Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

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  • #91
    Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

    I agree with this assessment.

    Comment


    • #92
      Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

      Originally posted by haroldhecuba View Post
      I agree with this assessment.

      I can see why you agree Harold. And I don't fault you or the writer of that piece. Not at all. It's a cogent argument.

      But the scene was written from a male persepctive. The scene is rationalized from a male perspective.

      And from this female's perspective it still sucks.
      Advice from writer, Kelly Sue DeConnick. "Try this: if you can replace your female character with a sexy lamp and the story still basically works, maybe you need another draft.-

      Comment


      • #93
        Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

        It's a date rape gag. It might be a qualified date rape gag thanks to that line Hill is very careful about giving her so we know she's conscious, but it's still a date rape gag. and sc111 is right, it isn't funny. But then I found nothing in this movie particularly funny, which features numerous routines just as tasteless, which is why I'm not settling on any one failed gag in particular.
        Frosties are just Cornflakes for people who can't face reality.

        Comment


        • #94
          Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

          Originally posted by sc111 View Post
          No - I haven't seen it.
          Well then there is no value in your discussion on the topic. It's just like when Howard Stern went on and on for weeks blasting Mel Gibson for THE PASSION's Jew-bashing without having seen a frame of the movie.

          Of course this is a public forum and you can do as you please, but let's not pretend any of us should discuss the artistic validity of something that we didn't even bother seeing.

          And seriously, if there was ever a double-standard...

          "Believe it or not -- some really stupid men get ideas from movies."

          I think your agenda - whatever it is - has begun to outpace your common sense. I'd ask you to come down off your high horse, but I'm afraid it's so far off the ground that you'd injure yourself in the fall.

          Comment


          • #95
            Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

            I saw Observe and Report with my wife (do we know how to have fun or what?... unfortunately the WWE wasn't in town)

            I asked her opinion as, at least between the two of us, she's the sensible one (of course she did marry me so maybe not)... anyway, for what it's worth she said she loved the movie, hated the scene, and 'no' she did not think it was date rape in any way.
            Seven years dungeon --- no trials!

            Comment


            • #96
              Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

              Originally posted by goosetown View Post
              Well then there is no value in your discussion on the topic. It's just like when Howard Stern went on and on for weeks blasting Mel Gibson for THE PASSION's Jew-bashing without having seen a frame of the movie.

              Of course this is a public forum and you can do as you please, but let's not pretend any of us should discuss the artistic validity of something that we didn't even bother seeing.

              And seriously, if there was ever a double-standard...

              "Believe it or not -- some really stupid men get ideas from movies."

              I think your agenda - whatever it is - has begun to outpace your common sense. I'd ask you to come down off your high horse, but I'm afraid it's so far off the ground that you'd injure yourself in the fall.

              My agenda in this thread isn't veiled in any way, goose.

              It's clear Cycstorm saw the film, see his/her post above, quote:

              "It's a date rape gag. It might be a qualified date rape gag thanks to that line Hill is very careful about giving her so we know she's conscious, but it's still a date rape gag."

              Here's my agenda -- I don't like scenes which gratutiously denigrate women for a laugh. And I don't care if the female actress was given a line to "make all better."

              In a court of law, a woman is deemed incapable of giving consent to sex if she's crazy-stoned on drugs. It's called diminished capacity. It doesn't make the rape charge go away. Yet still -- rape is still the most under-reported felony. And date rape -- even more so. Gee - I wonder why.

              BTW when I said this: "Believe it or not -- some really stupid men get ideas from movies."

              It's based in fact. There are more than a few cases where men -- albeit young and usually very stupid men -- have acted out crimes they see in movies.

              I'm sorry the statement upset you, goose. I wasn't including you in that group.
              Advice from writer, Kelly Sue DeConnick. "Try this: if you can replace your female character with a sexy lamp and the story still basically works, maybe you need another draft.-

              Comment


              • #97
                Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                Straw Dogs.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                  Originally posted by sc111 View Post
                  My agenda in this thread isn't veiled in any way, goose.

                  It's clear Cycstorm saw the film, see his/her post above, quote:

                  "It's a date rape gag. It might be a qualified date rape gag thanks to that line Hill is very careful about giving her so we know she's conscious, but it's still a date rape gag."

