Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

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  • MrZero
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by holly View Post
    it is utterly shocking how few female screenwriters there are. its not indy 500. its WRITING. the act that females statistically - for whatever that is worth - EXCEL.
    It seems to be a common belief that women are "more verbal"--and therefore better writers--than men, but I don't see any real-world evidence for this, especially at the higher levels of achievement. For example, more boys than girls achieve a perfect score on the verbal portion of the SAT test.

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  • Centurio
    Member

  • Centurio
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by Steven R View Post

    Good at your job, nobody cares what's between your legs.
    Must be a really cool mythical place you live in. I've been fairly successful in a few different endeavors and industries and have yet to see one that is male-centric. Pretty large disparity between men and women in almost all walks of life.

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  • seminarian
    User

  • seminarian
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by Steven R View Post
    I'd like to be a Chinese fighter pilot. That isn't real likely to happen either, in large part because forced diversity is anethma to ability.

    Good at your job, nobody cares what's between your legs.
    Maybe I missed it - did someone here advocate some sort of quota system, or affirmative action?

    Just a guess here - you're too busy writing to worry about how many women or "minorities" are represented in Hollywood, let alone script contests. Fair enough, keep writing, focus on your work. Maybe I should focus more myself.

    But outside our scripts and dreams lies an entire world, with bigger questions to ponder. And it's these questions that some of the writers here, and maybe even some women working in Hollywood, have to live with from an entirely different perspective from yours and mine. And I believe it's ok, maybe even healthy, to sometimes step back and look at the bigger picture.

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  • Steven R
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by seminarian View Post
    What some of us would like to see is more ability AND more diversity.
    I'd like to be a Chinese fighter pilot. That isn't real likely to happen either, in large part because forced diversity is anethma to ability.

    Good at your job, nobody cares what's between your legs.

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  • Steven R
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by JoJo View Post
    Wow. You seriously missed the point.

    Women write about the things that are relevant to women, and men write about the things that are relevant to men. Why does Hollywood buy more scripts geared toward men (which are written by men)?

    It's not about who's more talented - men or women - it's about the marketplace.
    This is two seperate issues. Movies are marketed toward the young male demographic because they are the ones who spend the money. You want more chick flicks, Gyno-Americans gots to spend more money.

    A good writer isn't stuck in one point of view. A good writer can write a man's viewpoint, a woman's viewpoint, a boy's, a girl's, a dog's, a car's, a fish's, a gay jewish black dudes. I'm a man. If I can't write a convincing woman character's point of view, I'm not a good writer, full stop. You're a woman. If you can write a scripted geared toward's a man's interest, you're not a good writer. Sorry, but there you go.

    Why aren't there more women and minority writers? Don't know and don't care. It's hard work, it's a constricting format, it's not interesting to most people, the collaboration end of it doesn't pay off ego-centrically. There was a study years ago about why there aren't more female chess players and the results boiled down to women thought chess was a waste of time. It doesn't mean chess is inherantly misogynistic, it just means fewer women want in. Make of that what you will, but it's probably the same thing. Movies are fun to watch and less fun to work on.

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  • JoJo
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by emily blake View Post
    This is a really great point.
    +2

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  • JoJo
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by Steven R View Post
    Just go do your thing and don't worry if there's nobody around you who looks like you. God knowns there aren't that many screenwriters as it is.
    Wow. You seriously missed the point.

    Women write about the things that are relevant to women, and men write about the things that are relevant to men. Why does Hollywood buy more scripts geared toward men (which are written by men)?

    It's not about who's more talented - men or women - it's about the marketplace.

    Leave a comment:

  • emily blake
    Member

  • emily blake
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by holly View Post
    its that the vast majority of films that get made are geared TO MEN. the statistic - that is a self fulfilling prophesy - is that on "date night" women will go see a movie that a man wants to see, but a man wont see a movie a woman wants to see.
    This is a really great point.

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  • seminarian
    User

  • seminarian
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by Steven R View Post
    Why? Does sex organs make a difference in writing? Or race or religion or any other arbitrary classification? What is it we want, ability or diversity? Do we want the best writers, period, or do we settle for the best writers in a category? If you're one of those minority classification writers, do you really want to break into Hollywood on the back of "well, you weren't the best, but we needed more [CATEGORY] so you'll do?" or do you want "that was some good writing"?

    If we want more women writers, then more women need to write at that level. If there aren't that many, so what? There aren't many women race car drivers and there aren't many male knitters. That doesn't mean a woman can't win the Indy 500 or a man can't knit a nice sweater. Just go do your thing and don't worry if there's nobody around you who looks like you. God knowns there aren't that many screenwriters as it is.
    What some of us would like to see is more ability AND more diversity.

