The New Black List

[figment]

Re: The New Black List

So I just went on the website and "registering" involves listing your educational background, what state you live in, twitter and facebook accounts -- which I assume will all be used as contact info.

The only problem is that I see this being a huge, huge disadvantage for writers who are not based in California. Or who aren't hugely into social media. Or who didn't go to film school, or anywhere remotely ivy league, or college at all.

It seems like any one of those things can equal being dismissed immediately in the minds of a potential reader -- readers that would've otherwise liked the script and considered it a viable project for their company. This writer isn't in L.A? Why bother? He doesn't have a facebook/twitter account? He's out of the loop, why bother? Etc...

Thoughts on this?

[FranklinLeonard]

Re: The New Black List

Okay. I suppose I'm just playing a little devil's advocate in light of this new revelation. I'm not really referring to any concern about actual professionals. But, basically, you're saying any schmoe who pays a mere $25, the integrity of which you can't possibly know, has access to everyone's personal info, LL, ratings, etc. I don't see that this serves any good purpose. One of the things that appealed to me about the sound of this was my erroneous perception of a certain level of privacy in general, compared to other sites like Amazon, and those other peer review sites. But this is actually not that different. I guess it's just me who thinks it could be problematic. Thank you again for answering so many questions. Carry on my wayward son.

I'd encourage you to go back and read the entirety of this comment thread as much of this has been addressed.

Here's the information breakdown:

The only information that "any schmoe who pays a mere $25" would have is the title, author name, genre, and logline of other scripts on the site. They would not have the ability to read, rate, comment on, otherwise affect or gain access to these scripts.

They would, if the author of the script so chose by making it public, have access to view the script's average rating and the evaluations of our readers. These are numerical evaluations along with brief comments on the script's strengths and weaknesses and the reader's assessment of its commercial prospects. We consider it a highly abbreviated version of the coverage a script would receive when submitted anywhere else in the industry.

Industry professionals have access to the same information, including the average score and evaluations if the author chose to make them public. They also have the ability to download the script (which includes the author's contact information) and rate it. These ratings inform both the member's own recommendations, our ability to recommend the script to other users, and our top lists of scripts, but they are only visible if the author chooses to make them so.

[cshel]

Re: The New Black List

Industry professional members have access to unrepped writers complete scripts and the loglines of the other titles that are included in our database along with their rep contact information and development/production status. Yes, that includes some professional screenwriters. Many of those professional screenwriters are also producers, directors, etc.

Unrepped writers do not have access to complete scripts. They do however have access to titles, authors, loglines, etc. of the unrepped and the repped titles in our database.

I suspect you're suggesting that professional writers will use the site to find ideas that they could then steal. Obviously, that behavior is explicitly outlawed by our terms of service, and members would be immediately expelled in the event that they were engaged in it. We, moreover, encourage all of our writers to register their scripts with the Guild.

Our community has historically been one that behaves with extraordinary high levels of integrity, and it is curated now to continue that high standard. Ultimately, each writer must make her own decision about how much they fear that threat (which for the record exists with any submission), and the extent to which they're willing to risk it for the opportunity that this initiative presents.

It is my personal belief that that risk is extraordinarily low in the context of our site, and we make every effort to keep it that way.

Okay. I suppose I'm just playing a little devil's advocate in light of this new revelation. I'm not really referring to any concern about actual professionals. But, basically, you're saying any schmoe who pays a mere $25, the integrity of which you can't possibly know, has access to everyone's personal info, LL, ratings, etc. I don't see that this serves any good purpose. One of the things that appealed to me about the sound of this was my erroneous perception of a certain level of privacy in general, compared to other sites like Amazon, and those other peer review sites. But this is actually not that different. I guess it's just me who thinks it could be problematic. Thank you again for answering so many questions. Carry on my wayward son.

[Jules]

Re: The New Black List

forgive me if it's already been mentioned, but when could a person expect their script evaluation, it feels like the first month of script listing could be a waste of money if the script hasn't been evaluated pretty early on in that time.

[FranklinLeonard]

Re: The New Black List

Wait, what?! The repped and unrepped writers have access to everyone else's scripts? Or you mean just the loglines? Either way, I don't see what purpose that serves, if the goal is to get reps and prods to look at your stuff. You really don't see how some writers may think that's problematic?

Industry professional members have access to unrepped writers complete scripts and the loglines of the other titles that are included in our database along with their rep contact information and development/production status. Yes, that includes some professional screenwriters. Many of those professional screenwriters are also producers, directors, etc.

Unrepped writers do not have access to complete scripts. They do however have access to titles, authors, loglines, etc. of the unrepped and the repped titles in our database.

I suspect you're suggesting that professional writers will use the site to find ideas that they could then steal. Obviously, that behavior is explicitly outlawed by our terms of service, and members would be immediately expelled in the event that they were engaged in it. We, moreover, encourage all of our writers to register their scripts with the Guild.

Our community has historically been one that behaves with extraordinary high levels of integrity, and it is curated now to continue that high standard. Ultimately, each writer must make her own decision about how much they fear that threat (which for the record exists with any submission), and the extent to which they're willing to risk it for the opportunity that this initiative presents.

It is my personal belief that that risk is extraordinarily low in the context of our site, and we make every effort to keep it that way.

[cshel]

Re: The New Black List

Yes, they would have access to the unrepped writers script. Just as unrepped writers have access to the loglines of both the repped and unrepped writers.