                  Here's my agenda -- I don't like scenes which gratutiously denigrate women for a laugh. And I don't care if the female actress was given a line to "make all better."

                  In a court of law, a woman is deemed incapable of giving consent to sex if she's crazy-stoned on drugs. It's called diminished capacity. It doesn't make the rape charge go away. Yet still -- rape is still the most under-reported felony. And date rape -- even more so. Gee - I wonder why.

                  BTW when I said this: "Believe it or not -- some really stupid men get ideas from movies."

                  It's based in fact. There are more than a few cases where men -- albeit young and usually very stupid men -- have acted out crimes they see in movies.

                  I'm sorry the statement upset you, goose. I wasn't including you in that group.
                  Man...so much to do here!

                  First of all, I don't care what Cycstorm's opinion of the scene was in regards to your opinion. If you haven't seen the movie, you have no frame of reference. Therefore, you can offer your opinion, but it's worth nothing. If/when you see the movie, your opinion will be worth something. I'm not making these rules; rhetoric and critical analysis are defined by such. But just offering a series of snide comments based on someone else's experience is kind of sad in a forum where people who actually love movies see them BEFORE forming an opinion.

                  And forming an opinion on something based on hearsay? Well that's bias, exactly the crap thinking you go around preaching against here. Obviously, though, that's not your only foray into duplicity.

                  As for your specific comments on rape/date rape and their connection to this film, I will address them in my own little review to follow, even though it's mostly counterproductive to even respond to someone who's speaking without knowledge. Suffice to say there have been and will continue to be people who have a differing opinion to mine, and it's for them that I'll promote my POV.

                  Lastly...

                  "It's based in fact. There are more than a few cases where men -- albeit young and usually very stupid men -- have acted out crimes they see in movies."

                  The statement "upset" me not because you're wrong - you're not totally, though you know all the ways in which you're pandering - but because you're at least as sexist as those you (often questionably) choose to rail against. The statement "upset" me because you imply that only males can see a movie and be prodded into acting out what they see onscreen. The statement "upset" me because, once again, you make a point that paints you as a walking contradiction.

                  I obviously don't have to explain to you that males who "act out" what they see in movies are a preposterous minority not only within the whole of the moviegoing public, but also in their gender and age group. I don't think it will come as a shock that psychologists across the board agree that there is something deviant within the impossibly small percentage of those who do act out that almost assuredly would have caused them to act out regardless of what films they saw. It's not because they're young, or because they're male. It's because they have unchecked psychological problems, which is staggeringly easy for you to gloss over, apparently, in your misguided gender war.

                  I'm a (relatively) young male who's seen probably the worst in violence/exploitation in film. And I've seen a LOT of it. As yet, so far as I know, I've not raped, killed or unjustly hurt anyone. Why? Because I'm not f*cked up. And neither are almost all of the people who have seen OBSERVE AND REPORT so far. And even most of the ones who ARE f*cked up haven't harmed anyone. So your little facts and figures about rape, while certainly critical in many other forums, mean absolute jack here. You're writing stuff just to write stuff.

                  Moreover...it's obvious by now that girls act out the things they see in movies, right? Like the group of young girls in Japan who formed a suicide club after seeing it in a movie? Or the girl in the Midwest who tortured a classmate over Facebook after seeing it in a movie? That's obvious, right? But they're special exceptions because their similarly-chromosomed ancestors faced a tough uphill battle to gain unilateral equality, right?

                  It's become trite, sc. And for my part, I think it's time I stop contributing to this little charade. You're either posting the things you're posting because you've lost your common sense or you're intent on being a contrarian for the sake of attention. And in the battle between Sarah Palin and Ann Coulter, I can't win. Though I'm sure you will lose no sleep at night, I'm done debating you.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                    So yes, I saw OBSERVE AND REPORT tonight.

                    Did I enjoy this movie? There were some big laughs, but...no. Did I like this movie? Well...no. But was I entertained by this movie? If you take the absolute value of what it means to be "entertained", then yes. But I don't think I'd see it again, and I don't think I'll be buying the DVD. Glad I saw it. No real reason to go back.

                    I'd heard people talk about how disturbing this movie is, how dark it goes, but I really wasn't prepared for quite how it far it wanders in both of those directions.

