Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

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  • Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

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    Dogs and Cats, living together! Mass Hysteria!
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    Ok...that's far enough....

    Having never seen a Batman Movie in the theaters except #2+#3 and enjoying TAS, I have to say they did a great job with this. Even the guys in the men's room declared it the best @#[email protected]' Batman movie ever. If you hated all the Batman movies and liked Batman TAS, this movie is for you.

    My screenwriting partner (40s) who went in, tried to bet me 20$ it would suck, declared 90% of it was perfect, the 10% involving the device that dried up all the water felt like it was taken out of Superman plot.

    If they keep the villians straight, Scarecrow and Ra's were perfect. Keep the actors, writers and director the same, I think the next Batman movie will do better than this one.

    The only thing I think it missed was a few money shots like Bats standing over his oppentents when the drug shipment ended.

    It was a good two hour movie, and, I want one of those cars...
    R.K. Bentley
    My Blog, My Design Studio
    "Little hand says it's time to rock an' roll." - Hot Fuzz.

  • #2
    Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

    Christopher Nolan rocks!

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    • #3
      Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

      Very good movie. Incredible cast, Michael Caine and Morgan Freeman brought a great deal to their roles.

      I hope Nolan decides that he's not finished with the story and signs on for the sequel.
      "I dub thee: Sir Non Sequitur." - sc111

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

        Fantastic film.

        My only nitpicks are that Nolan can't seem to direct action, and the final villainous plot to destroy gotham by super boiling the water seemed Hammy.

        I'm hoping the sequel is even better. Although it's hard to wrap my head around the idea of a batman sequel being any better than this work of art.

        MW

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

          Originally posted by Mysterio Who?
          the final villainous plot to destroy gotham by super boiling the water seemed Hammy.
          You guys realize that Batman is based on comic books right?

          All kidding aside, I think the love interest was the weakest part of the film. The character was made just for the film and I don't feel like it worked well. If they wanted to work in a female they could have used Ra's Al Ghul's daughter.

          However, all in all -- a great movie.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

            I loved it, great story, solid execution, and wonderful acting by Bale.

            This is the best superhero movie made bar none.
            Faster would be better! ~ Capt. Malcolm Reynolds

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            • #7
              Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

              My unsolicited thoughts. No real spoilers. Should be safe for all to read....

              ***

              I hated this movie. Truly hated it. $6.75 of my money is gone, as is two and a half hours of my life. I'll never get either back, and I'm bitter about it. Sure, there were some good things about the film: Christian Bale IS Batman...he and Morgan Freeman have some good scenes together...Michael Caine brings some nice humor to the role as Alfred...Gary Oldman is passable as Jim Gordon...the visual look is nice.

              But everything else was sh!t. Let's start with the story. Laughably bad. I mean just plain stupid. This is something I expect from the '60s TV show, not a $150 million summer tentpole that's supposed to revitalize this beloved franchise from the depths Joel Schumacher cast it with BATMAN FOREVER and (shudder) BATMAN & ROBIN. Warner Bros. had eight years to work on this script and this is the best they got? For shame. David Goyer needs to give the comic adaptations a rest, 'cause his magic touch has gone.

              That, and there were probably two plot threads too many....

              Action. Memo to Chris Nolan and editor: just because Batman's punches are supposed to be a blur to his foes doesn't mean I want the scene to play out as such. Let's try a wide angle lense on occasion. Maybe set the tripod back a few feet more, eh?

              Villians: Burton got the best of the lot. Scarecrow? Wimp with a mask and some gas. Ra's Al Ghul? Some kung fu dude in the snowy mountains...or is he??? Either way, they both stunk.

              Katie Holmes: good thing she's banging Tom Cruise cause the gal ain't got much talent.

              Flashbacks: ab-so-lutely HORRIBLE. It's like Exposition Central a lot of the time...and not even well done exposition. The scene on the subway with Bruce and his parents is truly awful. The mugging has no real punch to it. Burton and company did it 10x better. And was I the only one disturbed by the way Thomas Wayne was looking at his son when he was playing with the stethoscope? For some reason I was getting a creepy Michael Jackson-esque vibe....

              Length: cut the first act by ten minutes. It drags. And I'm not just saying that cause there was no Batman in it, as some people have complained. It needed some tightening.

              Music: according to IMDB, FOUR -- yes, FOUR -- people scored this thing. Hans Zimmer and James Newtown Howard, with additional music by Mel Wesson and Ramin Djawadi. Some talented people, I imagine...so why the hell is this facet SO BLAND?? I don't even think there was a traditional "theme" to be heard. If there was, it surely wasn't memorable. It's near impossible to trump Danny Elfman's genius work on the first two films, but this was just a travesty.

              Mix: maybe it was the print I saw, but the sound mix was atrocious. FX too loud, dialogue too soft. I missed a line about every twenty minutes.

              Legacy: it's just plain ol' disrespectful to fans of Tim Burton that Warner's is ostensibly hitting the "purge" button with the franchise and trying to wipe everyone's memory. (Wait 'til you see the closing moments; you'll know what I mean.)