Could you elaborate on why you think that would be problematic?

Wait, what?! The repped and unrepped writers have access to everyone else's scripts? Or you mean just the loglines? Either way, I don't see what purpose that serves, if the goal is to get reps and prods to look at your stuff. You really don't see how some writers may think that's problematic?

[Gillyflower Cooms]

Re: The New Black List

Yes, they would have access to the unrepped writers script. Just as unrepped writers have access to the loglines of both the repped and unrepped writers.

Could you elaborate on why you think that would be problematic?

That's easy...even I can answer that... Liability!

[FranklinLeonard]

Re: The New Black List

Sorry, just when I think I'm done...

I get why you would want to let repped writers join and post for free, as a courtesy, and why you would encourage that, to make sure there are some good, professional scripts on your site. That's great. But does that mean they have access to read all of the unrepped writers scripts who have paid to join? Could that be problematic?

Yes, they would have access to the unrepped writers script. Just as unrepped writers have access to the loglines of both the repped and unrepped writers.

Could you elaborate on why you think that would be problematic?

[cshel]

Re: The New Black List

Sorry, just when I think I'm done...

I get why you would want to let repped writers join and post for free, as a courtesy, and why you would encourage that, to make sure there are some good, professional scripts on your site. That's great. But does that mean they have access to read all of the unrepped writers scripts who have paid to join? Could that be problematic?

[Twofingeredtypist]

Re: The New Black List

For the record, I appreciate the soccer reference. I will state publicly and in any forum that it remains a dream of mine to make the great soccer film. Maybe some day.

Mine too. They screwed-up the George Best film completely. There's a GREAT film to be made about him.

Going off-topic, but nice way to subscribe to a fascinating thread...

[FranklinLeonard]

Re: The New Black List

Franklin -

Thanks for answering all of these zillions of questions.

My only suggestion would be to let people, if they prefer, pay the $50 to get just the first evaluation beforehand, and then decide if they want to pay the $25 to post their script, based on that evaluation. People may still want to join and post without an evaluation. Or they may want to post even if the first evaluation isn't that great, and then pay for another after they join. But I think having that option makes it a little bit more fair for the writer, as well as helping weed out some really bad scripts, which is actually much better for your site's reputation. No? It's a win-win!

The suggestion is appreciated, and it's definitely something we'll consider. Needless to say, our current focus is surviving this initial maelstrom and educating people, as much as we can, about exactly what we're doing, how we're doing it, and why we're doing it in that way.

If it makes it easier, feel free to think of our currently pricing model as follows:

$75 for the first evaluation
$25 to host the script going forward on a month by month basis
$50 for each additional evaluation

Even at that seemingly higher price point, you're getting a lot of good for your money.

[FranklinLeonard]

Re: The New Black List

I notice on your website that you ask for writers with reps to sign up as "industry professionals." Do you consider this service only for unrepped writers, or something which could feasibly benefit repped writers as well? Obviously if you have reps, you shouldn't need this kind of thing...but hypothetically speaking (say if it's something your reps never wanted to go out with, but a personal passion project that you think might generate interest from someone)?

We grant access to the industry professional site to represented writers as a courtesy and acknowledgement that what the Black List does most directly affects them. Moreover, we want to provide tools to those writers to take a more active role in their writing careers in concert with the representatives who work with and for them. Also, writers can also be directors and producers and we want to facilitate that work as well.

I do think there is a value in professional writers uploading their scripts to the site. In the coming weeks, we will be adjusting the functionality of the site to accommodate just that (whereas now there are two separate memberships, one that allows unrepped writers to pay to upload their scripts and one that doesn't allow for that.)

If you'd like to do so before we make that an integrated part of our site, feel free to email us at [email protected], and our CTO Dino Sijamic will help you out.

[cshel]

Re: The New Black List

Franklin -

Thanks for answering all of these zillions of questions.

My only suggestion would be to let people, if they prefer, pay the $50 to get just the first evaluation beforehand, and then decide if they want to pay the $25 to post their script, based on that evaluation. People may still want to join and post without an evaluation. Or they may want to post even if the first evaluation isn't that great, and then pay for another after they join. But I think having that option makes it a little bit more fair for the writer, as well as helping weed out some really bad scripts, which is actually much better for your site's reputation. No? It's a win-win!

[CthulhuRises]

Re: The New Black List

I notice on your website that you ask for writers with reps to sign up as "industry professionals." Do you consider this service only for unrepped writers, or something which could feasibly benefit repped writers as well? Obviously if you have reps, you shouldn't need this kind of thing...but hypothetically speaking (say if it's something your reps never wanted to go out with, but a personal passion project that you think might generate interest from someone)?

[FranklinLeonard]

Re: The New Black List

Not sure that's true. An actor suddenly expresses an interest in basket weaving, and asks his production company to find him erotic thrillers set in the world of crafts and hobbies. There's a sudden rush on soccer scripts when the USA wins the World Cup.

On second thoughts, maybe you're right.

For the record, I appreciate the soccer reference. I will state publicly and in any forum that it remains a dream of mine to make the great soccer film. Maybe some day.

The point is moot honestly since the contact info is part of the file that the reader downloads. It does make the argument for keeping the script up though, as preferences in material do change and if a script isn't on the site, it's impossible for a producer, director, actor, whomever to find it if they didn't have it already.