                    That said, I think the acting here is vastly superior to the writing. The script swings often too drastically between the funny material and the dark material, and the story too often plays itself as grounded and then goes flying off into moments of outright absurdity - especially the last ten minutes of the movie. It was the same kind of problem I had with PINEAPPLE EXPRESS.

                    But what I really appreciated - and maybe that's the best word to describe how I felt about this movie - was the way it decided to showcase a character who's too often swept under the rug, passed off as inconsequential. There are a lot of people out there LIKE Seth Rogen's Ronnie, people who are just kind of empty-headed, people who don't get it, people who have to build up their legend in their own mind because they never bothered to create one in real life. But then there are people who ARE Ronnie - fewer of them abound, but they're there - who never get a shot. Who have been stuck behind the eight ball their entire lives. The kind of people who never ended up on one side of Nature vs. Nurture. We can tell from very early on in this movie that it's always been Nature + Nurture vs. Ronnie. And it has MESSED him up.

                    Some people will call the details in this story "crutches" - Ronnie's upbringing, his alcoholic mother, his bi-polar disorder, his lack of common sense - but they're all parts of the whole, nothing more to blame than anything else. And it's clear that Jody Hill was trying to say one thing here: some people just. Get. Sh*t on. This is an examination of one of those people.

                    And it's ALL of this thats spills into the "rape" sequence, which couldn't be less rape-based. If you haven't seen the movie this will be spoilery, so you might want to look away:

                    First of all, Ronnie is patently in love with the idea of Ana Faris's character Brandy. She's pretty in an ideal way, but she is a trainwreck - perhaps a worse person than Ronnie. Still, Ronnie sees her as pristine. Because of the way she acts towards him in the scene previous to the sex, he thinks she's finally into him and that he's got the greenlight. And he wants to take it not because he wants to take it, but because it's the culmination of all he's envisioned for the two of them.

                    In fact, when they cut to Ronnie thrusting, it seems clear that Brandy was coherent at one point...because he quickly looks down and realizes she's passed out. He immediately stops - and that's saying a lot, because you KNOW this is a guy who never gets laid, might never have gotten laid before. And that's when Brandy says her line. And it's funny not because it's hilarious or clever, but because it's mostly shocking and grotesque. The scene gets laughs not because it's comical, but because that's your initial reaction - "What the HELL just happened?" It's played for shock value and to mess with the audience's perception of the characters, not for giggles. And as we're taught that rape is about perverted power and control and because Ronnie shows genuine care for Brandy before, during and after the scene, I can't figure out how anyone can see it as rape. Awful decision making and delusion, absolutely. But not rape.

                    End spoilers.

                    That scene isn't even the most troubling in the movie, and I bet it won't even register with most people who haven't read the overreactions to it, but most people ARE going to miss what it's trying to say about the characters. And there is some GREAT character work here. Michael Pena is out-the-door hilarious. Ronnie's mother is the perfect, honest depiction of a co-dependent drunk, and her last scene with Ronnie is both unfortunately funny and gut-wrenchingly sad.

                    I think it's totally worth seeing if you like character pieces, because I think mostly you're going to get an honest look at an ignored American archetype. On the same token, I can understand fully why someone would walk away from this movie unenthused or just flat-out disgusted. So the lines drawn in the sand over this one make sense, at least to me.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                      40 MILLION?

                      Er.. just 11.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                        Originally posted by goosetown View Post
                        Man...so much to do here!

                        First of all, I don't care what Cycstorm's opinion of the scene was in regards to your opinion. If you haven't seen the movie, you have no frame of reference. Therefore, you can offer your opinion, but it's worth nothing. If/when you see the movie, your opinion will be worth something. I'm not making these rules; rhetoric and critical analysis are defined by such. But just offering a series of snide comments based on someone else's experience is kind of sad in a forum where people who actually love movies see them BEFORE forming an opinion.

                        And forming an opinion on something based on hearsay? Well that's bias, exactly the crap thinking you go around preaching against here. Obviously, though, that's not your only foray into duplicity.

                        As for your specific comments on rape/date rape and their connection to this film, I will address them in my own little review to follow, even though it's mostly counterproductive to even respond to someone who's speaking without knowledge. Suffice to say there have been and will continue to be people who have a differing opinion to mine, and it's for them that I'll promote my POV.