              If WAR OF THE WORLDS is half as bad, I'm leading an angry mob down to L.A....

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                Holy hell man,
                this movie rocked, how can you say it sucked?

                "...just because Batman's punches are supposed to be a blur to his foes doesn't mean I want the scene to play out as such. Let's try a wide angle lense on occasion. Maybe set the tripod back a few feet more, eh?"

                Okay, I'll admit, the camera was very close on the scenes, but when Batman attacks it's always under the cover of darkness. He is the Dark Knight, y'know.

                "Villians: Burton got the best of the lot. Scarecrow? Wimp with a mask and some gas. Ra's Al Ghul? Some kung fu dude in the snowy mountains...or is he??? Either way, they both stunk."

                First of all, Burton just happened to have chosen the original line-up in the Batman series: Joker, Catwoman, Penguin. You know, the same guys in the 1960s movie with Cesar Romero playing the Joker. Yeah he may have gotten the most evil of the villans, but not the best. When I was a kid, the Scarecrow always gave me the creeps, it was because of Fear. Which of course is his weapon. I think the movie did him justice. Ra's Al Ghud was extremely important because he is where Bruce learns all of his training.

                "Katie Holmes: good thing she's banging Tom Cruise cause the gal ain't got much talent."

                I'm actually going to agree with you. Holmes is not the best actress in the world, and Nolan could have probably found a better Rachel Dawes. I even heard that Natalie Portman was offered the part.

                "Flashbacks: ab-so-lutely HORRIBLE...and not even well done exposition..."

                Personally, I liked them. This was the first movie in which you actually meet Bruce's parents. In 1, you only see when the are mowed down by the killer. There isn't a lot of them in 2. #3 had horrible flashbacks, which was the same for 4. I felt 5 had very strong flashbacks, establishing the connection between Bruce and his parents, which pays off in the trial scene when he wants to avenge their death.

                "Length: cut the first act by ten minutes. It drags. And I'm not just saying that cause there was no Batman in it, as some people have complained. It needed some tightening."

                No way does this movie drag on. Watching the first half-hour or so I just wanted the movie to go on and never stop. I was sucked in. I like how they introduce Bruce Wayne instead of Batman. Understanding the backstory of Bruce Wayne is fundamental to understanding Batman and his motivation for justice.

                I'll ignore the music/mix/sound effects because I didn't pay attention to them at all, I was busy watching the screen not the speakers.

                "...it's just plain ol' disrespectful to fans of Tim Burton that Warner's is ostensibly hitting the "purge" button with the franchise and trying to wipe everyone's memory..."

                Once again, no way. Although once you see the final scene, I don't think they are trying to erase our memory, more like say: "He you, since you saw this movie, go buy 1-4."

                Now what I'm looking forward to is #6...oh yeah, they will sooo make a sequel. If you think all the bad guys have been used (Joker, Catwoman, Penguin, Riddler, Two-Face, Poison Ivy, Freeze, Bane, Scarecrow, Ra's Al Ghud), just check out some of these guys:
                CLAYFACE: A name for a number of criminals, with the best known being Matt Hagen, a criminal with the power to instantly change his shape and appearance to any form he wants.

                FIREFLY: Garfield Lynns, an orphan who became a pyromaniac and has developed a fireproof suit and flamethrower to further pursue his 'hobby'.

                Professor HUGO STRANGE: An insane psychologist who knows Batman's secret identity and lusts to take the identity for himself.

                HUSH: Neurosurgeon Dr. Thomas Elliot, a childhood friend of Bruce's. Hush's name originates from a nursery rhyme, however, he truly lives up to it; He uses manipulation and guile instead of any noisy "signatures." An example of this guile is how he led Batman to believe that he was the second Robin, Jason Todd, previously believed to have been murdered by the Joker.

                KILLER CROC: Waylon Jones, a former croc wrestler turned into a criminal deformed by mutation into a humongous humanoid lizard. He has low intelligence but great strength, as well as animal abilities, such as heightened senses and the ability to hold his breath underwater for long periods of time. Croc controlled all illegal activities in Gotham before Bane beat him and took control of his business. Currently hiding in the New Orleans swamp under bizarre protection of the Swamp Thing

                MAD HATTER: A research scientist named Jervis Tetch who is completely smitten with the works of Lewis Carroll. He specializes in neuroscience and developed hardware that can control the brain and induce hypnotic states.

                MAN-BAT: A scientist, Kirk Langstrom is cursed to periodically turn into an animalistic humanoid bat, and often causes much trouble for Batman despite also being an ally.

                VENTRILIOQUIST: A ventrilioquist whose puppet is a gangster called Scarface. It has been implied that the Ventriolquist merely suffers from multiple personally disorder, but also that his puppet, which was created from gallows wood, is possessed by a demon calling itself Scarface.

                ZSASZ: Victor Zsasz, a serial killer who keeps a tally of his victims by cutting new scars into his body with his trademark knife.

