams. Couldn't get back into it. Some absolutely batshit things going on. For the record, the video of Floyd dying was horrible. There's also clips going around of what I assume are fatalities from the past couple of nights. Some dude getting mangled under a semi, another getting beat to hell by a skateboard and people's feet, a guy trying to shoot people with a bow and then getting mobbed, a guy chasing people with a shotgun.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bono
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Good sharing, Final Act! Inspires others to do the work.

    And yes, please -- just put on music and shut off TV. Or at least put on movies or TV shows that are comfort food and you don't have to pay attention. Real news isn't going to help most of us. I can't write comedy with real life on fire in background. HGTV and FOOD NETWORK are still the best background noise channels.

    Leave a comment:


  • finalact4
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Unfortunately for my writing, I am working 10-11 hour days on a full-time job that, coupled with the COVID-19 virus running amuck, has negatively impacted my ability to turn out pages.

    I finished a draft of Tinder. I am tweaking the relationships between the main character and the main antagonist.

    I am reworking the first act of The Devil's Elbow. Story here that might help others. When I was repped, I wrote this script. I really dig it. It's got a high concept but is a crime noir thriller, not an easy sell to those who are always looking for specifically "likable" characters.

    It was not my manager's jam, (who was really interested in producing instead of managing me, I didn't realize that then), so I shelved it thinking that meant it just wasn't good enough. A writer friend of mine read it about a month or so ago, gave me notes and said if I rewrote the opening act and make some minor adjustments to the end, he felt it was a viable project. It's DOA meets Chinatown.

    There's a lesson in that. Write for the industry and write for yourself.

    So, I'm reworking the opening and doing a quick rewrite. Unfortunately, because of my work schedule I won't be able to have either of these ready for Austin, which I'm not entirely sold on anyway.

    I have two ideas I've been researching. A contained feature thriller along the lines of Gravity meets Solaris. A concept where the beginning is the end and the end is the beginning, with character revelations similar to Source Code and Oblivion.

    The other project is a dark (shocker) TV Series that has legs. Concept is commercial, just trying to determine if it will be more serialized for streamers or procedural for network. I need a strong pilot under my belt. I think I can achieve it with this concept.

    It's along the lines of Evil meets The Sinner meets Hannibal.

    Both of these projects are ambitious by way of structuring and character development. Kind of excited by them.

    Looks like the next 10 will be similar. A struggle to wade through, for sure, but not giving up. I might have to switch from CNN in the background to "thunder storms."

    Stay safe, everyone, and keep writing.
    FA4
    Last edited by finalact4; 05-31-2020, 09:41 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • lostfootage
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Originally posted by Bono View Post
    Art & fear is great. But yes, you learn by doing. You always hear how doctors go to school for 8 years and on their first day of work they finally start to learn how to be a doctor. Like almost anything you learn by doing - not reading about others doing it.

    I got 'calculate less" in my head from Brian Koppelman (Billions -- great resource on twitter -- six seconds vines).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mnc8o257Yzg don't watch all at once or you will go insane.
    I watched his Vines back when they were coming out. Only reason I had a Vine account. He's great. I listen to this podcast The Moment on the regular. This YouTube will be a good refresher -- in small doses.

    More doing less talking/analyzing for me!

    Leave a comment:


  • Bono
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Art & fear is great. But yes, you learn by doing. You always hear how doctors go to school for 8 years and on their first day of work they finally start to learn how to be a doctor. Like almost anything you learn by doing - not reading about others doing it.

    I got 'calculate less" in my head from Brian Koppelman (Billions -- great resource on twitter -- six seconds vines).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mnc8o257Yzg don't watch all at once or you will go insane.

    Leave a comment:


  • lostfootage
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Originally posted by Bono View Post
    No he wasn't saying that. He was trying to give me advice to write more scripts, calculate less and get stuff done.

    You have to keep writing screenplays to get to a level where you can write screenplays that are at the pro level. At some point, yes I don't think you get better -- you just get to the point where you're capable of doing this.

    It's not like Script 100 is better than Script 99. It's more like you have to write 20 scripts and if you have talent and drive you learn how to write the first real one on Script 21... and 22... and 23....

    So he was saying -- I reached that level of writing ability. And no it's not like me and him are 100% equal - but that I joined the pro league in terms of talent in the skill of writing comedy screenplays. But what I wasn't doing was generating new material to try and sell. I was living in the past and bitching and making excuses. I can't sell talent -- I can only sell a spec. So I could even be a better comedy writer than the pro comedy writers -- but if they wrote 4 specs in 4 years and I wrote 0 -- guess who is going to have a better career? If they wrote 10 and I wrote 2... same thing...