                        Lastly...

                        "It's based in fact. There are more than a few cases where men -- albeit young and usually very stupid men -- have acted out crimes they see in movies."

                        The statement "upset" me not because you're wrong - you're not totally, though you know all the ways in which you're pandering - but because you're at least as sexist as those you (often questionably) choose to rail against. The statement "upset" me because you imply that only males can see a movie and be prodded into acting out what they see onscreen. The statement "upset" me because, once again, you make a point that paints you as a walking contradiction.

                        I obviously don't have to explain to you that males who "act out" what they see in movies are a preposterous minority not only within the whole of the moviegoing public, but also in their gender and age group. I don't think it will come as a shock that psychologists across the board agree that there is something deviant within the impossibly small percentage of those who do act out that almost assuredly would have caused them to act out regardless of what films they saw. It's not because they're young, or because they're male. It's because they have unchecked psychological problems, which is staggeringly easy for you to gloss over, apparently, in your misguided gender war.

                        I'm a (relatively) young male who's seen probably the worst in violence/exploitation in film. And I've seen a LOT of it. As yet, so far as I know, I've not raped, killed or unjustly hurt anyone. Why? Because I'm not f*cked up. And neither are almost all of the people who have seen OBSERVE AND REPORT so far. And even most of the ones who ARE f*cked up haven't harmed anyone. So your little facts and figures about rape, while certainly critical in many other forums, mean absolute jack here. You're writing stuff just to write stuff.

                        Moreover...it's obvious by now that girls act out the things they see in movies, right? Like the group of young girls in Japan who formed a suicide club after seeing it in a movie? Or the girl in the Midwest who tortured a classmate over Facebook after seeing it in a movie? That's obvious, right? But they're special exceptions because their similarly-chromosomed ancestors faced a tough uphill battle to gain unilateral equality, right?

                        It's become trite, sc. And for my part, I think it's time I stop contributing to this little charade. You're either posting the things you're posting because you've lost your common sense or you're intent on being a contrarian for the sake of attention. And in the battle between Sarah Palin and Ann Coulter, I can't win. Though I'm sure you will lose no sleep at night, I'm done debating you.
                        I wasn't debating you. I wasn't being contrarian for attention.

                        I was stating an opinion based on film reviews discussing a particular scene.

                        And though I've offended you by breaking one of your rules of conduct, and dared to make a comment without seeing the film - I hate to be the one to tell you, you're not king of the world.

                        Newsflash -- people who don;t agree with you are not contrarians. They simply don't agree with you.

                        Considering your pompous diatribe above rife with overkill, I'd say you're grandstanding for some reason. Some agenda. Known to only you.

                        The following is to correct your inaccuracies:

                        Your claims about the conclusions of psychologists across the board -- wrong.

                        I've studied the topic. This world of non-stop imagery - in film, online, on TV, video games -- psychologists haven't even tackled the tip of the iceberg. No one really knows how it impacts people who are immersed in these images 10-12 hours a day.

                        And though you go on to identify crimes committed by young people who got their violent ideas from these images -- you brush it off as insignificant. But it's not insignificant -- because the incidences are increasing in number.

                        I'm glad to hear you're done debating me. Perhaps now I can share an opinion without getting jumped on by you.
                        Advice from writer, Kelly Sue DeConnick. "Try this: if you can replace your female character with a sexy lamp and the story still basically works, maybe you need another draft.-

                        Comment


                        • Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                          Every movie should be just an hour and a half to two hours of people being nice to one another.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                            Personally, I think one mall cop movie is good enough for me in a 365 day period. Maybe a DvD rental next year.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                              Originally posted by qualitycontrol View Post
                              Every movie should be just an hour and a half to two hours of people being nice to one another.
                              Correction:

                              Every movie should be just an hour and a half to two hours of white males being nice to women, minorities, children and animals. But there I go again, putting a white male in the lead role...

                              Comment


                              • Re: Seth Rogen, Observe and Report: 4O MILLION THIS WEEKEND

                                Originally posted by Scripted77 View Post
                                Correction:

                                Every movie should be just an hour and a half to two hours of white males being nice to women, minorities, children and animals. But there I go again, putting a white male in the lead role...
                                Corny.

                                Comment

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