Re: The New Black List
I understand what he's saying about PULP FICTION. If someone today wrote that logline, and I don't even know what that logline would be. Execs wouldn't read the script. There are some movies that are great, but don't have great loglines. HEAT is the perfect example. I know producers and people who say HEAT isn't a high concept movie and would have trouble getting made today.
The New Black List
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by halloweenjak View PostNo. The point is there might be the next "Pulp Fiction" out there, and no logline would convey its excellence.
The point is if "JAws" and "Deep Blue Sea" were pitched cold, by no names, with no bestseller and no info other than a logline, "Deep Blue Sea" might seem more attractive to a producer these days.
More sharks.
But let's not make this nasty , Lowell.
Giving Tarantino money to do PULP FICTION after the success of RESERVOIR DOGS was pretty much a no-brainer. It was made for less than $10 million, most of which probably went to Bruce Willis. And he wasn't even the "star" of the flick. John Travolta's career was dead, and no one knew who the fvck Samuel Jackson was.
But it's still got some trailer-worthy moments, and it was still going to make back its money even without the advance word of mouth from Cannes(?).
HH
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Re: The New Black List
hj:
Yes, all movies are sold by advertising the stars, not the concept of the movie.
It's why Bruce Willis starring in "Breakfast of Champions" in 1999 made the exact same amount of money that Bruce Willis starring in "The Sixth Sense" in 1999 did.
(Enough thread hijacking from me.)
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by JeffLowell View PostIf you can't sell your script to a studio in thirty seconds, how is the studio supposed to sell the movie to an audience in thirty seconds?
whenever I write "sexy ladies" and "big explosions!" in my logline, it just doesn't have the same effect
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by Geoff Alexander View PostThat's really not the way movies are sold.
You're wrong.
I'm the audience. They're sold to me, and the millions of us out there.
You're talking about insider decisions.
I know what Hollywood does to get me to go to a movie.
You don't have to be an insider to know that. Okay?
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by halloweenjak View PostThe way they always have.
Famous actors.
If "Pulp fiction" was pitched by a no name, give me a logline that would convey the excellence of that script.
Without mentioning the stars.
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Re: The New Black List
I'm having trouble articulating what I mean. I guess it's low concept versus high concept, and what's typically sure-fire commercial. Two unknown writers query their scripts. The typical first gatekeeper readers are young men. You query Juno and The Terminator. Or Little Miss Sunshine and Predator. Or The Kids Are Alright and Source Code. What gets read requests. What became commercially and critically successful based on great word of mouth. Which was sold based on concept. Which was sold based on execution. Which benefits more from BL3 with good reviews versus typical cold-querying with no review. Why don't I just shut-up.
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by JeffLowell View PostOh, you've written the next Pulp Fiction. Well then, carry on.
The point is if "JAws" and "Deep Blue Sea" were pitched cold, by no names, with no bestseller and no info other than a logline, "Deep Blue Sea" might seem more attractive to a producer these days.
More sharks.
But let's not make this nasty , Lowell.
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Re: The New Black List
Oh, you've written the next Pulp Fiction. Well then, carry on.
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by halloweenjak View PostThe way they always have.
Famous actors.
If "Pulp fiction" was pitched by a no name, give me a logline that would convey the excellence of that script.
Without mentioning the stars.
RUSSELL: All right, tell me, tell me about the stories. What kind of stories?
GEORGE: Oh, no. No stories.
RUSSELL: No stories? So, what is it?
GEORGE: What'd you do today?
RUSSELL: I got up and came to work.
GEORGE: There's a show. That's a show.
RUSSELL: How is that a show?
JERRY: Well, uh, maybe something happens on the way to work.
GEORGE: No, no, no. Nothing happens.
JERRY: Well, something happens.
RUSSELL: Well, why am I watching it?
GEORGE: Because it's on TV.
RUSSELL: Not yet.
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by JeffLowell View PostIf you can't sell your script to a studio in thirty seconds, how is the studio supposed to sell the movie to an audience in thirty seconds?
The way they always have.
Famous actors.
If "Pulp fiction" was pitched by a no name, give me a logline that would convey the excellence of that script.
Without mentioning the stars.
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Re: The New Black List
If you can't sell your script to a studio in thirty seconds, how is the studio supposed to sell the movie to an audience in thirty seconds?
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by ATB View PostI don't see how anyone can say, "My logline sucks but the script is great." Because you're essentially saying the idea behind your story sucks. And if so, who wants to read/watch a story with a shitty idea?
It's an idea that will inevitably draw comparisons to stories which have dealt with a similar hook.
It will spark pigeonholing, for people who like to pigeonhole as a matter of expediency.
I stand by my story, but can't convey it in a single sentence.
I think loglines are a shortcut to thinking, and reading.
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by ATB View PostI don't know, man. If your logline sucks (and by that, I mean your concept sucks), it's probably a good indicator of whether that script is worth your time or not. Because if the shitty idea behind that script is well-executed, it doesn't really matter. It's still a shitty idea.
But if there's a good idea behind it, then it worth seeing whether or not the script is executed well.
I don't see how anyone can say, "My logline sucks but the script is great." Because you're essentially saying the idea behind your story sucks. And if so, who wants to read/watch a story with a shitty idea?
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Re: The New Black List
Originally posted by cshel View PostObviously, if a logline is badly written, meandering, illogical, typo filled, etc., one would probably rightly assume that the script is a mess as well.
But the point I was making with Ham's example (sorry Ham), was that he queried for a long time with no read requests, until a lucky fluke happened, and he finally got someone to read his script, and they loved it. And it was not because his logline was badly written, per se, but probably because no matter how much lipstick he put on the pig, it still sounded like a pig in his LL - an uncommercial sounding script from an unknown writer. But the fact of the matter was - his execution of the concept was so good that it made it a viable project.
I think that that could be the case for many good scripts, that are commercial on some level, but that have loglines that don't spark read requests, even though they may be well executed.
In that respect, I think this BL3 could be a really great venue, especially for those writers who don't have a logline that sounds like a high-concept, big commercial, sure thing. If they get well-reviewed, maybe they can start getting reads finally, that they couldn't get just by cold-querying. And then the script can stand or fall based on its own merits, and not at the mercy of just its logline.
I just wish they would let you get the first review, before paying the fee to join, and not let all of the unrepped writers see every other writer's stuff. Among other things, it messes up the stats. But the important part is whether or not the professionals looking for scripts will really use this method, read some scripts, and participate in reviews. I'm really rooting for it to be a success, because I think it could be a good thing for writers and pros alike.
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