A question about grammar

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  • A question about grammar

    I can't seem to find a definitive answer to this, so...

    When you combine an adjective and a noun, or an adjective and a verb, you must include a hyphen.

    E.G.:

    I think spiders are eight-legged freaks.

    The loud rock concert was headache-inducing.

    The close-knit community were stunned by the murder.

    However, when you combine an adverb with a verb or adjective, does the same rule apply? I've seen it written with and without the hyphen.

    The unfortunately-titled film had no chance at the box office.

    He regards the fogged-up windows of the vehicle.

    Any help would be appreciated.

  • #2
    Before a noun, use a hyphen only if each descriptive word on its own, when applied to the noun, does not make sense. If the adjective is used after the noun, no hyphen is needed.

    The loud rock concert was headache inducing. (no hyphen needed)

    If your descriptive word before the noun ends in "ly" no hyphen is needed.

    The unfortunately titled film had no chance at the box office. (no hyphen needed)

    Your other examples use the hyphen correctly.

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    • #3
      A question about grammar

      If you want a good book, check out William W Watts, "An American Rhetoric".

      Comment


      • #4
        grammar

        Grammar is important. Use the grammar and spell check in Microsoft Word (if you use MS/word ) and are in any doubt. Work toward a 75% reading ease. That should do it.

        Or go to:
        http://webster.commnet.edu/grammar/combining_skills.htm
        for more help with verbs, nouns etc.

        Comment


        • #5
          These are really conventions of spelling, not grammar per se, and there is room for some personal preference, as long as the meaning is clear and the mind does not stop on a phrase because lack of punctuation has raised doubt.

          Personally, I would use the hyphenated form in:

          The noise of the band was headache-inducing.

          And again in:

          The view was awe-inspiring.

          In recent years there has been a trend away from hyphens in compound adjectives, especially in the post-verb position, as in the examples above. But I was educated in the old days, and I prefer the older way of handling these issues.

          In some instances, though, a compound adjective used as a predicate adjective (after the verb) clearly does not need hyphenation, as in this simple past participle plus adverb:

          The windows were fogged up.

          In contrast to:

          The fogged-up windows prevented good visibility.

          As for the '-ly adverb plus hyphen plus past participle', that seems to be a British thing, and has never been the recommended form in America. For example:

          The rapidly-completed project was a failure.

          The word 'rapidly' is always an adverb and the meaning is clear without the hyphen.

          Unfortunately, Americans seem to have picked up THAT particular usage from British practice, and apply it rigidly, though they ignore most other hyphenation.

          You might try to find a university-type grammar book. Also very useful is the Chicago Manual of Style, which addresses issues of spelling.

          Comment


          • #6
            RE

            Thanks for everybody's advice.


            "The unfortunately titled film had no chance at the box office. (no hyphen needed)"


            This one is still bugging me, Keith. Without the hyphen, couldn't it mean the film had no chance at the box office because someone unfortunately decided to slap a title on it, as apposed to releasing it untitled? With the hyphen, isn't it clearer that the sentence is referring to an unfortunate title like "Tears of the Sun" (an action/war movie aimed at men).

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: RE

              Dunksta:

              I agree with ComicBent that there's room for personal preference on this issue.

              Yes, I see your point about that particular sentence. The wording is convoluted to conclude that it was unfortunate to title the film. I would not use a hyphen.

              From pg. 117 of (I believe) Elements of Style:
              If one of the two words ends in ly, you almost never need a hyphen. That's a radically different haircut. It gives you an entirely new look.

              Good luck brother.

              Comment


              • #8
                Use the grammar and spell check in Microsoft Word (if you use MS/word ) and are in any doubt. Work toward a 75% reading ease.
                Spell check, yes. Grammar check, no. Reading ease, yes (although I tend to look more at grade level; 4th is about right).

                The grammar check in Word is abominable. If you can't do better than that on your own, please spare the world and pick a career that doesn't involve putting words together into sentences.

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                • #9
                  Re: RE

                  Dunksta, I understand the fine distinction that you are making, and why it bothers you. And you are correct that putting a hyphen in would clarify things, though I think that the intended meaning is quite clear.

                  The distinction that you are making is as follows. Consider the different meanings here, according to stress:

                  * The unfortunately titled film ...

                  * The unfortunately titled film ...

                  But the real problem is in the phrasing itself. Rhetorically, avoidance of past particles is usually a good idea, because you can find a more effective way to express yourself. Past participles, loaded down with a modifying adverb, only put a heavy burden on a sentence. Try something like this:

                  * The unfortunate title of the film meant that it had no chance at the box office.

                  See how much punchier and cleaner that is?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Ravenslock, I heartily concur.

                    Word's alleged "grammar check" is not only inadequate, it is actually insidious. It was, I remain convinced, programmed by a bitter, malicious former English major turned horribly wrong. It will take a perfectly-constructed sentence (note hyphen) and tell you to change it to something that is, frankly, an abomination.

                    Heed it not!

                    TZ

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                    • #11
                      It will take a perfectly-constructed sentence (note hyphen) and tell you to change it ...
                      Yes, I did note the hyphen, even before your reference to it.

                      Occasionally something that we say here might actually influence people. Consequently, just for purely educational purposes, let me point out that in a properly edited American publication (note the absence of the hyphen), your hyphen would not be retained.

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                      • #12
                        Actually, in retrospect, I concur that no hyphen is necessary in "perfectly constructed sentence." My inclination to hyphenate modifiers stems from the fact that really, it's BOTH words together that are modifying the noun. But I do think it's a case-by-case call.

                        (I stand by my opinion of Word's "grammar check," however.)

                        And I do think "unfortunately-titled" has a clearer meaning if you hyphenate it. But I wouldn't fight a duel over it or anything...

                        ;- )

                        Cheers,

                        TZ

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