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  • holly
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    it is utterly shocking how few female screenwriters there are. its not indy 500. its WRITING. the act that females statistically - for whatever that is worth - EXCEL.

    the issue is not how many women go in - and i cannot belive someone said, "its hard and women are doing other things." its not about women at all. its about the industry.

    its that the vast majority of films that get made are geared TO MEN. the statistic - that is a self fulfilling prophesy - is that on "date night" women will go see a movie that a man wants to see, but a man wont see a movie a woman wants to see.

    double that for the teenage population. its changing but we had a decade and a half of most huge movies geared toward teenage boys.

    the second level of myth is that even if you're writing for men, women can't do that. but thats at least a conversation.

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  • Steven R
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by seminarian View Post
    I dunno - I'd like to see more female
    Why? Does sex organs make a difference in writing? Or race or religion or any other arbitrary classification? What is it we want, ability or diversity? Do we want the best writers, period, or do we settle for the best writers in a category? If you're one of those minority classification writers, do you really want to break into Hollywood on the back of "well, you weren't the best, but we needed more [CATEGORY] so you'll do?" or do you want "that was some good writing"?

    If we want more women writers, then more women need to write at that level. If there aren't that many, so what? There aren't many women race car drivers and there aren't many male knitters. That doesn't mean a woman can't win the Indy 500 or a man can't knit a nice sweater. Just go do your thing and don't worry if there's nobody around you who looks like you. God knowns there aren't that many screenwriters as it is.

    Leave a comment:

  • seminarian
    User

  • seminarian
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by Steven R View Post
    Because it's hard. Because it's time consuming and they have families. Because they have better things to do. Because estrogen rots their brains. Because neither Melpomene nor Thalia ever wanted to grace people with vaginas. Because the moon is tidally locked with the Earth. Because Wendy's changed their french fry recipe.

    Who cares?

    Not every activity known to man has to be numerically equal. I suppose if someone wants to get indignant because their particualr group is underrepresented in a particular activity, that's their right, but at the end of the day identity politics isn't going to make a script worth a crap. Either one has talent or one doesn't and no one in Hollywood is going to drop $100,000,000 on a film just to say that they bought a script from a gay black albino Wiccan midget transsexual with psoriasis and three kids.
    I dunno - I'd like to see more female screenwriters and directors. I love me some Sofia Coppola, for example. For me, it's like restaurants. If every restaurant in town served classic American fare I'd never get to eat sushi. Or Thai. But hey, what do I know?

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  • Steven R
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by JoJo View Post
    Why don't more women enter? It has to with why don't more women write screenplays? That's what I'm questioning.

    I'm sure the percentage of entries written by women reflects the percentage of women writing screenplays....

    Women are 51% of the population, yet only 30% of the screenwriting population.

    Why is that?
    Because it's hard. Because it's time consuming and they have families. Because they have better things to do. Because estrogen rots their brains. Because neither Melpomene nor Thalia ever wanted to grace people with vaginas. Because the moon is tidally locked with the Earth. Because Wendy's changed their french fry recipe.

    Who cares?

    Not every activity known to man has to be numerically equal. I suppose if someone wants to get indignant because their particualr group is underrepresented in a particular activity, that's their right, but at the end of the day identity politics isn't going to make a script worth a crap. Either one has talent or one doesn't and no one in Hollywood is going to drop $100,000,000 on a film just to say that they bought a script from a gay black albino Wiccan midget transsexual with psoriasis and three kids.

    Leave a comment:

  • gregbeal
    Member

  • gregbeal
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    Originally posted by AlexNoa View Post
    Greg, has the number of finalists/fellows selected ever changed since the contest's inception?
    Finalists have ranged from 8 to 11.

    The rules have stated up to five fellowships will be awarded since at least 1989. In 1986, the first year, three fellowships were awarded. In 1987, the administrators more or less had two competitions - one open to college students from multiple states and the other open to residents of Texas - as a first expansion step. Five fellowships were awarded to the college students and two to the residents of Texas. (I wasn't around during those years so don't know exactly how it worked and whether the 1987 competitions were in fact separate.)

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  • Presto
    replied
    Re: Nicholl Fellowship 2012 open for submissions

    "You've heard a literary agent specifically say that they are looking for male clients?"

    Originally posted by versed View Post
    Yes!! Several times, from top lit agents.
    That's a disgrace. We're in 2012, not the 1960's.

    Leave a comment:

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