    Does that make more sense?

    The same way an athlete works their way up to the pros.

    In other words -- he's saying I AM A "PRO-READY" WRITER. I just haven't sold a spec yet like he did. And it's luck -- but also he gave himself more chances to sell material but writing more specs than I did. Way more.

    Honestly, I got paid to write a script -- full WGA minimum -- the real deal through an agency. So I may even "technically" fit the definition of "pro" writer. But until I sell a spec of my own material -- I won't feel that way.

    I sort of play my minor accomplishments down -- but I should also have some confidence in my talent based on past achievements. We all should.
    Good stuff. Thank you for posting. I get it. The past couple of years I've been way too constipated when it comes to writing, trying to get the four things I'm working on 'perfect' but you know where that goes. That's calculation.

    I've posted this before, and I'll keep posting it. (See quote below.) I know these yahoos on Twitter who brag about writing a script a month and at the end of the year they have like 12 mediocre scripts -- I've read some of them. But they'll have the last laugh, because churning through twelve sets of mistakes is way more valuable than churning through my four projects twelve times looking for perfection. After 3-4 drafts of something, if it's not coming together, there are probably bigger conceptual/design issues with the idea that no amount of execution will fix. Turd polishing is turd polishing.

    My goal is make 50 lb. of pots over the rest of 2020, not one perfect pot.

    "PERFECTION The ceramics teacher announced on opening day that he was dividing the class into two groups. All those on the left side of the studio, he said, would be graded solely on the quantity of work they produced, all those on the right solely on its quality. His procedure was simple: on the final day of class he would bring in his bathroom scales and weigh the work of the "quantity- group: fifty pounds of pots rated an "A-, forty pounds a "B-, and so on. Those being graded on "quality-, however, needed to produce only one pot - albeit a perfect one - to get an "A-. Well, came grading time and a curious fact emerged: the works of highest quality were all produced by the group being graded for quantity. It seems that while the "quantity- group was busily churning out piles of work-and learning from their mistakes - the "quality- group had sat theorizing about perfection, and in the end had little more to show for their efforts than grandiose theories and a pile of dead clay.-
    ― David Bayles, Art & Fear: Observations on the Perils (and Rewards) of Artmaking

    Leave a comment:


  • Bono
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    No he wasn't saying that. He was trying to give me advice to write more scripts, calculate less and get stuff done.

    You have to keep writing screenplays to get to a level where you can write screenplays that are at the pro level. At some point, yes I don't think you get better -- you just get to the point where you're capable of doing this.

    It's not like Script 100 is better than Script 99. It's more like you have to write 20 scripts and if you have talent and drive you learn how to write the first real one on Script 21... and 22... and 23....

    So he was saying -- I reached that level of writing ability. And no it's not like me and him are 100% equal - but that I joined the pro league in terms of talent in the skill of writing comedy screenplays. But what I wasn't doing was generating new material to try and sell. I was living in the past and bitching and making excuses. I can't sell talent -- I can only sell a spec. So I could even be a better comedy writer than the pro comedy writers -- but if they wrote 4 specs in 4 years and I wrote 0 -- guess who is going to have a better career? If they wrote 10 and I wrote 2... same thing...

    Does that make more sense?

    The same way an athlete works their way up to the pros.

    In other words -- he's saying I AM A "PRO-READY" WRITER. I just haven't sold a spec yet like he did. And it's luck -- but also he gave himself more chances to sell material but writing more specs than I did. Way more.

    Honestly, I got paid to write a script -- full WGA minimum -- the real deal through an agency. So I may even "technically" fit the definition of "pro" writer. But until I sell a spec of my own material -- I won't feel that way.

    I sort of play my minor accomplishments down -- but I should also have some confidence in my talent based on past achievements. We all should.

    Leave a comment:


  • Crayon
    replied
    Re: The Last 10 Days

    Originally posted by Bono View Post
    I answered it yesterday -- left it up for a few hours and you missed it!!! It was like a sneak preview of the answer that is so exciting I think most people already know what it is because they understood my point better than you did.
    As I said earlier, your "point" is perfectly clear and simple: always be writing. But surely you were surprised to learn from your pro-writer friend that doing that hadn't actually made them a better writer than someone who isn't?

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X