                (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman)

                Austen.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                  Some of the villains you mention can stay buried in the pages of a comic book.

                  I'm sure we'll get to see some of these guys on the big screen. But from what I've heard they'll be having the Joker and Two face in the sequels.

                  I just hope they follow parts of the Killing Joke storyline and show the Jokers fall from being a good husband willing to do anything for his family. to the psychotic clown he is now.

                  Touch upon Gordon's love affair with Detective Sarah Essen.

                  Introduce Harvey Dent as an Attorney who has a passion for the criminal justice system, and a close friendship with batman like they had in Year one.

                  Perhaps if the fans don't get too angry, we can have Sarah Essen get paralyzed by the Joker instead of Jim Gordon's daughter Barbara.

                  They could also introduce Harlequin, Joker's psychiatrist who inevitably falls in love with the Joker, and tries to get his attention by helping him.

                  From what Goyer has said the third film would deal with Joker's trial and how he permanently scars Harvey dent's face and turns him into two face.

                  We'll see how it develops

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                    Originally posted by Austen
                    Holy hell man,
                    this movie rocked, how can you say it sucked?
                    Um...because it DID suck....

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                      I enjoyed it.

                      They shouldn't do VENTRILIOQUIST in my opinion. He's a major villian, but he's just never struck me as menacing.

                      MAD HATTER deserves to be done. He has to be done!! Mind control is too cool to pass up as far as villians go.

                      PROF. HUGO STRANGE could be done, and he should be. He made multiple appearances in the earliest of Detective Comics.

                      FIREFLY would be vicious. FX team would have a field day with the fight scenes between he and Batman in the air.

                      CLAYFACE above all should be done. He's an actor-Matt Hagen-who revitalizes his career and even over-achieves using his mud face mold. Irony comes into play when he is overdosed and can't be Matt Hagen anymore. Its great, he can only imitate people. He's basically a big name actor turned into a molding monster.
                      sigpic

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                        I also thought it was poo. I was excited to see it (went to the first midnight screening in Toronto), but what a disappointment.

                        SPOILERS!!!!!!


                        -- Bale is good.

                        -- Holmes is terrible.

                        -- Oldman is so good I didn't even realize it was him.

                        -- The script has HUGE structure problems. It's boring, boring, boring.

                        Not once did I ask myself, "What's gonna happen next?", which in my book I should be asking EVERY scene. it was boresville. There was no sense of peril on ANYONE'S part. None. Zip. No one that died did I care about or "wonder" if they were gonna die and no one that lived did I think was going to be toast. The story wasn't predictable but the plot was.

                        -- The fight scenes are almost all awful. A bunch of figures, all in black, shot mostly in close up. WTF is going on?! When they're done wide, they're fine, but that's rare. I felt like I was watching the dance numbers in Dancer in the Dark. Don't these people understand that with no concept of the space these people are moving in we cannot appreciate what's happening?

                        -- Though the batmobile is cool looking, the chase is extremely boring and not for a second did I buy that all of those structures could support a 5000 pound vehicle.

                        Text book chase scene. Today I read that they were trying to go for a "French Connection" esque chase. Not even close. You have a character who swears not to kill anyone (does this several times) and then he ensures that many cops are gonna get squashed by his car? And then some character throws in a "thank god no one was hurt" line to rationalize it? Please.

                        -- Whoever played the Scarecrow was a good actor and reminded me of a young James Spader (in appearance) but I didn't buy that this guy who looks like he is 22 years old is a shrink.

                        -- The characters (all of them) had ZERO depth. The story has no basement whatsoever and there is no reason to rewatch it unless you get off on the effects.

                        What the hell was the pt of Rutger Hauer's character? What a waste. Just seemed like a totally uninteresting "fake" red herring (meaning I get the impression the filmmakers expected us to think the head of the corp was evil or in on it but it was so ineptly handled we never fell for it). People (myself included) literally laughed out loud when he fired Fox. The scene was ridiculous.

                        The villains were ridiculous--not a one of the multiple bad guys seemed as powerful, let alone more so, than Batman. They lacked charisma across the board and I didn't care about their actions.

                        -- It felt (truly) like it was 4 hours long (I think it's really closer to 2.5). I almost walked out (out of boredom) 3 times; the story felt like it hit the "half way point" 3 hours after it started--I couldn't believe it.

                        -- They did a great job of avoiding expositional dialogue for the first 30 minutes (I was so impressed, truly!) and then it seemed no two characters could talk to each other without really talking to the audience. *sigh*

                        -- Why oh why did they not spend more of the 180 million dollar budget on a good script?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                          Ventriloquist? Clayface? Firefly? geezus what kind of comics nerd do you have to be to have heard of any of these villains?

                          Whatever happened to King Tut and The Siren?

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                          • #14
                            Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                            lol

                            What about Louie the Lilac?
                            sigpic

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                            • #15
                              Re: Batman Begins..... (spoilers)

                              Dobbs, my man: welcome to the minority. Good to have you around.

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